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  • July 05, 2025, 06:14:50 PM

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91
Open Forum / Jetco Sabre.
« Last post by Paul Smith on July 02, 2025, 02:32:31 PM »
I assembled and few one of these in my teenage days.  It flew OK but I never won anything with it.  In those days there were over ten Junior entries in  contests and completing the pattern was not enough.  Plus at least five of them were future Nats & WC winners.

I eventually wrecked it trying to improve its (and my) performance.

With only 450 squares and a thin airfoil, it was not winner vs the Nobler and other better designs.
92
Open Forum / Re: Jetco "Sabre Stunt". anyone besides me ever build one?
« Last post by Bud Shipley on July 02, 2025, 01:06:44 PM »
I built a Jetco Sabre Jet and a Nobler.  Wrecked them both and put the two together with the stab and wing placement same as the Nobler but it looked more like the Sabre.  Point is it was the best flying stunt ship ever!  Power was a K&B 35 Green head. 
Won 2nd in Sr Stunt at the 1958 Midwestern States Championships in Kokomo Ind.  1st was the defending Nat Champ and I cant remember his name-flew an Ares. 
That hybrid Sabre would take the wind like no other and I always did better at contests where it was real windy.  I bought a kit a few years ago to try to replicate it but Im just too old to do it now.  Guess Ill sell the kit!
93
Open Forum / Re: Propeller load changes with diameter
« Last post by Brett Buck on July 02, 2025, 12:49:43 PM »
Brett,  I am using 5s 4200mah batteries and 6s 3000mah. They both weigh 13 oz with all the fittings.  I get full patterns on 6s 2800s on a 3520 motor which is about the largest common motor for a full size PA.

I am having the same struggle finding the right prop with my electric twin.  The pitch efficiency of electrics is so different.  They seem to prefer higher pitch in the 5-6" range.

   5-6" is efficient enough at stunt speeds. Trying to run it lower, it has to run correspondingly faster, and thus less efficient, but has better inherent speed stability.  That's why if someone tried to run the same prop I run with the Jett 61, you would need a 6 amp-hour or more, not a 3 amp-hour battery like yours.

    You are not at a speed stabilty disadvantage using 5" of pitch on an electric because it has a governor that attempts to restore the RPM no matter what the load variation might be. IC doesn't do that, at best, the load causes the RPM to sag and the pipe and other effects prevent it from sagging too far.

     Brett
94
Classifieds / Assortment of Control Line Items for sale
« Last post by Robert Zambelli on July 02, 2025, 12:42:21 PM »
For what it’s worth, I recently inherited a rather large assortment of engines and engine parts, both new and used.
LOTS of other assorted items.
I have no use for them and all monies collected will go to the Border Collie rescue center.
Prices will range from FREE to very reasonable.
Buyers pay shipping costs.
I will be going through them soon.
I will also be listing kit(s), handles, props, electric stuff, MANY PLANS, etc.
Some of the plans: Thunderbird, Nobler, Vector, Chief (both versions), some Randy Smith designs, Sky Writer (Chinese design), Twister (regular and Fancher mod), Legacy, Atom, Airon, Argus and many more. Some free and others very reasonably priced.
I will post a complete list as soon as I inventory them.
Plans will be shipped rolled (EXPENSIVE!) or folded (much cheaper).
Contact me with your needs.

Some Items for sale now:
Two NEW hard point handles, one new in pack, never assembled, one assembled but never used. $15.00 each.
Four LARGE EZ Just handles, new and used. $5.00 each or all four for $15.00.
Shark 15 kit by Walter Umland, box has been opened but nothing ever removed. $25.00
Plans for Fancher modified Twister, $6.00. Folded or rolled (see above).
Plans for stock Twister, $6.00                       "      "     "       "      "     
Plans for SV 11 $6.00                                  "      "     "       "      "
Plans for Chinese Sky Dancer  $6.00             "      "     "       "      "
Plans for Vector $6.00                                  "      "     "       "      "
Plans for Dumas Chief $6.00                         "      "     "       "      "
Plans for Legacy $6.00                                 "      "     "       "      "
Mufflers for OS FP and LA engines, mostly new. - Contact me for needs and prices.
Mufflers for Super Tiger engines, mostly new. - Contact me for needs and prices.
Brand new OPS 60 RC, new in box. With a HEMI head and C/L venturi, this is an excellent and very powerful stunt engine. Offers invited.
Brushless electric motor and speed control - contact me for information.

This is just a very small portion of what I have to offer.
As soon as I return home (July 7), I will start to list many more items.

Bob Z.
95
Open Forum / Re: Propeller load changes with diameter
« Last post by Ken Culbertson on July 02, 2025, 12:35:49 PM »
.... instead of a maybe 20-25 ounce battery. Electric makes up for it in different ways, and so it doesn't require you to use inefficient props for performance reasons.

     Brett
Brett,  I am using 5s 4200mah batteries and 6s 3000mah. They both weigh 13 oz with all the fittings.  I get full patterns on 6s 2800s on a 3520 motor which is about the largest common motor for a full size PA.

I am having the same struggle finding the right prop with my electric twin.  The pitch efficiency of electrics is so different.  They seem to prefer higher pitch in the 5-6" range.  I hope someone can explain how to select standard props for electrics.  I can't afford $100+ for a pair of counter rotating quality CF props.

Ken
96
Open Forum / Re: Vast facebook stunt pics.
« Last post by Dick Byron on July 02, 2025, 11:58:16 AM »
Thanks Doc.
97
Open Forum / Re: Propeller load changes with diameter
« Last post by Brett Buck on July 02, 2025, 10:06:26 AM »
But as Brett mentined, you must remember it is static or pitch speed difference at the same RPM, in flight difference on C/L stunter which will fly the same air speed with any of those props (that larger will have smaller RPM), is much smaller as both needs to deliver the same power, so difference is only in prop efficiency. Best example is comparation of our 11x5 and 12x5 flat back props. There is very small difference (less than 10%) in consumption between both, reason is 12x5 has slightly better efficiency and they both deliver the same cruise power. That measurable difference comes from better pull in corners where the prop is loaded close to static thrust, which is better with 12x5 than with 12x5 and therefore it takes more power. That is why I wrote that note in that other thread that the speed stability in fugures is in relation to used power. That means better speed stability (at constant RPM) is payd by higher consumption.

      And to finish the thought, pitch is an even bigger driver for efficiency. As far as I know, nobody it using anything like a typical tuned pipe prop (like mine - Eather 12.5-3.9 flat back 3-blade) on an electric - because it is so inefficient for most of the flight you would require a HUGE battery. This is where the low energy density of electric is precluding some options, I am doing it with 6.5 ounces of fuel, instead of a maybe 20-25 ounce battery. Electric makes up for it in different ways, and so it doesn't require you to use inefficient props for performance reasons.

     Brett
98
Open Forum / Re: Propeller load changes with diameter
« Last post by Mike Alimov on July 02, 2025, 09:40:31 AM »
Thanks for responding.  Something is sucking the life out of the batteries and nothing is jumping up saying "Me, Me, Me"!   Since I cannot do anything about the weight (it is now 68oz after changing ESCs), I am stuck trying to stretch available mah. [snip]

Ken

I suspect that it is the weight of the airplane and the associated drag from the wing required to support that weight that is sucking the juice out of the batteries.  Lighter plane would need less mAh, but I agree, not much can be done about it right now.  I would then recommend flying on shorter lines.  This translates to less work required to do the flying, and so less mAh.  At this weight, I doubt there will be any problems with line tension.  And you will have an added benefit of having the plane closer to you, which (some reported) somehow makes it easier to nail the bottoms.
Just my $0.02
99
Open Forum / Re: Vast facebook stunt pics.
« Last post by john e. holliday on July 02, 2025, 09:30:14 AM »
Dick glad to see you are still with us.  Those pictures brought a lot of memories back.  Yes a lot of the familiar faces are now gone.   You were the man in scale to me.  Take care. D>K
100
Open Forum / Re: Rule of thumb for wheel size for grass
« Last post by Perry Rose on July 02, 2025, 05:41:39 AM »
2 1/2 min. Even then I use full up elevator until the plane gets rolling. The plans generally list the wheel size.
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