Author Topic: EVO-36 FUEL USAGE (Read 1205 times)

Richard Koehler · « **on:** May 26, 2010, 01:26:01 PM »

I've got about a gallon of fuel thru my EVO-36 and it's using about an once of fuel per minute with the smallest venturi covered by a Bru-line filter. The engine has been run both on muffler pressure and straight suction without any change in fuel usage. I wonder if anyone has seen the fuel usage improve with more run time?

dennis lipsett · « **Reply #1 on:** May 27, 2010, 09:36:01 PM »

For starts I hope that your not using a 10 /4or5 in prop as everyone seems to say you have to use. It really will do better on an 11 in prop.
For fuel , you don't need high oil content fuels, in fact it hinders the engine and runs them hotter then they need to.
I have run mine on Powermaster fuel 10/18 with a Trued Zinger power pro and a Thunder Tigre 11/4.5 with very good results. I use the medium venturi with muffler pressure. Thunderbolt hot plug and a 4.5 oz tank. will get you through the pattern without a whole lot to spare. I don't try for a 2/4/2 but run in a wet 2 cycle. The engine is a one flip starter and has been very reliable after a short break in period. It would do better on an all synthetic oil based fuel. Having used Cool Power on mine it runs fine with a good hand on the needle valve.
We also run the R/C version with 30% nitro Cool Power all synthetic Heli fuel, a 12.25X3.75 in APC on a Horizon Cyclone 3D. This set up is really the best that you have ever seen you never need to run it full out and if I told you the fuel economy was unbelievable and you doubted I'd certainly understand. The downside for many flyers is the $40.00 retail price on a gallon of this fuel. Buy it by the case it is a little cheaper.
Incidentally the R/C engine is a few years old and has never been down for service and is flown weekly in the season.
dennis

john e. holliday · « **Reply #2 on:** May 28, 2010, 07:49:21 AM »

Thanks for the info Dennis. I am still getting used to my Evo. I like the idea about the all synthetic fuel as that is what RO said to run in the RO-Jett I have.Thanks again.

Richard Lewis · « **Reply #3 on:** May 28, 2010, 08:34:27 AM »

I do not have the usage rates for the EVO 36 we are running, but I do notice a significant amount of raw fuel in the propwash. From my observation of it while it is running, I believe that most of this is coming from the front bearing where there is only the outer shield in the bearing. Next time I have it off of the plane, I intend to replace the front bearing with a sealed bearing. I'm not sure wheter I will remove the rear seal on this bearing, or leave both sides sealed, but either way I hope it will redulce the fuel usage from waste out of the front bearing.

Richard

Dave Adamisin · « **Reply #4 on:** May 28, 2010, 06:45:45 PM »

Mine settled down after about ten flights. I used a 4 oz Dubro rectangle plastic (about 4.25oz true), the Evo plug, medium vent, muffler (the tung) pressure, 11x5 Master Airscrew and 10% Cool Power. I had it in a Vector 40 ARF and it gave me the pattern (5.2 sec laps on 63') plus about 6 laps. I actually removed the seal on the front brg. I don't like sealed brg's, they wear out....

dennis lipsett · « **Reply #5 on:** May 28, 2010, 09:22:12 PM »

Quote from: Dave Adamisin on May 28, 2010, 06:45:45 PM

Mine settled down after about ten flights. I used a 4 oz Dubro plastic (about 4.25oz true), the Evo plug, medium vent, muffler (the tung) pressure, 11x5 Master Airscrew and 10% Cool Power. I had it in a Vector 40 ARF and it gave me the pattern (5.2 sec laps on 63') plus about 6 laps. I actually removed the seal on the front brg. I don't like sealed brg's, they wear out....

Sounds like yours is running about the same as mine. Not a bad engine, if traditionalist would only be a little more flexable they might enjoy the engine more.
Dennis

john e. holliday · « **Reply #6 on:** May 29, 2010, 05:50:27 PM »

I was going to ignore this but, decided I would insert foot in mouth again. After all the years of using Fox's, K&B's, Johnson's and Super Tigre's it has been quite a change to pull an engine from the box. Put it on a plane. Fuel it and start it, then fly. The RO-Jett is the engine as well as several others out there. Eapecially when told all synthetic fuel is better for these. When I got my EVO it was put on the bench and I tried to start it. Started out with tongue muffler and it would only pop and bang. Had to use starter to get it started. Then it was trying to get it to richen up. Pulled the trainers pin out of the way. Then when I got it richened up it still would not hand start. Some one suggested to pull the muffler off as that is what he had to do. Pulled prop thru and got a kick. Flipped it and it was running.

Then I decided to put it in a plane and start flying it. Was told to try the big can muffler that came with it. Started by hand very easily inverted. Needle setting was still a little lean on first flight. Also as someone has already stated 10-6 props are not big enough. It is flying an ARF Nobler with 11-5 Zinger. Excaliber fuel from Mark Smith out Arizona way. May get it out and fly after contest tomorrow. Anyway even 4 stroke engines are a different breed.

john e. holliday · « **Reply #7 on:** June 04, 2010, 08:46:52 AM »

Well I changed to the next suze up venturi. Nothing but head aches. Would start and quit. Tried muffler pressure and it would ot hold a setting. Checked for leaks and could not find any. Finally got it in the air on suction. Can't get the needle rich enough without it quitting. Even tried the SIG #3. The plug that got me in the air was a Fox 2 volt idle bar. Going back to small venturi.

Dave Adamisin · « **Reply #8 on:** June 05, 2010, 09:14:33 AM »

Quote from: Dave Adamisin on May 28, 2010, 06:45:45 PM

Mine settled down after about ten flights. I used a 4 oz Dubro rectangle plastic (about 4.25oz true), the Evo plug, medium vent, muffler (the tung) pressure, 11x5 Master Airscrew and 10% Cool Power. I had it in a Vector 40 ARF and it gave me the pattern (5.2 sec laps on 63') plus about 6 laps. I actually removed the seal on the front brg. I don't like sealed brg's, they wear out....

Addendum. I don't recommend raising the head. I'm running with one gasket (~0.012" clearence). If it runs away add nitro. Mine runs great on 15%.

dennis lipsett · « **Reply #9 on:** June 05, 2010, 01:46:53 PM »

Quote from: Dave Adamisin on June 05, 2010, 09:14:33 AM

Addendum. I don't recommend raising the head. I'm running with one gasket (~0.012" clearence). If it runs away add nitro. Mine runs great on 15%.

Dave,
I'm not kidding you. Try one tankful of Cool Power Heli fuel. 30% nitro/24% oil, all synthetic, and then tell me what you think. Oh and try a 12.5X3.75 prop on something with that engine with that fuel.

Dave Adamisin · « **Reply #10 on:** June 05, 2010, 06:06:04 PM »

Quote from: dennis lipsett on June 05, 2010, 01:46:53 PM

Dave,
I'm not kidding you. Try one tankful of Cool Power Heli fuel. 30% nitro/24% oil, all synthetic, and then tell me what you think. Oh and try a 12.5X3.75 prop on something with that engine with that fuel.

Dennis, I've got to put it back in the airplane. I was working on the 60 so the 36 went back burner and into a PT19. I've never tried 30% but why not. Last engine I had that much in was in an rc pylon plane. I like the all synthetic part - not a bean oil man.........

Joseph Lijoi · « **Reply #11 on:** June 10, 2010, 02:13:40 PM »

Use 10% Cool Power all synthetic (the green stuff). No castor smell on your clothes and available in the worst hobby shops. Powermaster is out of buisness. Sig......well. Do not use the castor synthetic blend Cool Power. This makes a big difference. The motor has been getting some unfair questionable reviews because people insist on running the engine on 22% oil 29% half castor whatever. The engine stays clean with all synthetic Cool Power like the day you bought it.

Remove the pin on the needle. When new open the needle two turns and choke it till you get a bump (about five flips). I have had absolutely no problems hand starting the from new and it gets easier with run time. I own three of these and don't own a starter. Once you find a needle you will see that the motor has a broad torque curve. The needle seems very linear. I find the motor easy to start even hot.

The motor needs some load. 10-5 is much better with the small venturi than the 10-4. Evo plug is good. Enya #3 also works well. Use a hot plug.

The motor is thoroughly engineered. No "improvements" that I have seen posted seem to improve anything.

The motor is pretty to look at and well built. Some of the carrier guys should look at this in the RC version. Parts are cheap. I needed a backplate to put some lead into for a tailheavy Hangar 9 PT-19 (also a nice product). $2.50. Entire needle valve assembly is $9.00. You can fly a variety of planes with this motor. I have it in a Flite Streak with 38 special landing gear on it. Flies on long lines (64 feet eyelet to eyelet) 10-5 power point prop running at a steady four cycle. Runs like a tuning fork. 4 1/2 minutes on 3 1/2 ounces of fuel.

The motor may be a little thirsty but fuel is power and coolant. This is the most user friendly engine I have owned and a good value. Much easier to use than a fox 35 and you can buy fuel for it!

The motor is a great gift to the controlline community, especially sport flyers.

The Evo 60 should be fun.

dennis lipsett · « **Reply #12 on:** June 11, 2010, 04:29:38 PM »

Quote from: Joseph Lijoi on June 10, 2010, 02:13:40 PM

Use 10% Cool Power all synthetic (the green stuff). No castor smell on your clothes and available in the worst hobby shops. Powermaster is out of buisness. Sig......well. Do not use the castor synthetic blend Cool Power. This makes a big difference. The motor has been getting some unfair questionable reviews because people insist on running the engine on 22% oil 29% half castor whatever. The engine stays clean with all synthetic Cool Power like the day you bought it.

Remove the pin on the needle. When new open the needle two turns and choke it till you get a bump (about five flips). I have had absolutely no problems hand starting the from new and it gets easier with run time. I own three of these and don't own a starter. Once you find a needle you will see that the motor has a broad torque curve. The needle seems very linear. I find the motor easy to start even hot.

The motor needs some load. 10-5 is much better with the small venturi than the 10-4. Evo plug is good. Enya #3 also works well. Use a hot plug.

The motor is thoroughly engineered. No "improvements" that I have seen posted seem to improve anything.

The motor is pretty to look at and well built. Some of the carrier guys should look at this in the RC version. Parts are cheap. I needed a backplate to put some lead into for a tailheavy Hangar 9 PT-19 (also a nice product). $2.50. Entire needle valve assembly is $9.00. You can fly a variety of planes with this motor. I have it in a Flite Streak with 38 special landing gear on it. Flies on long lines (64 feet eyelet to eyelet) 10-5 power point prop running at a steady four cycle. Runs like a tuning fork. 4 1/2 minutes on 3 1/2 ounces of fuel.

The motor may be a little thirsty but fuel is power and coolant. This is the most user friendly engine I have owned and a good value. Much easier to use than a fox 35 and you can buy fuel for it!

The motor is a great gift to the controlline community, especially sport flyers.

The Evo 60 should be fun.

Joe,
I agree with you observations as it pretty much parrallels the way we run ours. They have never seen high oil content with the most being 18% half and half for a specialized purpose. Most times they are run on Cool Power heli fuel as this engine loves nitro and I like the way it runs with it.
As to having a 60 I'd certainly buy one or even the 53 however, I don't see Horizon jumping to offer another engine when they can't convinve the users to embrace a new concept , i.e. total synthetic oil and an engine that will actually do what they claim while using it.
never mind that the R/C group has been using synthetic for 30 years and even U/C started using it in the 70's.
It is an uphill battle to change long time users of products to change their ideas and perceptions of how to do something. This will take awhile and I for one do hope that Horizon will hang tough on it and give some of the younger flyers a chance to show the older generation that there is another way to run an engine.

Joseph Lijoi · « **Reply #13 on:** June 14, 2010, 12:13:50 AM »

Amen Dennis

It is unfortunate that this motor has recieved questionable reviews over the incorrect fuel usage. People are pretty stubborn. The fuel market may change this since my hobby shop (the Prop Shop in Warren MI) has informed me that Powermaster fuel is unavailable. This is an excellent hobby shop that carries a lot of controlline stuff. They used to stock the 29% oil all castor blend, calling it "controlline fuel".

Years ago I was hanging out in Art Adamissins basement. The Adamissins had just introduced a modified OS FP-40. The recommended fuel was Cool Power all synthetic. The original head design was (I believe) a wedge head. Art was a bit frustrated because people wouldn't use Cool Power (calling it cruel power) because they insisted on using castor lube. The head design was changed to a hemi just to accomodate this strange behavior.

The irony is that Dave Adamissin is a professional engine designer who worked for the Ford Motor Co. When they came out with that motor with the blocked off port everyone said it was crazy. The OS LA-46 came out with only two ports and and the Adamissins were vindicated. Dave worked on the Evo 36. When you are buying that motor you are buying a piece of Detroit iron.

That 36 is one strong motor and is really tuned for our use. It is not "detuned". I wish someone would do a proper review of the motor. The Flying Models article really wasn't fair. Mr. Brickhause insisted on doing his testing with the wrong fuel.

I wish that someone would do a proper review of this engine using the proper components. I am not on that level. Arch Adamissin told me that they had that motor turning a 12-6. With a lot of nitro and the large venturi it may haul a Shark 45 around.

30% nitro is not a new idea in stunt. Steve Wooley in his Cobra article stated he was using 30% nitro in a Fox 35.

dennis lipsett · « **Reply #14 on:** June 14, 2010, 07:04:44 PM »

30% nitro is not a new idea in stunt. Steve Wooley in his Cobra article stated he was using 30% nitro in a Fox 35.

Granted you can do that in a Fox but not for long. Component quality and strength were never it's selling point.
Modern engines can run on the stuff forever without ill effects. Especially the way it's used in stunt engines.
dennis

Joseph Lijoi · « **Reply #15 on:** June 16, 2010, 01:39:29 PM »

I agree. I am sure Steve was getting free engines. Rollie McDonald told me Duke Fox would give him "handfulls" of 35's at every Nationals. A lot of coin in 1955.

Author Topic: EVO-36 FUEL USAGE (Read 1205 times)

Richard Koehler

EVO-36 FUEL USAGE

dennis lipsett

Re: EVO-36 FUEL USAGE

john e. holliday

Re: EVO-36 FUEL USAGE

Richard Lewis

Re: EVO-36 FUEL USAGE

Dave Adamisin

Re: EVO-36 FUEL USAGE

dennis lipsett

Re: EVO-36 FUEL USAGE

john e. holliday

Re: EVO-36 FUEL USAGE

john e. holliday

Re: EVO-36 FUEL USAGE

Dave Adamisin

Re: EVO-36 FUEL USAGE

dennis lipsett

Re: EVO-36 FUEL USAGE

Dave Adamisin

Re: EVO-36 FUEL USAGE

Joseph Lijoi

Re: EVO-36 FUEL USAGE

dennis lipsett

Re: EVO-36 FUEL USAGE

Joseph Lijoi

Re: EVO-36 FUEL USAGE

dennis lipsett

Re: EVO-36 FUEL USAGE

Joseph Lijoi

Re: EVO-36 FUEL USAGE