Author Topic: Adding weight? (Read 2983 times)

Joe Messinger · « **on:** February 17, 2007, 11:48:39 PM »

Hello,

I realize most of us are looking for ways to loose weight both on our planes and ourselves. In this case, at least, I'm trying to add some weight to the tail of a plane without it being too obvious.

I've built several "Francherized" Twisters. I shortened the nose and lengthened the fuselage 3". I've used light weight wheels and landing gear. Brodak .40 engines which are pretty light. They're still tail heavy.

Have used stick on weights but don't like the looks and they tend to come unstuck in time. Does anyone have a "slick" way of adding tail weight to a profile plane that's secure and not too noticeably?

Thanks,

Joe

Randy Powell · « **Reply #1 on:** February 18, 2007, 12:23:10 AM »

I used to drill the nose ring with 1/4" holes and stuff them with lead.

Leester · « **Reply #2 on:** February 18, 2007, 06:39:48 AM »

I've heard of guys putting solder around the tail wheel wire. Or Randys idea but holes in the tail of the fusalage and putting in lead.

Jim Treace · « **Reply #3 on:** February 18, 2007, 06:50:15 AM »

At the distal end of the fuse, just under the horz stab, I drill 1/8" through, use 4/40 bolts, washers to secure necessary amount of weight. Using tip weight type square 1/4 oz lead. In static on ground position, usually, can't hardly see it and they sure don't come off.
Jim

RC Storick · « **Reply #4 on:** February 18, 2007, 06:59:11 AM »

Drill a 1/4 inch hole into the fuse length ways as far as the drill bit will allow. Fill with fishing weights and plug.

Joe Messinger · « **Reply #5 on:** February 18, 2007, 08:58:09 AM »

I've got some "OO" buckshot and will try drilling the tail of the fuselage and adding the right amount of shot to balance the thing. It might be a good idea to make the plug removable in case I don't get the weight quite right the first time. That should do it!

Thanks for the help.

Regards,

Joe

Mark Scarborough · « **Reply #6 on:** February 18, 2007, 09:25:48 AM »

One thing you may be aware of, In the past, I have seen buckshot used as weight, if it is not glued into something, the movement can turn it into powder in short order. must be something about the alloy of the material, but its kinda strange to open the weightbox and find lead powder where the buckshot was.
FWIW it still weighs the same, just in powder form

Joe Messinger · « **Reply #7 on:** February 18, 2007, 09:34:46 AM »

Mark,

I never gave much thought to it but I do know that lead will oxidize in time forming a powder residue on the outer surface. Maybe coating the shot with lacquer before I add it to the tail would help?

I would make sure the shot is secure in the cavity before sealing it. That should eliminate the movement factor.

Thanks for the advice.

Joe

Joe Messinger · « **Reply #8 on:** February 18, 2007, 09:40:39 AM »

Just thought of something. I have some steel ball bearings that are about 1/4" in diameter. That would eliminate the "powder" problem. Think I'll try that. . .

Joe

peabody · « **Reply #9 on:** February 18, 2007, 09:45:59 AM »

Next one, don't shorten the nose as much...
THat said, heavy props and spinners, as well as mufflers, work.
I am partial to a Higley "Heavy HUb", although the weights that are hidden inside the spinners work well, too...

Lightening the tail is a more effective way to accomplish what you are seeking...typically an ounce off the tail equals three ounces of tail weight.

Look at your tail wheel assembly....maybe remove it entirely and replace with a spring wire skid?

One of Windy's planes had monokote on the stab to reduce weight.

Just thoughts

Joe Messinger · « **Reply #10 on:** February 18, 2007, 11:38:20 AM »

Hi Peabody,

I think you've misunderstood the problem I have with the Twisters. Perhaps I didn't explain it well.

The planes are not Tail heavy, they are Nose heavy. That's why I shortened the nose and lengthened the fuselage. So, I need to balance the plane by adding weight to the tail. I want the plane to be a bit nose heavy but not as much as it is.

Every Twister I've seen has the same problem. Very long nose section with a relatively short moment arm to the tail.

Thanks for your interest and best regards.

Joe

Randy Powell · « **Reply #11 on:** February 18, 2007, 02:13:02 PM »

Joe,

Yea, I misunderstood. I thought they were tail heavy. But the same principle applies. I have taken 1/4" brass tubing and cut it to one or two inch lengths and melted solder into to them to create various weights then drilled holes along the centerling (sometimes throught the rudder) or vertically, depending on vertical CG issues, and glues these in for weight. Usually I stuck on temp weights to first figure out the approximate weight I would need and where. The fursther aft the better since you won't need as much.

Bob Reeves · « **Reply #12 on:** February 18, 2007, 03:53:06 PM »

By all rights my TwistMaster shouldn't turn worth a hoot, Saito 40 on the nose and balances almost on the leading edge. However that airplane has brought home more hardware than any airplane in my fleet. Have you flown your Twister and sure it flys nose heavy?

Joe Messinger · « **Reply #13 on:** February 18, 2007, 06:47:21 PM »

Bob,

Well, that's a good point. Yes, I have flown the Twisters that I've built. They were a bit slow in the corners but adding some weight to the tail has improved the turns.

I got back to CL flying a few years back so my skills aren't great but I've been fortunate to have had several good pilots try out my planes and I've tied to followed their recommendations regarding the tail weight along with other trim issues. Also I did the standard CG balance that is recommended. Ted Francher offers instructions for balancing Twisters with his modifications so that's the input I had.

Can't argue with the success you've had with your TwistMaster. No doubt your flying skills being much better than mine allow you to handle many things that I would have trouble with. I think I need the quicker turning ability of a plane to compensate for my periodic inability to realize that the ground has suddenly gotten way too close to my plane rather than to make good use of it for maneuvers.

Thanks for your advice, Bob. As always, it's appreciated.

Joe

Rudy Taube · « **Reply #14 on:** February 18, 2007, 11:18:22 PM »

Joe,

I dislike adding nonfunctional lead to anything made out of balsa wood. It just seems that gravity already wins more than it's share of our battles, I hate to give it any more help than I have to! ;-)

But, with that said, I too have run into the same problem with some of my IC powered planes. My Flite Streak now flys with it's tail weight lead replaced by a nice looking, functional, and relatively heavy R/C type tail wheel assembly. And it looks better than the lead it replaced, a little pretentious, but better. ;-)

All the previous imaginative suggestions will work perfectly, and they all will look better than the square weights, attached with a servo screw, that I used to have my plane. ..... My guess is that your next Twister will have an even longer aft fuselage? :-)

Bill Little · « **Reply #15 on:** February 19, 2007, 01:04:46 AM »

I use Socket head Nylon bolts that are 1/4-20 and thread a piece of 1/4" ID tubing. This assembly gets glued into the rear of the fuselage as far back as the wood thickness allows. I make the tubing as long as I can safely do and still hide the head of the bolt. Pack lead fishing weights into the tube, and stuff any remaining area with some soft foam. Sometimes you can even dye the bolts to a color that is very close to you finish. This gives you an adjustable feature that is pretty well hidden.

Joe Messinger · « **Reply #16 on:** February 19, 2007, 04:23:17 AM »

Thanks Rudy, Bill and all for your thoughts and suggestions. I think Bill's method of adding tail weight using 1/4" ID tubing and nylon screw would allow easy weight adjustment and would be quite inconspicuous. Now to find the tubing and screw. . .

I think the four modified Twisters I've built are enough for now. I have a pretty good inventory of other planes for future use. Figured I would try to improve my skills with the Twisters before going on to the more "advanced" models. Problem is, the Twisters fly so well, I don't know if I'll ever get around to flying the others very much!

Regards,

Joe

Bob Reeves · « **Reply #17 on:** February 19, 2007, 04:25:14 PM »

Joe, nothing wrong with Twisters, mine got me kicked out of Intermediate.

Was interrupted when writing the previous post and cut it short, should have continued on and said I wasn't advocating balancing your Twister as far forward as mine. Like I said I don't fully understand why it flys so well, if anyone else showed up at the field with it I would tell them it's too nose heavy and won't turn.

You have several good ideas on how to add tail weight, I like the tube idea but would be sure to use aluminum. The tip weight box on my Twister is a brass tube, problem is the tube by itself is a tad more weight than it needs

Jim Thomerson · « **Reply #18 on:** February 19, 2007, 04:45:39 PM »

If you balance a stock Twister at 15% chord, @ 1 5/8 back, it will fly very well. Do not use any kind of loose lead in a weight box as it will vibrate and turn to powder. I use steel BB's with no problem. The high zoot stuff to use is modeling clay stuck on.

Joe Messinger · « **Reply #19 on:** February 19, 2007, 05:00:19 PM »

Thanks again for all the help and advice. As Bob Reeves noted, the Twisters fly pretty well. Much better than I can make good use of for sure. I'm working on that.

Hopefully, spring isn't too far around the corner and "Cabin Fever " will fade away.

Regards,

Joe

Steve Kientz · « **Reply #20 on:** February 20, 2007, 11:02:58 AM »

I rebuilt a Flite Streak wing with a Skyray fusefor a friend.Knowing he would use a r/c engine I drilled a hole at the rear of the fuse. After balancing i epoxied the hole shut. He still added tailweight but not near as much.

Steve

Author Topic: Adding weight? (Read 2983 times)

Steve Kientz