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Author Topic: wing aspect ratio.  (Read 1407 times)

Offline jim gilmore

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wing aspect ratio.
« on: April 11, 2008, 12:40:16 AM »
I know how to compute aspect ratio but what i'm not sure on is what exactly the range for a pa cl airplane should be. Is 4.9 too low ? also is the acceptable range different for models with a straight leading edge ? as opposed to tapered ?

Offline PatRobinson

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Re: wing aspect ratio.
« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2008, 02:22:56 AM »
Jim,
The short answer is 4.9 to 1 should work fine -  Most PA planes you might build from kits or plans are usually around the 5+ to 1 aspect ratio. Some folks like the Adamisin's and Randy Powell have used planes 7+ to 1 aspect ratio.
Some of Big Jim designs also used a longer aspect ratio wing.

The long answer is that wing design is compromise of competing design features with each having it's own benefits and drawbacks.
You probably know that wing area when compared to weight yeilds a measurement of lifting capability called "wing loading". Increasing aspect ratio using the same root and tip chord will increase area and lift but it will also increase drag and may reduce stability in turbulence.

If you make the wing longer you increase a measure called "Span Loading" because a longer wing will usually be more efficient because the longer wing can work against a longer section of air to create more lift than a shorter wing can produce.

If you reduce the root and tip chords to maintain the same wing area with a longer wing then you need to insure that you don't reduce the "Reynolds Number" too much which will also adversely reduce the wings lifting efficiency. This is especially true of the tip chord on a tapered wing.

As you can see a wing design is a compromise trying to balance these different elements into producing a desirable wing.

Jim sorry to run a little long but I thought a brief look at wing factors might be useful to you.  I intended to create a balance between 1.keep it simple for beginners and 2. have some useful info for those with some knowledge. I am not sure I did either one very well. Oh Well.  If you are interested I suggest getting a book on aerodynamics because I have barely touched the subject.

                                                     Best Wishes ,
                                                     Pat Robinson   

Offline phil c

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Re: wing aspect ratio.
« Reply #2 on: April 14, 2008, 10:43:03 AM »
Jim,  the taper of the wing doesn't have much to do with aspect ratio.  A big difference occurs when the chord of the wing gets down in the 4 inch range and the thin layer of air on the wing surface(boundary layer) goes from partially turbulent to laminar(smooth) flow.  The scientific term that applies for this is called Reynolds number.  One formula for it is V*l*777=Rn.  Velocity in mph  l(length) of the wing chord in inches, and 777 is a constant that makes the units come out right(thanks Wild Bill).  A typical stunt plane flies at a Rn of around 500,000, which is smack dab in the middle of the transition from laminar to turbulent.  Free flight planes, especially indoor models, operate under 100,000 and are extremely affected by wing chord.  Full scale planes operate in the millions so the boundary layer is usually mostly turbulent.  Going as low as 5 inches or so in chord at the tip still keeps the Reynolds number well above where it might cause problems.

This phenomenon explains why almost all planes seem to fly "better" the faster they go.  As long as the lines hold and the controls are designed to work at higher speeds the plane hangs out on the end of the lines better, doesn't get bothered as much by the wind, flys smoother, and is easier to control smoothly and precisely.(Assuming your reflexes are up to the task).  It's another reason many people have gone to larger planes.  They just work better.
phil Cartier

Offline jim gilmore

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Re: wing aspect ratio.
« Reply #3 on: April 14, 2008, 07:13:05 PM »
Sorry Phil, you just lost me.
Ok, i'll have to summarize where I am in my desiging. Then again maybe your usage of "taper" , isn't what I'm thinking of. Short and simple way for me to design what I want.
first off total wing span 28" w/o tips.
Leading edge and trailing edge are both straight for simplifed build. Flap and wingtips are added to fulfill aspect ratio....
first example..
5" constant chord
5X28=140 sq in
if tips add 2"
5X30=150
if flap=1/2 at the center of the span
5.5X30=165
30/5.5=5.45
So I can make my ribs .25 longer....
30X5.75=172.5
30X5.75=5.217
--------------------
does  this make seense ? The only taper i'm refering to is from leading or trailing edge at the tip to the root.


Offline L0U CRANE

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Re: wing aspect ratio.
« Reply #4 on: April 15, 2008, 11:53:53 AM »
Jim,

Your numbers work.

A few other thoughts:

The tips are seldom as effective as the main wing area, particularly if they have a 'pleasing' shape in the plan view (looking straight down on the wing.) If they are rounded or tapered down as seen from the front or rear, they also act less like the main airfoil area. Tip effectiveness drops due to "tip vortices" - spiralling air trailing off the tips. The air "below" the wing also flows out towards the tips - higher pressure seeking lower pressure. The air "above" the wing produces most of the lift by being at lower pressure, further drawing the higher pressure air from "under" the wing to wrap over the tips. ("Above" and "below" refer to the direction of lift at any given moment. Towards the "pilot's head" in upright or inside maneuvering, and away from it in inverted and outside maneuvering...)

You could choose to start with a tapered "planform." The average of the tip and root chord lengths is the average geometric chord for the wing - it's that simple.

Wing sweepback (or -forward) is another thing you can play with. Aerodynamic sweep relates to the quarter chord (25% back from the LE) of the wing. Flite Streaks and Ringmasters have slight forward sweep. The LE is straight, and the TE slants forward... A P-51 Mustang wing has just about zero sweep at the quarter chord: the LE slants back about 1/3d as much as the TE slants forward... It's just a tad more complicated to find the quarter chord for a tapered wing, but it should be close enough to find the average chord (average of tip and root chords) and 'place' its quarter chord on the line drawn from 1/4 of the root chord to 1/4 of the tip chord.

CG also relates to the Mean (average) Aerodynamic Chord, not the root chord unless the wing is rectangular, like your example. (Aerodynamic chord is not exactly the geometric average chord, except for rectangular planforms. Still, it will be close...)

And finally: there are two ways to figure the Aspect Ratio. Simplest, for rectangular planforms, is Span divided by Chord.

But if you have an elliptical or tapered wing, what then? Can you figure out the area? If so, and you know the span, you can find the Aspect Ratio.

AR = b/c (span is usually labeled 'b', maybe from 'breadth' of the wing? chord is 'c'.)

Algebra lets us multiply both sides of an equation by the same value without changing the result, right? So, let's multiply both sides of that AR equation by (b/b)...

(b/b)*AR = (b/b)*(b/c),

On the left side, b/b = 1, so it cancels out, leaving AR unchanged.

On the right side, we don't do that, instead we see that the expression (b*b) / (b*c) uses the two things we DO know: span (b) and area (b*c). (Area is often represented by 'S', from working Surface?).

So, we wind up with AR = b^2/S.

This probably doesn't do much for your initial question, but it might help you see that it isn't hard to get a bit fancier, when and as you want to.
\BEST\LOU

Offline phil c

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Re: wing aspect ratio.
« Reply #5 on: April 15, 2008, 05:12:39 PM »
Jim, you have at least a 5 in. chord, so you shouldn't have any problems with either the amount of taper or the absolute chord length, as far as getting the tips so narrow that Reynold's number starts to cause problems.  Just keep you airspeed up over the 5-10 mph that indoor models fly at!
phil Cartier

Offline Fred Shattuck

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Re: wing aspect ratio.
« Reply #6 on: May 06, 2008, 07:47:21 PM »
This is some information I can sink my teeth into---- Thanks Y'all. You have helped ME more than you know.     FRED


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