Gentlemen,

1) Which aircraft has the best wing profile and shape for a Wing Span of 48-52 inch flapped stunter?  (example; Nobler,...)

2) What is the recommended Taper Ratio?

3)  What is the recommended Asymmetry?

Thanks for your recommendations.


T  Michael Jennings       
Knoxville, TN

While you're answering Keith's question, try finding any two people that agree on the answer to any one of those three questions.

There are lots of opinions here on these pages about the answers to those questions.  Most people who want definitive answers to those questions come away disappointed.

I'm pretty sure that there is no one best answer.  Further, the "what's best" answer varies by what you want to do and what decisions you make about the rest of the plane.  The "best" wing profile and shape for your size range in a stunter that needs to withstand the crashes and hard landings of a beginning/intermediate kit- or plans-built flier is dictated by having a construction method that is simple and a structure that is rugged.  Put a flier on the handle who never crashes, or make an endless supply of cheap ARFs, and you remove those constraints.  The "best" airfoil depends on the power system: airfoils changed when better engines than the Fox 35-ish engines were supplanted by newer ones, and the "best" airfoil for electrics may be something yet again.

And when all is said and done, the "best" plane for you may not be the "best" plane for someone else.  The top guys build and tweak their planes all the time, seeking their own personal "best" plane; if there were a definitive "best", then they'd all be flying the same thing all the time.

I suggest that you read through all the threads in this design forum that touch on this subject, going back for one or two years.  It'll take a long time (oh, I wish someone would write a book!) but you'll see a lot of the thinking behind the answers to the questions you're asking.  You'll also see that the answers depend on who you ask; developing a feeling for who you want to believe is up to you.

Probably the Gieseke Nobler.  The wing is a 1/16th or so thicker than the original Nobler.  Tail is slightly bigger.  Run the biggest engine that can balance properly.

Gentlemen,

Below are some of the particulars to my aircraft;

1)  Intermediate Flyer,

2) Scratch Builder,

3) Built Up wings (not foam cores),

4) Aircraft weights  50-55 ounces,

5)  Engines
         OS Max 46LA
          and
         Fox  40 ABC

6)  Props (typical used)
        11X3 or 11X4
        12X3 or 12X4
7)  Set engine for a constant RPM
        (not a 2-4-2 run)

I consider the Nobler (Green Box profile) wing a "Better" wing.  It has preformed well and in many aircraft. 


Several years ago, Mr. Fancher published a column in Model Aviation (September 1979 issue) that contained a lot of Wing Design data.

I think Mr. Buck published wing article in Stunt News (Sep/Oct 2007 issue) that added to the Wing Design info.

From Mr. Fancher and Mr. Buck's articles, I developed an MS Excel spreadsheet which incorporated their design info.
If someone would like the spreadsheet which incorporated this design info, just let me know.

These articles are several years old.  The basics of aero technology has not changed over the years. 
But, has the Aeronautical Engineers developed a better understanding to improve a Control Line wing design?


It appears that some of the repliers are insulted by my inquiry. 
If they are insulted, I apologize.



T Michael Jennings
Knoxville, TN

Id think the span / weights quoted dont quite match .

Nobler size start getting a bit mushy at 50 Oz, longer lines get a bit more room / speed / lift .

55Oz is Bill wewages Hot Thunderbolts weight . He went to a bit of trouble to get it that light .

Building a plane around a hard straight grained 1/4 sheet spar , tip to tip , is one way to carry the load .
you can get a bit of give for the gusts . where a C - ' D ' tube if very light is more ridgid before it brakes
IF you try and ' bow ' it .

I recomend I beams for scareing peole , Fuse across knee and pull the tips , bends like a strip . if youve
done the centresection ply doulers ending progresively / tapered over a few bays .

You cant get a D tube to bow like that .

A lot of Jack Sheeks designs will build light . You dont need a W. C. 1st place Capeable plane for ' intermediate .
You need the lines tight , and something that will rotate hard to avoid terra firma , as in excess lift.therefore it wont drop out of the sky doing a avoidance . I think the detroiter type works more like a sail or this ,
where the D tube can get semi stalled and awkward .

Things like not haveing tractor mufflers hanging out the inboard side , square wheels and bits of lead strewn about things help. Theyre all counterprodutive .

40 ships were traditionally bigger than 35 sized . The Engine WEIGHt bing one consideration .
chopping the nose shorter with a heavy 40 in a Noble sized airframe saves weight .

Big lumps of weight in small aeroplanes produce inirtia , you dont want to acentuate that .
they should pull 55 inches if theyre built clean aerodynamically, but keep the all up weight
under 50 ounces f you want the performance the bees knees .

This modern clear plastic might give the structural reinforcement properties of a good ole finish .
floppy soggy film doesnt help at all . The covcering should be a TAGHTENED SKIN
its a large part of the torsional stability under load of the aeroplane .

A flexi wobbly soggy airframe wont fly like a taughttensioned / with a bit of give / bow - one .

Select the spar wood for straight consistant clean unknotted grain , BEFORE weight .
usually 6 - 10 Lb woods good for detroiter wings , it works like a good sword blade .
not a fenceing sword whipping aboutthough .

Stiff Pushrods arnt a bad idea either .

Have a ook at some of the old 60s McCoy 40 & Adaminson stuff , too . They were in the ' 40 ' game then .

& a FPS isnt a piped 40 VFR , it needs a aerodynamically clean lean machine to fly sleek like Sheek !


These blokes know their wings .





Id thought the USA1 , Shark 45 , Novi IV , and Mr Towell's Caudron the personification of all things wingey ,
as a Lad .The USA 1 theres was alledgedly G-21 - 40 ST. if so , a FP cant be far short in output .
Best shot of the prop of champions , of the era , yet . too. All the PAMPArites will know the credits ,

What Mark said the Brodak P-40 wing seems to work in every model it is put in no mater what the other numbers are. It is thick and can carry a lot of weight and it flys very good in light planes. The Vector seems to have it all ,if you want a built it your self get the plans. The plans Vector is just enough different than the ARF to make it a better plane. The Randy Smith small 40 size Tempest has a very good wing = 52"
 To answer another question running on here now the Tempest is a very "good windy weather plane". I flew mine with a .35 but it is much better with a 40-46 motor.
Ed