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Author Topic: SORRELL HIPERBIPE:Good C/L Scale Subject???  (Read 1938 times)

Offline Jeff Traxler

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SORRELL HIPERBIPE:Good C/L Scale Subject???
« on: September 02, 2010, 09:08:26 PM »
Hi All,
   While at the Nats scale competition and the FCM contest this past weekend I was bitten by the scale bug.I purchased a R/C kit by a company called Master Kit of a homebuilt design called the SNS-7 "Hiperbipe" originally built by Hobie Sorrel in the early 1970's.It is a 2 place,side by side,negative stagger biplane.It was fully aerobatic with inverted fuel and oil,a symetrical airfoil,180 HP Lycoming,and even had a smoke system.The wingspan was 22 feet and it was 20 feet long.The kit has a 42" span and has about 650 Sq. inches of wing area.The Fuselage is a lifting design.It is airfoil shaped and actually helped the performance of the real one.It is 7"wide and 8"tall so there is plenty of room for controls and a smoke system.The kit calls for a 40 to 60 size glow but says a OS FSR 40 works fine.I have a brand new Saito FS-65 H that I would like to use for power if it is not to large.The 4 strokes sound so nice!!!!!!This will be my first attempt at a scale project but I know my building skills will gladly accept the challange.I was thinking Fun Scale would be the place to start.Documentation is not hard to find for this aircraft so I suppose my question is do I have a good start on a "Fun" scale project????
                                                                   Thanx,Jeff
If you wanna sing the blues(Fly Stunt) you gotta pay your dues and "I know it don't come easy"

Offline Tim Wescott

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Re: SORRELL HIPERBIPE:Good C/L Scale Subject???
« Reply #1 on: September 02, 2010, 09:32:16 PM »
I'm jealous.
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The problem with electric is that once you get the smoke generator and sound system installed, the plane is too heavy.

Offline John Rist

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Re: SORRELL HIPERBIPE:Good C/L Scale Subject???
« Reply #2 on: September 02, 2010, 10:18:00 PM »
Sounds like a big jump for your first scale project.  Just remember fun scale is all about flying.  It has to land like silk.  A bipe should have enough wing to do the job. The bigger engine is probably a good thing.  U-Controls need extra power to handle the lines. Also most of my scale ships came out tail heavy so extra noise weight is a good thing.  I would go with a Clancy multi channel for throttle and smoke.  Brodak sells the insulated lines.

Just a thought - you may want to consider a profile scale for your first project.  Builds faster and will give you a chance to learn the pitfalls of scale with less heartburn.  Brodak has LA-5 Kit Control-Line Profile Scale Item# CLP-61.  Your FS 65 should work.  This way you don't have to do the RC to U-Control conversion.  Trust me it can be tricky.  I never have gotten my converted RC Eindecker 300S to land smoothly.

One last word of advise - Keep it light.


 #^  y1   H^^
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Online chuck snyder

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Re: SORRELL HIPERBIPE:Good C/L Scale Subject???
« Reply #3 on: September 03, 2010, 06:33:23 AM »
Bob Underwood successfully flew a hiperbipe in R/C scale several years ago, so there are no inherent vices that would make this a poor choice. My personal feeling is that most prototypes can be successful.

Why limit yourself to Fun Scale? Documentation is about the only difference for that model between Fun and Sport Scale because you have to do all the building. You'll need to document the color scheme for either event. I suggest you get your outline documentation soon and compare the kit to it. There will probably be some differences. You may be able to correct them prior to construction and have a competitive Sport Scale model without much more effort.

Chuck

Offline John Witt

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Re: SORRELL HIPERBIPE:Good C/L Scale Subject???
« Reply #4 on: September 03, 2010, 07:18:57 AM »
There have been Hyperbipe models that were successful in scale competition, I can't remember whether in U/C or R/C. I agree with Chuck, go ahead and make it Sport Scale, you're half way there already. Clancy's multi channel controller is essentially plug and play for setting up the throttle control and the rest is pretty much what you would do anyway.

Enjoy the research part too. You can meet some wonderful folks doing that. I met aviation author and museum curator Cory Graff and two different people involved in early aircraft restoration while researching my Jenny. The research becomes a fascinating project in itself, a bit like investigative reporting, especially when you start finding a trail of an individual airplane, passing through different hands and events.

To get you started, here's a link with a bunch of pictures:

http://www.homebuiltairplanes.com/forums/members/joe-fisher-albums-hiper-bipe.html

Have fun and keep us posted on the build.

John Witt
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Offline dennis lipsett

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Re: SORRELL HIPERBIPE:Good C/L Scale Subject???
« Reply #5 on: September 03, 2010, 10:20:20 AM »
Master Kits made 2 models that I'm aware of. The first was the Hyper bipe and the other was a 15 sized pattern model called Peppermint Pattie. I had both of these in early 1908's. Like a lot of small kit makers they had nice models, all hand cut, good wood, but not enough capitol to get a decent share of the market. I enjoyed both of those models and you have a very nice flying model in your possession. Converting this is not a major project build wise. As to getting it to scale outline, well that's the fun of scale.
Dennis

Offline Tim Wescott

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Re: SORRELL HIPERBIPE:Good C/L Scale Subject???
« Reply #6 on: September 03, 2010, 10:48:04 AM »
Master Kits made 2 models that I'm aware of. The first was the Hyper bipe and the other was a 15 sized pattern model called Peppermint Pattie. I had both of these in early 1908's.
Which is pretty darned impressive, when you consider when the Hyperbipe was designed, and the level of radio technology back then.
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The problem with electric is that once you get the smoke generator and sound system installed, the plane is too heavy.

Offline Jeff Traxler

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Re: SORRELL HIPERBIPE:Good C/L Scale Subject???
« Reply #7 on: September 04, 2010, 12:51:32 PM »
Hello,
     Thanx for the encouragement!!!! I figured it was a good choice but just needed the kick in the hind end for motivation.I have taken a real good look at the kit and everything is accounted for and the wood is some good quality stuff..It all appears to be light and straight.I have plenty of carbon fiber around the shop so building this light and strong will not be a problem(Think Stunt)The problem I am having is logging into the AMA website to get a copy of the fun and sport scale rules.I will have to call them on Tuesday to get that fixed..I have already been tracking down photos and 3 views.I just need the rules(and a week to clean the workbench!!!!)to make sure I don't break any before I start and then I can get this project underway.I will post progress reports as they are available.
                                                                                              Thanx again,Jeff
If you wanna sing the blues(Fly Stunt) you gotta pay your dues and "I know it don't come easy"

Offline Allen Goff

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Re: SORRELL HIPERBIPE:Good C/L Scale Subject???
« Reply #8 on: September 04, 2010, 01:25:51 PM »
Jeff, Allen here. I agree with Chuck, sport scale might be a good choice too. The Satio 65 four stroke will be a great fit for that ship. Remember, scale ships (R/C or C/L) tend to be tail-heavy and under powered. Big power is not always needed, but nice to know it's there. Will Hinton is close by, check with him when question arise, besides, he is a REAL pilot not just a modeler. Hope to see ya at the "Nats" and the FCM contest in 2011.

Blessings
Allen

Offline Jeff Traxler

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Re: SORRELL HIPERBIPE:Good C/L Scale Subject???
« Reply #9 on: September 04, 2010, 03:44:26 PM »
Hey Allen,
        I get to talk with Will a couple times a week wether he wants to or not!!!!He helps me tons.We talk about the full size ships too.I learned of the Hiperbipe back in A&P schooll in the 70's when it came out.I was a long time member of the EAA and have built 2 homebuilts and had a Sonerai II nearly finished in my back yard when a careless driver went left of center in 2001.Have'nt been pilot in command since.BUT THAT'S OK.I had my aerobatic fun.I have time in a Great Lakes,Pitts S2,and a T-6.I don't make the plans.I just try to follow the best I can.I look forward to my scale project,attending the nate, and certainly attending the FCM next year.I did'nt get a chance to thank you for putting on such a great contest and taking care of us competitors the way you folks did before I drove away.So,THANX!!!!I am getting ready for next year,I have the gas money already in the bank!!!!!
                                                                                                     Jeff
If you wanna sing the blues(Fly Stunt) you gotta pay your dues and "I know it don't come easy"

Offline Thomas Wilk

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Re: SORRELL HIPERBIPE:Good C/L Scale Subject???
« Reply #10 on: September 04, 2010, 05:57:56 PM »
the Hiperbipe was published as an R/C model

Sorrell Hiperbipe SNS-7 * magazine 1974 FM Nov p26 * span 45.00 * wing area 610.00 * power   .40 * plan # C-349* designed by Hines, Stan S.

I can scan the article for you.  please contact me off forum

tawilk636@live.com  H^^


Offline Thomas Wilk

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Re: SORRELL HIPERBIPE:Good C/L Scale Subject???
« Reply #11 on: September 04, 2010, 05:59:43 PM »
Jeff;

get on the internet - type in Sorrell Hiperbipe and you'll find color schemes. 

Tom Wilk   S?P H^^

Offline Neville Legg

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Re: SORRELL HIPERBIPE:Good C/L Scale Subject???
« Reply #12 on: September 04, 2010, 09:49:09 PM »
Go to www.abpic.co.uk  go to search, type in Sorrell and you'll find 3 pages of this aircraft. Click on the photo and you can bring them up to almost screen size!

Cheers
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(not) Descartes

Offline John Rist

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Re: SORRELL HIPERBIPE:Good C/L Scale Subject???
« Reply #13 on: September 05, 2010, 10:06:29 AM »
It looks like BOB Banka Aircraft Documentation has 5 versions of the Hiperbipe.   http://www.bobsairdoc.com  He does have a spelling error in his catalog. He has only one L in Sorrell.  I looked at the 5 tail numbers Bob listed and could not find any pictures on the internet.  Anyway I used Bob's data package on my first Extra 300S project and found them to be first class.  His 3-Views are also very good. Attached is one of the photos out of the Bob's photo pack.  He provides high quality glossy prints that scan easily producing good quality prints.  However you can use his prints as they come out of the pack in your documentation book.  Personally I like to print 2 5X7 pictures per page.  Their is a limit of pages in you documentation for Sport Scale (Event 509).  By the way I do agree with the earlier post that this project is well suited for Sport Scale.  However you could put it in Fun Scale if you prefer.  It all depends on your building skills - especially in the finishing category.  I believe you said you were at the Nats so you saw what to expect.  For the most part I didn't see a lot of difference in the general appearance of Sport and Fun Scale.  Although Allen Goff's Waco was (1th place Sport Scale) was a flawless looking ship.  At any rate go for it - and remember to have fun.  Also post pictures as you go.  Gives us old retired folks something to do in our spare time.

PS. If you call BOB he may well be able to put together a sample pack of the 5 Hiperbipe tail numbers he has. This way you could pick one that works for you. If this is your first scale project a simple paint scheme is a good thing (at least is was for me).

 LL~
John Rist
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Offline Jeff Traxler

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Re: SORRELL HIPERBIPE:Good C/L Scale Subject???
« Reply #14 on: September 05, 2010, 01:01:56 PM »
Hi All,
    Thanx for the photo tips!!!And John thanx for the link to the documentation.Someone at the FCM contest told me of his website but my powers of recolection would not remember the web address.I was planning on the original aircraft's paint scheme.Nice,but not too flashy and easy to duplicate.I hope to get this project off the drawing board and on the workbench very soon.Thanx for everyone's help and suggestions!!!!!!!
                                                                                          Jeff
If you wanna sing the blues(Fly Stunt) you gotta pay your dues and "I know it don't come easy"

Offline John Rist

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Re: SORRELL HIPERBIPE:Good C/L Scale Subject???
« Reply #15 on: September 05, 2010, 01:54:38 PM »
If you know the tail number of the original you may be able to match it up at Bob's - also a google search on the tail number may turn up some interesting info.

 D>K
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Offline dennis lipsett

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Re: SORRELL HIPERBIPE:Good C/L Scale Subject???
« Reply #16 on: September 06, 2010, 08:10:52 PM »
Which is pretty darned impressive, when you consider when the Hyperbipe was designed, and the level of radio technology back then.

You bet, LOL
Dennis

Offline Jeff Traxler

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Re: SORRELL HIPERBIPE:Good C/L Scale Subject???
« Reply #17 on: September 07, 2010, 01:17:19 PM »
Hi All,The wheels are in motion.I got a copy of the rules and 509 Sport Scale it is.Bob's Airdoc. has a couple sets of 3 veiws and a nice documentation packet on the way.I chose the color scheme of a female airshow pilot.Red,White,and Blue.Can't go wrong with those colore!!!!Hopefully I can finish cleaning the shop before it gets here.!!!!Anybody have an idea where to get some 1/6th scale flying wire clevises and pinked edge tape??Jeff
If you wanna sing the blues(Fly Stunt) you gotta pay your dues and "I know it don't come easy"

Offline John Witt

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Re: SORRELL HIPERBIPE:Good C/L Scale Subject???
« Reply #18 on: September 07, 2010, 03:53:20 PM »
Jeff,

Try Proctor Enterprises for the the clevises and turnbuckles.  The ones for the Jenny are 1/6 scale. 

In 1/6 the pinked edges are so small as to be invisible, especially from the 15 ft judging distance for sport scale. Just slice off scale 2" strips of your covering material and iron them on. Don't forget to do the rib stitching first.  See my Jenny build thread below for an example.

Sounds like a really good project, I'm looking forward to seeing it go together.

John Witt
John Witt
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