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Author Topic: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?  (Read 4261 times)

Offline RknRusty

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What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« on: May 25, 2014, 08:45:03 PM »
I'm thinking of finishing my new Skyray with nothing but clear on the fuselage. I'll silkspan it first, sand it smooth, and then coat it with something clear and fuelproof. I just don't know what to use. On recent planes, I've been laying silkspan over solid balsa with Minwax Polycrylic, then painting. But without paint, the PCrylic would turn into a quick mess when exposed to fuel.

I have a Baby Streak that was built by my RC club prez., and is finished like that, but he can't seem to remember what he coated it with. I really love the look, and it seems absolutely impenetrable by wet fresh fuel. Any suggestions? I'm guessing the answer will be Sig or Brodak butyrate dope. Brushed on, I hope(or Pre-Val)? Available at the hardware store?

Since the Skyay will have the Streak look, this is a mini version of what I want:
.
Thanks,
Rusty
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Offline john e. holliday

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #1 on: May 25, 2014, 08:57:11 PM »
I think it takes several weeks for the polycrylic clear to fully cure.   Just don't let raw fuel set on it for any length of time.  Will have to look but does Rustoleum have a spray clear?  But, then again it takes time for Rustoleum to cure completely.
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Offline RknRusty

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #2 on: May 25, 2014, 09:04:56 PM »
I think it takes several weeks for the polycrylic clear to fully cure.   Just don't let raw fuel set on it for any length of time.  Will have to look but does Rustoleum have a spray clear?  But, then again it takes time for Rustoleum to cure completely.
Rustoleum does have clear but it's known to not be fuel resistant.

What about Aerogloss clear. I've seen it at my LHS in little bottles. Also, is sanding sealer necessary? This is a stunt trainer, so I want it to look nice, but looking great is really an unnecessary luxury. Some hardening and stiffening properties would be desirable too, as that likely has some effect on flyability on a profile.
Thanks, Doc and everyone.
Rusty
« Last Edit: May 25, 2014, 09:48:45 PM by RknRusty »
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Offline wwwarbird

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #3 on: May 26, 2014, 12:25:34 AM »
 What's wrong with just using clear dope?
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Offline RknRusty

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #4 on: May 26, 2014, 01:10:34 AM »
What's wrong with just using clear dope?
Warbird, maybe that's the answer. I've never used dope before and know little about it. So if I buy some Sig or Brodak clear butyrate, use it to lay my silkspan on, sand it and paint it again with the dope, I'm in business?
Rusty
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Offline wwwarbird

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #5 on: May 26, 2014, 08:19:33 AM »
Warbird, maybe that's the answer. I've never used dope before and know little about it. So if I buy some Sig or Brodak clear butyrate, use it to lay my silkspan on, sand it and paint it again with the dope, I'm in business?
Rusty

 Pretty much, if it's going to be your final finish (clear) just make sure that you have good solid coverage everywhere. Once you have your silkspan on and sanded I'd go with at least 5 or 6 more good heavy coats of a 50/50 clear/thinner mix, sanding in between. Let it dry a few days and go fly, simple as that. y1
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Offline Paul Wood

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #6 on: May 26, 2014, 08:46:30 AM »
Rusty,

The polycrylic is water based and therefore not fuel proof, as you know.  But, the polyurethane is solvent based and fairly fuel resistant.  The urethane is heavy, but it covers well with two coats, so the weight is minimal on a small plane.  It does dry with a little amber tint, but on bare wood, I doubt if you would notice.  I think it actually enhances the look of the wood.  You do not need a sealer.  The urethane acts as its own sealer.

Paul

Offline RknRusty

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #7 on: May 26, 2014, 09:43:00 AM »
Thanks guys, I think I'm in business now.

Bye the way, that old Baby Streak in the picture is faintly amber. I bet that's what it is, solvent based urethane. I'll post a picture when I get it done.
Rusty
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Offline Mike Haverly

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #8 on: May 26, 2014, 04:02:33 PM »
20 minute finishing epoxy works well also.  Apply with a sponge applicator and wipe most of it off with paper a paper towel.  It will leave a rough finish to be sanded smooth and shine as you wish. 
Mike

Offline Randy Powell

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #9 on: May 26, 2014, 05:41:59 PM »
You can also use polyester resin.
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Offline RknRusty

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #10 on: May 26, 2014, 07:51:23 PM »
Thanks, guys. These are now in my file called, "Answers to questions that I won't have to ask again."

For this quick utilitarian plane, I'm going with the solvent based urethane.
Rusty
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Offline Derek Barry

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #11 on: May 27, 2014, 05:54:57 AM »
Hey Rusty,

Just so you know, the AMA number goes on the outboard wing. I doubt if anyone would give you a hard time about it but...

Derek

Offline RknRusty

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #12 on: May 27, 2014, 06:14:31 AM »
Hey Rusty,

Just so you know, the AMA number goes on the outboard wing. I doubt if anyone would give you a hard time about it but...

Derek
Haha I never noticed it's on the wrong side, but thanks. That's my RC club president's number. He gave me that Streak with a Norvel .061 when I joined the Jackson Flyers. Mine are all on the correct wing. And seven digits long! ::) Seems like they would start adding a letter sometime.
Rusty
DON'T PANIC!
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Offline Avaiojet

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #13 on: May 27, 2014, 06:44:35 AM »
RRC,

You could use auto clear on your wood.

Bring a small jar to your local auto body shop.

Probably get it for free.
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Offline Brett Buck

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #14 on: May 27, 2014, 08:55:07 AM »
What's wrong with just using clear dope?

  Clear dope (any type) is only slightly more fuel-resistant than Polycrylic. I would suggest Klass-Kote clear.
     
    Brett

Offline Dennis Toth

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #15 on: May 27, 2014, 06:39:23 PM »
One way to do this is to use clear dope 50/50 for say 8 coats, after the forth coat sand with 400 paper then apply the next four coats. Let it dry for a couple days, again sand with 400. Wipe off with degreaser, make sure you have all the mount holes drilled. Then either brush on or spray (with a Preval power sparyer - Home Depot cheap) KBS Diamond Clear (http://www.kbs-coatings.com/DiamondFinish-Clear.html). Mike G introduced us to this (do a search) and I gave it a try on a rebuild project. I just brush it on, it has no brush marks or overlaps it is totally fuel proof, one coat and done.

Best,       DennisT

Offline Steve Helmick

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #16 on: May 27, 2014, 06:41:16 PM »
If you cover the fuselage and tail surfaces with silkspan/clear dope, it will not look (at all) like bare wood. If you cover the solid areas with .75 oz/yard fiberglass cloth, and use clear epoxy, the FG will be pretty much transparent. White silk and clear dope would be pretty close. Cover the fuselage before installing the wing or tail surfaces.  H^^ Steve
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Offline RknRusty

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #17 on: May 29, 2014, 12:41:09 PM »
Okay, I went shopping today. Didn't make it to Lowes, but I checked out the DIY section at Wally World and looked at two products.

Minwax Polyurethane said not recommended for outdoor use, but since my plane doesn't live outside, maybe okay.
Minwax Spar Urethane for outdoor use. Maybe the same thing with added UV protection, resisting yellowing, etc. Probably better.

They didn't have the Spar in a small can, so I left it on the shelf. I'll see if Lowes has a small can. Cash flow management ya' know.
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Offline RknRusty

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #18 on: May 29, 2014, 12:46:54 PM »
If you cover the fuselage and tail surfaces with silkspan/clear dope, it will not look (at all) like bare wood...  H^^ Steve
Thanks for the warning. When I silkspanned my Yak-9 fuse with Polycrilic, it looked like bare wood. Now that I've decided to go with Solvent based Urethane, I'll do a test piece. If it doesn't look naked, I'll skip the silkspan.
Rusty
« Last Edit: May 29, 2014, 05:41:21 PM by RknRusty »
DON'T PANIC!
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while you're doing it!

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Offline Mike Haverly

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #19 on: May 29, 2014, 03:03:05 PM »
I've used both of those products, one on my boat and the other on a chair, their intended uses.  Epoxy is miles better in terms of fuel proofing, either Klass-Kote  or 20 minute finish epoxy.  http://www.amazon.com/Finish-cure-20min-epoxy-4-5oz-Smith/dp/B001NIC3VW  The cost difference is small.  You won't (or shouldn't) use more than about 1 1/2 ounces.   Can't say we didn't try.
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Offline RknRusty

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #20 on: May 29, 2014, 05:40:42 PM »
...Can't say we didn't try.
Nope, and I do appreciate it. I always epoxy the front end no matter what the final topcoat.
Rusty
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Offline ray copeland

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #21 on: May 29, 2014, 08:37:32 PM »
Rusty, i have always (well maybe after the first few airplanes including the Skyray), used Minwax polyurethane for a finish coat. Only problem i have ever had is the yellowing effect, especially if it is too heavy . Should do fine on bare wood. Also,  that KBS crystal clear would be great on bare wood, maybe you could borrow enough from someone to try on a 1/2a fuselage.
Ray from Greensboro, North Carolina , six laps inverted so far with my hand held vertically!!! (forgot to mention, none level!) AMA# 902150

Offline RknRusty

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #22 on: May 29, 2014, 08:51:12 PM »
Rusty, i have always (well maybe after the first few airplanes including the Skyray), used Minwax polyurethane for a finish coat. Only problem i have ever had is the yellowing effect, especially if it is too heavy . Should do fine on bare wood. Also,  that KBS crystal clear would be great on bare wood, maybe you could borrow enough from someone to try on a 1/2a fuselage.
Hi Ray.
Do you mean the stuff in the top can in my picture, rather than the Spar? Or just either one.
Rusty
DON'T PANIC!
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Offline ray copeland

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #23 on: May 30, 2014, 04:13:21 AM »
Top can, only in spray version.
Ray from Greensboro, North Carolina , six laps inverted so far with my hand held vertically!!! (forgot to mention, none level!) AMA# 902150

Offline RknRusty

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #24 on: May 30, 2014, 04:56:41 AM »
Excellent, got it. Thanks for the advice. I'll post a picture when she's built. I'm just finishing the wing now.
Rusty
DON'T PANIC!
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Offline RknRusty

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Re: What to finish/fuelproof with for a bare wood grain look?
« Reply #25 on: July 03, 2014, 08:34:52 PM »
Whenever I start a thread with a question, I like to follow up with whatever line of advice I followed and how it's working out. As I mentioned I'm building a new Skyray disguised as a Streak and was asking about finishing part of it with a natural wood finish. Not a showpiece, just a decent looking utility plane. Paul Wood and Ray Copeland both said a couple of coats of Minwax Polyurethane would do the job.

So it's coming along nicely and I've started coating some of the parts. I lightly foam brushed the  parts of the elevator and stab to prevent warping while waiting to be hinged. I sanded it thin and smooth and while gluing the hinges in I had to wipe some epoxy off of the wood with acetone. It didn't faze the urethane. I also tried alcohol and it was equally impervious to that. Very encouraging. Boy, a tiny bit gives great coverage too, I really like it. Here's what they look like after the first coat before sanding, which made them look even better.

It's all hinged up with the second coat drying now. The fuse behind the doublers will also get the bare look.

Here's the rudder, still needs some shaping to get some fat out and the proper Streak curves.


I'll pick a color for it after I paint the front end. Since I'm using aluminum Monokote flames on the front of the wing with Sky blue behind it I'm hoping to paint the nose and doublers Krylon aluminum. I have a test board drying to see if that paint can withstand Lustrekote or Minwax. If not, I'll go yellow on the front, and then decide on a color for the rudder. Maybe yellow, maybe silver. I'll cut the Streak shaped wingtips after mounting the wing and adding the flaps.

Anyway, that's what I came up with after starting this thread. Thanks for the answers.
Rusty
DON'T PANIC!
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while you're doing it!

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Metrolina Control Line Society (MCLS) - Huntersville, NC - The Carolina Gang
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