Author Topic: The science of refinish (Read 8451 times)

Randy Powell · « **Reply #50 on:** April 03, 2012, 07:28:51 PM »

Tim,

One of the drawbacks of my profession.

And the stab is in and a new rudder on. The new flaps and elevator are cut out but not done yet (though the hinge slots are in). I decided to use built up flaps this time as it is somewhat easier to keep them straight. I'll post some more pictures when it gets just a touch further along.

PJ Rowland · « **Reply #51 on:** April 04, 2012, 10:27:03 PM »

Randy you are giving me nightmare flashbacks.... was that your intention to cause me grief ?

I thought we were past this stage................

Randy Powell · « **Reply #52 on:** April 05, 2012, 02:04:44 PM »

If anyone is getting grief, it's me.

I keep looking at this cool planes I have that I spent months building that didn't pan out for one reason or another. I decided that I'd rather fix a couple of them, give a couple away and salvage the rest rather than having them take up space and be hanger queens. I do have one that is really pretty but flies like a toad and my wife wants me to polish it up, bring it in the house and hang it up: objet d'art I guess.

Randy Powell · « **Reply #53 on:** April 07, 2012, 07:44:47 PM »

OK, more pictures. Re-fitting the cowl right now. then will build the flaps.

wwwarbird · « **Reply #54 on:** April 07, 2012, 10:44:16 PM »

It really amazes me how quickly and easily you got the 'String stripped down and ready for rework, especially how clean it appears to have come out of the process. Makes me want to pull something off the wall and strip it down just to see if I can do it.

Gotta keep going on this Nobler-bash thing for now though.

Randy Powell · « **Reply #55 on:** April 07, 2012, 11:41:36 PM »

Wayne,

Yea, most of 2 months putting a finish on and about 2 hours taking it off. Sigh...

The cowl warped a bit in the process so it's taking a bit to get it refitted. Hope to finish that up tomorrow then I can get the new flaps built and start the finishing process.

I'm trying to decide if I should go with a scheme similar to what I did before, a more scale scheme or something along the lines of a racer flying today. Guess we'll see what strikes me.

wwwarbird · « **Reply #56 on:** April 07, 2012, 11:50:56 PM »

My vote goes for the more scale scheme, maybe even the infamous chartruse, paying homage to the true roots of the Shoestring.

Howard Rush · « **Reply #57 on:** April 08, 2012, 12:21:27 AM »

Quote from: Randy Powell on April 05, 2012, 02:04:44 PM

I do have one that is really pretty but flies like a toad and my wife wants me to polish it up, bring it in the house and hang it up: objet d'art I guess.

Dave Pellerin decorated his house with stunters. His office was painted Fokker Red to match an airplane. If you did that, you'd have to put pearl in the house paint and go through even more anguish. Better just fly the thing. We'll put some VGs on it and get it up to snuff.

John Sunderland · « **Reply #58 on:** April 08, 2012, 12:50:46 AM »

Randy you have built a scad more nice looking ships than i have. But my experience with paint strippers on stunters was a sad one. I would have sworn that thinnered the residue off very well and resanded prio to new tissue and dope. So i refinish this thing and rubb it to a fare-the-well! So I take it in to work to show the guys in our refinishing shop....warm early summer day. When I come out of work a 5 I pull it out one more time...and it has bubbled and wrinkled and bubbled in ways that could only make a stunt guy cry!

So double check you get all that crap off and let her gas off a bit too before the refin.

Bill Little · « **Reply #59 on:** April 08, 2012, 04:27:42 PM »

Quote from: Randy Powell on April 07, 2012, 11:41:36 PM

Wayne,

Yea, most of 2 months putting a finish on and about 2 hours taking it off. Sigh...

The cowl warped a bit in the process so it's taking a bit to get it refitted. Hope to finish that up tomorrow then I can get the new flaps built and start the finishing process.

I'm trying to decide if I should go with a scheme similar to what I did before, a more scale scheme or something along the lines of a racer flying today. Guess we'll see what strikes me.

Hi Randy,

I totally agree with Wayne and want you to put a scale finish on it. I think the Brodak profile decals would work on it just fine. I would love to see you pull off that Cadillac Chartreuse and Red paint scheme.

Bill

Randy Powell · « **Reply #60 on:** April 08, 2012, 05:53:34 PM »

Sorry guys, no chartreuse. If I do a scale like scheme, it will be the Spud Runner, the Kreimendahl Shoestring IV or maybe if I'm going crazy, the Yellow Jacket.

But I will probably go with a shoulda' been racer scheme.

On the stripper; I used it before on the Cobra I have. It worked without issue. I did clean it well after stripping and it gassed off for a couple of weeks (which the Shoestring is doing right now while I get stuff done on it.

Mike Keville · « **Reply #61 on:** April 08, 2012, 06:37:15 PM »

Quote from: Bill Little on April 08, 2012, 04:27:42 PM

. . . I would love to see you pull off that Cadillac Chartreuse and Red paint scheme.

Concur! The only genuine paint/trim scheme, as seen on the ORIGINAL Shoestring - as opposed to the often-seen light yellow and later blue/orange schemes.

wwwarbird · « **Reply #62 on:** April 08, 2012, 06:56:54 PM »

Not too long ago I saw a photo of a Shoestring finished in a bright lime green, almost a neon color, and then with red trim. I think it was from one of the clubs out in the northeast/east coast. It looked really cool.

Randy Powell · « **Reply #63 on:** April 08, 2012, 09:01:28 PM »

Wayne,

Lime green and red? Really? I would through up on the shop floor.

This is the only green plane I've ever done and there is not likely to be a repeat. Green trees, gray skies and a green plane. Not happening again.

wwwarbird · « **Reply #64 on:** April 09, 2012, 12:29:06 AM »

I know it sounds nasty, but this plane actually looked really good. I'll have to see if I can find the photo.

Randy Powell · « **Reply #65 on:** April 09, 2012, 09:58:24 AM »

No Green!

Might try the bottom one in a different color, though

wwwarbird · « **Reply #66 on:** April 09, 2012, 11:40:42 AM »

That looks pretty slick too.

Seems I always go after the scale or replica type schemes when modeling "real" aircraft. What museum is that pic of the green one from?

I wonder what Mark is working on?

Mark Scarborough · « **Reply #67 on:** April 09, 2012, 11:55:49 AM »

Mark has been writing his next column for Stunt News,, and spending time at my moms house helping her prepare for a mega yard sale, in preperation for selling the house and moving,, the 109 is still on the bench, still in progress,, Just kind of stalled for life and family issues sadly,, but onyl temporary I hope,,

wwwarbird · « **Reply #68 on:** April 09, 2012, 12:05:33 PM »

Just seeing if you were paying attention Mark.

Hopefully all goes well and you can get back at it soon.

Randy Powell · « **Reply #69 on:** April 09, 2012, 12:29:08 PM »

Wayne,

I think it's the Reno museum, but that may not be right. I just snagged the picture for illustrative purposes.

Tim Wescott · « **Reply #70 on:** April 09, 2012, 02:41:25 PM »

Quote from: Mark Scarborough on April 09, 2012, 11:55:49 AM

the 109 is still on the bench, still in progress,, Just kind of stalled for life

Stalled for life. Oh dear -- this is a setback.

Mark Scarborough · « **Reply #71 on:** April 09, 2012, 03:09:57 PM »

Tim,,
again
well played,,
shall I rephrase,,
life has interfered momentarily, and has stalled the project,,
My MOM needs my help,, and thus, priorities,,

Tim Wescott · « **Reply #72 on:** April 09, 2012, 03:29:00 PM »

Quote from: Mark Scarborough on April 09, 2012, 03:09:57 PM

Tim,,
again
well played,,
shall I rephrase,,
life has interfered momentarily, and has stalled the project,,
My MOM needs my help,, and thus, priorities,,

Oh -- I forgot the

, didn't I?

(Hey -- how come there's no "who, me?" smiley?)

Walter Hicks · « **Reply #73 on:** April 09, 2012, 06:58:31 PM »

Randy, have you ever stripped the paint off of a plane that had auto clear on it? If so how ?

Randy Powell · « **Reply #74 on:** April 09, 2012, 08:54:57 PM »

Walter,

Yea, this one and the Cobra I did both had catalyzed polyurethane topcoat (and this one will again). This stuff will eat epoxy if you leave it on long enough. Weirdly, it doesn't seem to bother CA.

Dennis Adamisin · « **Reply #75 on:** April 10, 2012, 08:47:18 AM »

Randy:
I am contemplating stripping a foam wing - will the stripper "stop" at removing the tissue or is it likely to keep going right through to the foam? I would presume it is NOT foam safe! Also this is a very old early generation foamie with contact cement (not epoxy) holding down the skins...

Randy Powell · « **Reply #76 on:** April 10, 2012, 10:37:21 AM »

Dennis,

I suppose it would depend on whether the stripper soaked through the wood to the foam. I'm pretty sure it would eat foam up. If you did it in small sections, it may work OK, but I would think it is "use at your own risk". There may be other strippers that would work. When I bought the can of Jasco stripper, there were about 6 other types for various uses.

Tim Wescott · « **Reply #77 on:** April 10, 2012, 12:01:41 PM »

My experience with stripper is from long ago, when my dad hired all of us kids to strip a car for a customer, using stripper and putty knives. I distinctly recall the paint coming off in layers: you'd put some stripper on an area, then before it dried out you'd scrape off paint. Usually you just got one layer, with patches of the next coat down underneath (there were lots of coats of paint on that car).

So I think if you did like Randy says, and go slow and careful, that you would have a chance at getting it done. The downside is that if you did melt some foam, it would be hard to tell and extremely difficult to fix.

But, the more I think about it, the more I think that unless the tissue itself is in bad shape, this might be a job that's better handled by sanding. Just sand off the dope until you're not quite into the paper; if the job was done well the first time and there's not too much hanger rash, you should be in pretty good shape to just finish the thing from there. If the original finish job wasn't done well but there's not too much serious hanger rash, then just keep sanding until you're at bare wood.

Randy Powell · « **Reply #78 on:** April 12, 2012, 08:27:31 PM »

No work on the thing this week. It's been an interesting time. Hope to get back to work on it this weekend.

PJ Rowland · « **Reply #79 on:** April 12, 2012, 11:18:32 PM »

Its amazing how quickly paint stripper will pull off months of painting..

Randy - Remember ? Im trying to forget...

Everytime I read this thread I shudder... I think I will choose to no longer follow this, sorry bud..

Randy Powell · « **Reply #80 on:** April 13, 2012, 10:57:04 AM »

Ah, PJ, this time it has a purpose not related to frenzied activity or bad paint reactions. I'm actually having fun with it. I have two other planes that may get the same treatment.

Tom Niebuhr · « **Reply #81 on:** April 13, 2012, 10:00:30 PM »

Randy,
How are you neutralizing the stripper?

PJ Rowland · « **Reply #82 on:** April 14, 2012, 12:34:52 AM »

Tom : I have used acetone in the past.

Randy may use something different.

Id be interested to know if you ever solved the problem with this plane?

Randy Powell · « **Reply #83 on:** April 14, 2012, 11:48:04 AM »

I used alcohol to wipe it down after stripping. Did the same on the Cobra and that seemed to work pretty well.

I hope I fix the problem. I certainly spent enough time checking the alignment after building the new stab. and this stab is largely flat with just the leading edge shaped.

Bill Little · « **Reply #84 on:** April 14, 2012, 02:49:24 PM »

Brother Randy,

I feel confident that the ix you made will work out just fine. Now, on to the finish!

BIG Bear
RNMM/AMM

Randy Powell · « **Reply #85 on:** April 14, 2012, 06:50:13 PM »

Well, I spent like 3 hours today getting the cowl to fit correctly. Got the flaps framed up and largely built. Will hinge those tomorrow and finish shaping then just have to sand the whole airframe down and start the finish,

Randy Powell · « **Reply #86 on:** April 15, 2012, 07:28:01 PM »

OK, ready (finally) to start refinish.

Mark Scarborough · « **Reply #87 on:** April 15, 2012, 07:44:08 PM »

Nice Randy, Have you figured out your new paitn scheme yet? and do you need to redo all the fillets this time around?

wwwarbird · « **Reply #88 on:** April 15, 2012, 08:48:15 PM »

Quote from: Mark Scarborough on April 15, 2012, 07:44:08 PM

and do you need to redo all the fillets this time around?

Hey Randy, do the covering before the fillets.

Two bucks sez the top is gonna be red.

Randy Powell · « **Reply #89 on:** April 15, 2012, 09:09:01 PM »

Mark,

yes, I have the paint scheme worked out. And yes, I have to do the fillets again ... after covering. Or recovering.

Wayne,

I'll take a money order or you can do paypal.

wwwarbird · « **Reply #90 on:** April 16, 2012, 10:43:57 AM »

Quote from: Randy Powell on April 15, 2012, 09:09:01 PM

Wayne,

I'll take a money order or you can do paypal.

Staying tuned for further progress...

Randy Powell · « **Reply #91 on:** April 16, 2012, 11:31:40 AM »

Oh, there will be red, but not around the canopy. Maybe I'll paint it all black.

Randy Powell · « **Reply #92 on:** April 16, 2012, 05:32:10 PM »

More like Hawser.

Randy Powell · « **Reply #93 on:** April 22, 2012, 11:05:50 AM »

And there's more. I put a coat of clear on it and it won't completely dry. Probably some sort of reaction to the stripper. Didn't do that before. So I wiped the plane down with acetone and tried again. We'll see what we have when I go out. Seems I'm always working my way around some problem. Oh well, I'll figure it out.

Randy Powell · « **Reply #94 on:** April 22, 2012, 07:43:31 PM »

OK, all is well. Should be able to start covering once this most recent coat of clear is dry.

Mark Scarborough · « **Reply #95 on:** April 22, 2012, 08:59:11 PM »

glad you sorted it out Randy,, whats the odds of seeing it in Eugene

Randy Powell · « **Reply #96 on:** April 23, 2012, 10:57:10 AM »

Low. But I may work on it enough. We'll have top see.

wwwarbird · « **Reply #97 on:** May 08, 2012, 07:00:00 PM »

Anything new at the "Powellworks"?

PJ Rowland · « **Reply #98 on:** May 08, 2012, 10:17:51 PM »

Cowabunger dude!

Randy Powell · « **Reply #99 on:** June 02, 2012, 06:17:58 PM »

OK, guys, it's covered and has 2 coats of clear on it. I ran out of clear and am awaiting delivery of some Certified clear. But it's moving again.

Author Topic: The science of refinish (Read 8451 times)

Walter Hicks