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Author Topic: How much dope?  (Read 3099 times)

Offline Tim Wescott

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How much dope?
« on: February 25, 2015, 06:53:11 PM »
I searched for an answer and found this thread: http://stunthanger.com/smf/index.php/topic,21566.0.html, and while it appears that the answer for the color coats is "not much", I didn't get an idea of how much clear and how much thinner.

I'm thinking of just getting a pint each of red, white and blue (or a quart each, if I get Randolph), and as much clear and thinner as you folks tell me I should buy.  Base coat will be white, with blue and red trim.

So -- how much clear, and how much thinner, should I buy to paint a Legacy so that I can be sure that I have enough?  I'll either be painting with Brodak or Randolph -- I understand that it's the same stuff, but I seem to remember that the Randolph dope is thicker, and thus you need less dope and more thinner, so I guess I need to be told by brand.

And, given that I live in Oregon which tends to be wet and cold or hot and dusty (but not, thankfully hot and humid, much), what should I get in the way of retarder to go with the weather?
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Offline Don Jenkins

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Re: How much dope?
« Reply #1 on: February 25, 2015, 07:26:37 PM »
I painted my Legacy with Brodak dope and a pint thinned 50% will give you at least two good coats for a base, and the white is pigment rich and covers quite well.  If humidity is low, lets say less than 40%, you should't really need any retarder, but if you use retarder keep it less than 20%.  I would recommend Brodak Crystal Clear for a top coat, thinned 60% and applied with 4 or 5 coats.  Good Luck.

Don

Offline Tim Wescott

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Re: How much dope?
« Reply #2 on: February 25, 2015, 09:34:31 PM »
So how much clear do I need for a whole plane, from the wood up, covering with polyspan?
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Offline Howard Rush

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Re: How much dope?
« Reply #3 on: February 25, 2015, 09:40:03 PM »
Get a quart of Randolph tautening clear, a gallon of Randolph nontautening clear, and a gallon of thinner: all butyrate.  If Bill Byles tells you different, go by what he says. 
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Offline Allan Perret

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Re: How much dope?
« Reply #4 on: February 26, 2015, 09:06:09 AM »
Randolph
2 quarts clear, one taut, one non-tart
1 quart of white,  will should use less than half, but you will use on other projects
1 gallon of thinner
pints are plenty for trim colors, you can us 1/2 pints or 4oz bottles from Sig or Brodak also.
Smallest pkg for Randolph retarder is quart I think
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Offline Dave_Trible

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Re: How much dope?
« Reply #5 on: February 26, 2015, 07:28:55 PM »
Tim assuming you plan to stay in the hobby then you'll use whatever quantity you buy.  I buy the clear in gallons (Certified from Aircraft Spruce) for 60- something and pints of Sig colored dope since for some reason the Certified clear is reasonable but colors aren't.  It's dense so lots of thinner.  I do perfectly well with the laquer thinner at Home Depot for 12-13 bucks a gallon.  The retarder is very pricey but I use either Certified or Sig.  I think the Sig dope might  finish a little lighter than the Certified.  For my newest project I ordered Sig Lite coat clear to save every gram....still waiting on the dope.  I always try to have enough wood and dope on hand for the one 'after' the one I'm building now.

How much is enough?  Depends on how much you thin the dope,  how good a finish you want,  if you need enough clear on top to sand and polish and just when you are ready to abandon the finish as Windy used to say.  There is also a place where you might have to decide on another appearance point or two OR back off to keep the weight down for performance.

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« Last Edit: February 26, 2015, 09:19:05 PM by Dave_Trible »
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Offline Randy Powell

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Re: How much dope?
« Reply #6 on: February 27, 2015, 02:54:49 PM »
I generally buy a gallon of non-taunt clear and a gallon of thinner. Goes quite a ways. I buy quarts of base color (white, yellow, whatever) and trim colors in pints. I current have about 40 trim colors under the bench and, I think, 2 quarts of white. Generally, I use a pint+ of clear (unthinned) on bare wood, around a pint to cover and build up base. If I'm using a primer of some sort (mixed clear, talc or zinc sterate or whatever, a bit of white and black to made gray) that's another pint+ or, as I have been doing, just building up with clear. Some sort of blocking coat (if white base color, I usually mix up a bit of light gray for this), Then whatever I need for trim colors. With the white base, if you use very thin blocking coat (maybe a couple of ounces used) then you can shoot on a very thin coat of white and it will cover in one coat (again, usually a couple of ounces + thinner). I haven't used clear dope for top coat in a bit but when I did, it is usually  6-8 coats sprayed and thinner about 50-50 or 60-40. That equates to around 2/3 of a quart of clear and the same of thinner. If done right on a ship the size of your Legacy, you shouldn't add more than 8-10ouces for finish from the wood up. I've gotten decent results and only shot about 6 total ounces worth.
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Offline Tim Wescott

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Re: How much dope?
« Reply #7 on: February 27, 2015, 03:24:00 PM »
I haven't used clear dope for top coat in a bit but when I did, it is usually  6-8 coats sprayed and thinner about 50-50 or 60-40.

What do you use for a top coat now?
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Offline billbyles

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Re: How much dope?
« Reply #8 on: February 28, 2015, 05:48:56 PM »
Get a quart of Randolph tautening clear, a gallon of Randolph nontautening clear, and a gallon of thinner: all butyrate.  If Bill Byles tells you different, go by what he says. 

Just before I got to Howard's post I was going to say exactly the same thing.  The clear should stretch for a few airplanes, and since you will be using the butyrate thinner for colors & clear you will likely get a couple of airplanes (maybe three) from that (depending on the in^2 of the project.)
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Offline Shug Emery

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Re: How much dope?
« Reply #9 on: March 01, 2015, 07:21:54 PM »
I painted my Legacy with Brodak dope and a pint thinned 50% will give you at least two good coats for a base, and the white is pigment rich and covers quite well.  If humidity is low, lets say less than 40%, you should't really need any retarder, but if you use retarder keep it less than 20%.  I would recommend Brodak Crystal Clear for a top coat, thinned 60% and applied with 4 or 5 coats.  Good Luck.

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Offline Steve Fitton

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Re: How much dope?
« Reply #10 on: March 03, 2015, 02:11:40 PM »
Do what Howard says
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Offline Randy Powell

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Re: How much dope?
« Reply #11 on: March 03, 2015, 03:25:59 PM »
Tim,

I've been using catalyzed polyurethane for a top coat for awhile. Though with electric, I may go back to butyrate since fuel soaking isn't an issue (unless someone spills fuel on it).
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