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Author Topic: Base color application  (Read 841 times)

Offline Randy Powell

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Base color application
« on: October 06, 2009, 01:12:34 PM »
A lot of us use a white base coat and the primary color that we apply trim to. One of the problems in using white is first, it doesn't tend to cover very well unless it's pumped up quite a bit with additional toners or second, you ended up having to shoot successive coats to get complete coverage, thus adding a lot of un-needed and undesired weight. Also, white is heavier per volume that other colors (black being the lightest) so if you use it, you really want to use as little a possible and still get the job done.

Anyway, the traditional method of getting around this lack of coverage is to shoot a blocking coat underneath the white. Various shade of gray are the most popular for this. I'm wondering if there are any opinions about the best color to use as a blocking coat under white? I've tried a couple of different ones including grey, gold and silver, but haven't hit on THE color to use yet. Gold or silver work great from a coverage and blocking perspective, but can (and have for me) cause adhesion problems.
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Offline Mark Scarborough

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Re: Base color application
« Reply #1 on: October 06, 2009, 01:20:50 PM »
Randy,
the standard in auto world is grey, most sealers are grey and some are tintable as well.
The grey used is typically a lot darker than you might think on first impression. The darker it is, the faster ( and less material ) it takes to cover.
as long as the base is uniform, the transparancy of the white isnt much of an issue, its the zebra stripes that make it difficult.

I too dont like silver or any metallic as a base.
One thing you may consider is to make your grey tinted towards one of the trim colors as this will give the white a very slight cast in the direction of a trim color and tends to make it *merge* better with the trim.

another trick is to make your white whiter by adding a drop of blue to it. It also makes the white cleaner and brighter looking,,
unless your going for dingy whites,,,,
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Offline Randy Powell

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Re: Base color application
« Reply #2 on: October 06, 2009, 01:57:52 PM »
Mark,

That would be "off" white.   8)

I'm thinking of using some stuff that I got awhile back from HOK. It's called baseblock. Comes in several colors that, according to directions, you choose based on the color you're putting over it. It's inert and is mixed with whatever binder you're using. In this case butyrate.
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Online John Miller

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Re: Base color application
« Reply #3 on: October 07, 2009, 09:40:02 AM »
One way that helps when using silver as a blocking coat, are a few coats of clear over the silver. It's not perfect, and I personally use grey mixed with white, but it will help.
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Online Matt Colan

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Re: Base color application
« Reply #4 on: October 07, 2009, 01:44:32 PM »
Since I've been watching Windy's videos on finishing lately I'll tell you what he does.  Well he does use silver as the base coat, which he says will have everything cover in 1 coat.  When he puts the masking tape on, he brushes a coat of clear around the tape line, and then sprays the color.  ON the tapes, nothing has ever lifted doing it that way, which I may use that since, like you say Randy, white is a tough color to get to cover well.


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Offline Clint Ormosen

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Re: Base color application
« Reply #5 on: October 07, 2009, 04:06:56 PM »
Randy, on the Playboy I used grey as the blocking coat and then gold as the base under the metallic green. What a mistake that was! The silver and the green are both semi transparent enough that in the bright sunlight, you can see the zebra stripes right through them. So, lesson learned. I'll always use a white or Lt grey as the base coat.
Unless someone has a better way.....
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Offline Randy Powell

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Re: Base color application
« Reply #6 on: October 08, 2009, 09:02:15 AM »
I'll let you guys know how the "baseblock" works. I plan to try it.
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Offline Derek Barry

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Re: Base color application
« Reply #7 on: October 09, 2009, 06:10:07 AM »
On white planes I always used polar grey. You do need to remember that white never looks like it is covering, you can put ten coats of white on your plane and still see the previous color. I never put more that three coats on, no matter what it looks like. When it dries it always looks better. Also if you are going to put trim colors on you plane (I am sure you will) this will add contrast and make your white look brighter. Don't be so worried about covering just put three even coats on and you should be fine. I have made the mistake of loading a plane with "refrigerator white" as Randy calls it.
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Offline Randy Powell

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Re: Base color application
« Reply #8 on: October 09, 2009, 12:55:03 PM »
Derek,

Yea, normally not much of a problem, but with this plane, due to me building it a couple ounces heavier than I'd planned, I want to get away with the lightest, decent finish I can. I did a test panel last night. I shot some HOK baseblock mixed with butyrate clear and thinned about 65%. One light coat of that covered very, very well. It's sort of charcoal colored (the recommend one to go under white). We'll see if the pub is true and one light coat of white will cover. I can tell you the baseblock doesn't weigh anything. Just the weight of a light coat of clear, as far as I can tell.
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Offline Derek Barry

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Re: Base color application
« Reply #9 on: October 10, 2009, 07:02:42 AM »
Randy,

I understand your pain my friend. My latest Evolution is not very light, it weighs about 8oz more than I would like. I hope that everything comes out good for you though.

C-ya later
Derek
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Offline Randy Powell

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Re: Base color application
« Reply #10 on: October 10, 2009, 03:13:27 PM »
Ty,

Yea, I thought about doing the whole thing backmasking. One layer of color. Problem is, I really need the all white base since I'm planning to use fairly transparent trim color. In the end, it should be OK. This plane is essentially the same as my Ringmaster Deluxe. That one weighed a whopping 56oz (pretty heavy for a bit under 600 square inches) and flew very well. This should come out in the same basic range, but hopefully an ounce or two lighter. It would have been killer at under 50oz, but it's not to be with this one.
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Offline Randy Powell

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Re: Base color application
« Reply #11 on: October 11, 2009, 12:24:46 PM »
By the way, still haven't shot the baseblock. Still sanding the substrate. Man,. this is taking forever.
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Offline Randy Powell

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Re: Base color application
« Reply #12 on: October 16, 2009, 01:43:32 PM »
I'm afraid I've kind of fallen off the pace. Had a bunch to do this week and haven't been out in the shop since Monday. Hopefully, since the weather is supposed to pound rain all weekend, I'll get some shop time in. I'll end up having to wait to shoot color though until the humidity drops below the current 92%.

Colors I'm looking at right now are charcoal, cream, a sort of orange and white but that is subject to change depending on whether I can get the cream color I want.
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