Painting in Basement

[Bryan Higgins]

Hello Stunt Hanger Flyers

It's me Bryan.  The new member , I have a very important question.  I had came across the old post of
everyone show there SHOP.  And seen that most members had a shop in there house,basement or
garage. 

My question is , Im fixing up my basement shop now. Inclosing the wall's with drywall and a moisture
barrier all the way around the walls.  Will a small window mounted exaust fan unit be enough to
spray primer and auto paint and clear.?

Im using new gravity feed spray guns to keep the over-spray down.  And will have a small exaust fan
unit like the one Randy Smith shows in his shop in the window.  I will do all my gun clean up outside
the house.  Is there anything else i can do to keep the fumes down and the overspray to a minimum.?

I will be using the new 3M Breathing Apparatus mask for protection.  I now Diisocyanates are the most
hazardous chemicals present in auto clears.  And to change the resporators filters from time to time.

I will be using a filter with my fan unit and change it often , But any other recomendations would be
welcome.  My shop size is 11'x13' and 8' Tall.  The window facing my big backyard is 24"x30" and i
live in a county not city limits.

This shop is just going to be used temporary until i build a garage out back.

[Rob Killick]

Hi Bryan ,

Just a word or two of caution ...

If you're using the 3M respirator make sure that you use an activated charcoal filter element with it . The charcoal filters will not provide you with adequate protection after twenty-four hours .
You should also have an adapter , per each charcoal filter for the proper pre-filter .
If you intend to use isocyanate's in your basemet , such as Imron , DON'T !!!
You will need a spray chamber and an air supplied respirator/full face mask and hazard type suit .

[Jim Oliver]

Hey Brian,

What these guys are telling you is correct!!

But-----the real bad news is what your wife will do to you after the odor gets upstairs!!!!
Don't ask how I know......


Cheers,
Jim

[Rudy Taube]

Hi Bryan,

SHORT ANSWER:

What the other guys said!

LONG ANSWER: ...... EDITORIAL: Please read at your own risk. 

A few alternatives:

1. Use a friends safer set up, even if you have to drive some distance to get there.

2. Contact your local auto paint shops. I have had some of my RC planes fuselages painted in their paint shops by them. The price was reasonable, and NO harm was done to my body. Just as importantly, no harm was done to my marriage! ;-)

3. Paint outside if possible. I know it is not perfect, but it's your body!

4. SAFEST SOLUTION: My solution for the past 30+ years has been to use "Monokote". NO medical problems for your body, NO poisoning of the wife and children, NO weeks of drying time, NO stress cracks, NO headaches, NO 1,000 hours of polishing, etc. :-) .... This method will also be lighter than 95% of the painted CL planes out there.

5. COMPROMISE TO ABOVE: Limit the amount of poison paint by just painting the fuselage, and using film covering on the wings and tail, they have by far the most area.

I have lost 3 close friends to Cancer (ages 48, 57, 61). All were modelers who sanded and painted most of their planes, used epoxies, etc.  All three had doctors that told them their model poisons were most likely the main cause to their cancer. NONE of them smoked, or had any family history of cancer. All three of them had wives who begged them to stop using these harmful chemicals years before they died from them.

It is your body, and your family members bodies that will suffer. Only you can say if a "paint" finish on your model plane is worth dying over. IMHO if you do not set up a completely safe environment for painting (like the professionals have to do to be safe) then I would NOT paint. It sounds like the set up you propose falls a little short of a safe environment?

But, this is just my opinion, I could be wrong, it has happened before. ;-)

Off the soap box

[Bryan Higgins]

Thanks Ty,Rob,Jim and Rudy.

All your suggestions are good ones. And i will go over each one. Especially the one that involves my
wife.  If i smell up the whole house , Im doomed......

[George]

Additional thought. Make sure no kids are playing outside near the window where you put the exhaust fan.

George

[taildragger-j3]

I know that $kote is a nasty word/concept to many "purists" but I have come to accept it. When I left modeling back in the 60's dope and silk or silkspan was about our only option. When I came back about 10 years ago, I discovered this "new" stuff and really believe it has been a positive experience overall. I still do some doping, etc. but I do it in my garage with the door open and a fan blowing out.

Watch out for the CA fumes too!!

[Michael Boucher]

Hi,  I'm very curious as to what products are being used?  Is it automotive finishes that are causing cancer?  Would really like to hear more on this.  Thanks,  Mike

[Bryan Higgins]

Hello Taildrager and Michael

I am using a paint system from Klasss Kote , It's called Xotic. 
It's Klasss Kotes True Auto Urethane System and it comes in
affordable 4oz. bottles. with Urethane reducer and directions.

I called Xotic Colors Inc. and they back it up as a true Auto
two stage Base and Clear Coat system.

They say it's much safer to use and ranks right up there with
PPG.

After all im not painting cars. I just want a nice base coat
that will paint on flat with no gloss binders so i can apply
some cool trim scemes and then shoot it with a fuel proof
clear.  So far everyone seems to like it. And they have a
large selection of solid colors,metalics,pearls and candies
in a wide array of colors.
It also sounds like it is less odersome then other auto
name brands ......  Im buying mine strait from Xotic for
retail half as much as klass kote.  But Klass kote people
are still a real nice bunch of guys.
I still like to ask stunthanger members advice , they have
been a real help to me getting back into C/L.
                                           Thanks guys  Bryan

[Bryan Higgins]

Here is the shop in progress.

[Bryan Higgins]

Another.

[Bryan Higgins]

I need a software program to resize my pictures.

[Bryan Higgins]

And the last one. You can see my project for this summer!

[frank carlisle]

All the crap will kill you Bryan.....slowly to be sure....but eventually you won't be able to breath. The dust from sanding literally saturates the air in your basement work shop. Put a strong fan in that window.

[Terry Bolin]

Hello Brian and welcome! Your basement shop is gonna be great! I have worked in my Basement for 6 years now and like that I am in the house instead of a detached building that I used before. Plus you are acessable to your family this way. My work area is actually exposed to the living area down stairs but with a little care, Doesn't make a mess. You and your wife will appreciate the extra effort. When I sand, I step outside and brush it off before going back in, When I use the Dremel saw, I use a shop vac wire tied or held up next to the blade. When I touch up a edge with sandpaper inside, I hold the piece in the trash can to sand  The family makes a comment about epoxy smell every once in a while but, they too are getting used to it. I don't like dope or  balsa with dope on it in the house or garage. The smell just creeps in everywhere. (Especially brodak), I perfer sig or pactra brand for smell. Brodak is very offensive to me. Monokote is not as welcomed as dope but there is sure alot of effort goes into a good job of covering. alot more durable and lighter that a dope finish. (okay now I'm outside the circle of friends) a Strong plus for monokote is that finishing my Chief added only 2 oz to  the weight. I know that alot of top fliers use the iron on covering on their wings to save weight. Louis Rankin showed up with a beautiful Oriental covered with Monokote last year. Also received a lot of attention because it was a good job.  I started with Monokote when it first came out in 1972( I think) and have not used many spray finishes at all since. When I do, I like the Lusterkote by Topflight, like my p-38.  Lusterkote cost about 7 a can unless on sale like it is at Tower in their "Stock up" department but if you actually figure all the cost of the materials you are buying including thinner for clean up, Lusterkote is cheaper. Good luck! and keep us posted.
Terry

[Jim Treace]

Hi Bryan,

SHORT ANSWER:

What the other guys said!

LONG ANSWER: ...... EDITORIAL: Please read at your own risk. 

A few alternatives:

1. Use a friends safer set up, even if you have to drive some distance to get there.

2. Contact your local auto paint shops. I have had some of my RC planes fuselages painted in their paint shops by them. The price was reasonable, and NO harm was done to my body. Just as importantly, no harm was done to my marriage! ;-)

3. Paint outside if possible. I know it is not perfect, but it's your body!

4. SAFEST SOLUTION: My solution for the past 30+ years has been to use "Monokote". NO medical problems for your body, NO poisoning of the wife and children, NO weeks of drying time, NO stress cracks, NO headaches, NO 1,000 hours of polishing, etc. :-) .... This method will also be lighter than 95% of the painted CL planes out there.

5. COMPROMISE TO ABOVE: Limit the amount of poison paint by just painting the fuselage, and using film covering on the wings and tail, they have by far the most area.

I have lost 3 close friends to Cancer (ages 48, 57, 61). All were modelers who sanded and painted most of their planes, used epoxies, etc.  All three had doctors that told them their model poisons were most likely the main cause to their cancer. NONE of them smoked, or had any family history of cancer. All three of them had wives who begged them to stop using these harmful chemicals years before they died from them.

It is your body, and your family members bodies that will suffer. Only you can say if a "paint" finish on your model plane is worth dying over. IMHO if you do not set up a completely safe environment for painting (like the professionals have to do to be safe) then I would NOT paint. It sounds like the set up you propose falls a little short of a safe environment?

But, this is just my opinion, I could be wrong, it has happened before. ;-)

Off the soap box

I am not a professional painter, but I did try to set up a paint/spray booth room that is a bit safer than just "free spraying". My wife gave me the fits about being in a room with all the paint vapors (even wearing a mask), so I finally put up the $ and did the best I could with the space and $ I had. My room, is 15x12x9. Spray paint booth from Paasche with following specs:
Working Dim: 6' wide x 2'6" deep x 2' high
Overall Dim: 6'4" wide x 3'2" deep x 2'2" high
18" Fan with sparkles aluminum blade 
1/4 HP, 1ph, 115 volt explosion proof motor
1550 CFM at 1/4" static pressure
With this unit turned on, I have to slightly open the door to allow enough air flow into the room. This thing really sucks the air and it just about eliminates all overspray.
Compressor is outside and plumbed into the filter on the wall above/right of booth.
I still wear a mask.
I know that not every one can do this, but the advice given on this thread, by all about safty is absoultely on target.
Jim


 

[Bryan Higgins]

Thank you -   Terry & Jim

Both of you have helped me with a few problems i had to solve.  I think i will be all right temporarily till i build
my shop out side.  I'm going to put in a good fan and be smart on picking paints and using other applications.

Both of you have great shops it appears and have been doing this hobby for sometime.  I appreciate you helping
me .  I don't have all the awnsers butt i am learning alot from you guy's thanks to this site......

Wow - nice paint booth Jim a top notch shop .                             

[Will Hinton]

Hey Jim Oliver - In reference to your comment "don't ask me how I kow"  I KNOW HOW YOU KNOW!  (I know too!!! )
Will