Author Topic: My next kit. (Read 3473 times)

Pat · « **on:** August 18, 2012, 06:41:18 PM »

Hi all.

While waiting for my newest kit to arrive, I have been thinking about what my next kit will be. Any suggestions on a big ship that uses I-Beam wing construction(Ribs and half ribs)? A long time ago I saw a kit in the hobby show that had this type of construction and it looked fine and light. (no cap strips on the ribs). Also can anyone tell me the diffrence between an Aldrich and Geiske Nobler?

Pat

Matt Colan · « **Reply #1 on:** August 18, 2012, 07:05:48 PM »

Quote from: Pat on August 18, 2012, 06:41:18 PM

Hi all.

While waiting for my newest kit to arrive, I have been thinking about what my next kit will be. Any suggestions on a big ship that uses I-Beam wing construction(Ribs and half ribs)? A long time ago I saw a kit in the hobby show that had this type of construction and it looked fine and light. (no cap strips on the ribs). Also can anyone tell me the diffrence between an Aldrich and Geiske Nobler?

Pat

USA-1 would be on top of my list for a big I-beam ship. It's on my to build list in the future. There's also the Super Ares, Juno, Collossous, and others.

As far as I know, others could give more info than me, but one of the differences between the aldrich and Geiske Nobler is the airfoil. I heard Bob Gieske took a sharpie and traced around the original airfoil, and then using that as his airfoil for his wing, making it thicker.

Pat · « **Reply #2 on:** August 18, 2012, 07:17:04 PM »

Matt,

Thanks for the insight into the noblers. Now all I have to do is find one of the kits you mentioned!

Pat

john e. holliday · « **Reply #3 on:** August 19, 2012, 07:28:39 AM »

Sign up on "RiteAuction" and put your request in the want portion of the site.

Now if you ever get a chance to see pictures of the Aldrich Nobler and the Gieske Nobler you can a lot of differences.

SteveMoon · « **Reply #4 on:** August 19, 2012, 01:50:36 PM »

Pat: As far as the differences between the Nobler and G Nobler are concerned
the main difference I know of is that Bob used 3/32 balsa wing sheeting instead
of 1/16 balsa, thus increasing the airfoil thickness as well as adding strength
to the wing. The rudder shape is also different and I believe the depth of the
fuse forward of the wing is slightly more. Also, Bob built many, many versions
of the G Nobler with different wing spans, stab sizes, etc.

Steve

Pat · « **Reply #5 on:** August 19, 2012, 03:16:11 PM »

Who originally kitted the Ares? Or will the Brodak kit use the ribs and half ribs that the original used. I ask this because I want to try an build the I-Beam style wing as an experance. I have already built several other Brodak kits so I am well aquainted with that style wing.

Pat

PatRobinson · « **Reply #6 on:** August 19, 2012, 05:39:03 PM »

Hi Pat,
I have a suggestion for you. I looked up Parkton North Carolina and saw that it was in eastern Carolina and perhaps within reasonable distance to our very own "Big Bear" Bill Little who it happens is one of the most experienced I-Beam builders in the Carolinas. Bill is a great guy and I suggest you send Bill a personal message and ask him to be your coach if you have questions or need help.
Big Bill, I'm not volunteering you but you were a coach and teacher in real life and you really are a good I-Beam guy and Pat "may" be close enough to be a flying buddy although I didn't check distances.

Pat, also feel free to meet up wth the rest of the "Carolina Gang" at Huntersville for contests or just to fly.
Good Luck and have fun,
Pat Robinson

Pat · « **Reply #7 on:** August 19, 2012, 06:42:55 PM »

Pat,
I have already been in contact with Bill. I have sent him a message telling him I would like to get together but have not heard back from him yet. Thank you for the input though, I am willing to listen to, and learn from anyone!

Pat Maset

Bill Little · « **Reply #8 on:** August 19, 2012, 07:58:12 PM »

Quote from: Pat on August 19, 2012, 06:42:55 PM

Pat,
I have already been in contact with Bill. I have sent him a message telling him I would like to get together but have not heard back from him yet. Thank you for the input though, I am willing to listen to, and learn from anyone!

Pat Maset

Hi Pat and Pat!

I have been out of town since Friday and will be home tomorrow afternoon/evening. Just got internet access so I checked in.

Pat · « **Reply #9 on:** August 19, 2012, 08:16:47 PM »

Bill,

At some point I am going to want to pick your brain about building an I-Beam ship. I would love to get together some time and try and learn something.

Pat

Pat · « **Reply #10 on:** August 19, 2012, 08:23:00 PM »

Bill,

I may be in Aberdeen tomorrow, how would I get hold of you over there if I was?

Pat.

Balsa Butcher · « **Reply #11 on:** August 19, 2012, 09:33:49 PM »

Getting back to your question: The original Ares was kitted by Ambroid. It was also briefly kitted by Control Line Classics in the 90's. The Brodak kit is based on that kit and is an I-beamer.

Pat · « **Reply #12 on:** August 19, 2012, 09:45:21 PM »

Great!
That makes life easier than trying to find an original kit. Thank you very much!

john e. holliday · « **Reply #13 on:** August 20, 2012, 08:36:09 AM »

If you can't get to Big Bear's place to learn how to do an I-Beam, go to the Vendors Corner section of this site. Bobby Hunt has/had a video done by Billy Werwage hisself on how to do I-Beam wings.

Bill Little · « **Reply #14 on:** August 20, 2012, 04:54:20 PM »

Quote from: Balsa Butcher on August 19, 2012, 09:33:49 PM

Getting back to your question: The original Ares was kitted by Ambroid. It was also briefly kitted by Control Line Classics in the 90's. The Brodak kit is based on that kit and is an I-beamer.

Hi Pete,

It is my understanding that the Brodak kit is the '59 Ares (Walker Trophy winner) which has never been done as a kit before. Billy said that he gave Ambroid the drawings for the '58 version since they tried to get him on the money for the rights.

Bill

Pat · « **Reply #15 on:** August 20, 2012, 05:59:30 PM »

Bill,

I am thinking of doing a Neptune II as my I-Beam kit as I know it is an I-Beam plane first off, and second, I would like to experiance a kit that isn't a Brodak(I certainly have NOTHING against the Brodak kits, but have never built anything else). I also have a bid on a Walter Umland Cobra on EBAY. Maybe that will be the one you get to coach me through!

Pat

Leester · « **Reply #16 on:** August 20, 2012, 06:22:00 PM »

You could get the Brodak short kit of the Cobra if Fleabay doesn't work out. It is laser cut but no hardware and you have to supply the stick,sheet and blocks of wood.

Bill Little · « **Reply #17 on:** August 21, 2012, 12:34:52 PM »

Quote from: Pat on August 20, 2012, 05:59:30 PM

Bill,

I am thinking of doing a Neptune II as my I-Beam kit as I know it is an I-Beam plane first off, and second, I would like to experiance a kit that isn't a Brodak(I certainly have NOTHING against the Brodak kits, but have never built anything else). I also have a bid on a Walter Umland Cobra on EBAY. Maybe that will be the one you get to coach me through!

Pat

HI Pat,

Either kit should be great. A short time at my place and you will be up and running on the I-Beam. They are super simple to build.

BIG Bear
RNMM/AMM

Pat · « **Reply #18 on:** August 21, 2012, 03:49:47 PM »

Bill,

That is providing I am not an "un-trainable" monkey!

Bill Little · « **Reply #19 on:** August 21, 2012, 04:20:03 PM »

Quote from: Pat on August 21, 2012, 03:49:47 PM

Bill,

That is providing I am not an "un-trainable" monkey!

No problem. You will pick it up quick. I have two I-beams under construction and one in repairs. So you can see everything about one. See my post in your other thread about engines.

Bill

Pat · « **Reply #20 on:** August 21, 2012, 05:53:00 PM »

Bill,

I saw the post. At the moment I have NO engines to use, so I will have to buy engines to fit the planes. I had ALL of my Control Line stuff stolen from my house here in Carolina by a renter (a cop) while I was stationed in Texas for two years. He got 3 Fox .35's (one a hemi), a nice O.S. Max, a super tiger .51, and a K&B .61. Along with the Sig chipmonk I built for my daughter, a Brodak profile Oriental I built for my son, and the original Sig Magnum I built for myself! Definatly a black day when I found out. He got all this along with about 6 grand worh of shop tools, and 6-7 grand worth of race engine stuff for my dragster!

Pat

Randy Cuberly · « **Reply #21 on:** August 22, 2012, 12:47:44 AM »

This photo is of my Gieseke Nobler at VSC this year. I tried to post a picture of Jim Hoffmans 57 Nobler also but can't get it small enough.
Maybe someone else can post a picture of the 57 and/or 52 Aldrich Noblers.
Bob G. told me on the phone many years ago that he arrived at the airfoil by tracing over ribs with the sheeting and capstrips in place and them adding 3/32 sheeting over the top of that. It really is quite a bit thicker than the 57 which is thicker than the 52 (Original Nobler).
Moments are pretty much the same.

Suggestion for a big I beamer would be a Collossus. I'm currently building one from a kit by Walter Umland...teriffic kit and a great flying Classic airplane. Gordon Delany had one a few years ago and it won a bunch of hardware for him.
Mine is being built around a RO Jett 61 RE with a muffler. I think Gordon's used a ST51.

Randy Cuberly

Pat · « **Reply #22 on:** August 22, 2012, 06:33:14 AM »

Randy,

That is a pretty airplane! I have slowly been learning more about the Noblers. What does the thicker airfoil do?

Pat

john e. holliday · « **Reply #23 on:** August 22, 2012, 08:09:05 AM »

More lift at slower speed.

Michael Boucher · « **Reply #24 on:** August 22, 2012, 08:50:10 AM »

How about a Fouga Magister?

Randy Cuberly · « **Reply #25 on:** August 22, 2012, 10:51:48 AM »

Quote from: Pat on August 22, 2012, 06:33:14 AM

Randy,

That is a pretty airplane! I have slowly been learning more about the Noblers. What does the thicker airfoil do?

Pat

Yeah, essentially, Doc is right. Theoretically it allows harder corners at slower speeds without stalling. In reality though, that also has a lot to do with weight and power.
The thicker airfoil will carry a little more weight. The Nobler in the photo only weighs 39 oz with an Aerotiger 36 and could stand a little more weght in the wind. Weight and speed equals line tension. It has, however, the hardest and flatest corner of any airplane I've flown in 50 years!
It isn't the easiest airplane to fly however as it requires concentration...No it's not tail heavy...it's not unstable, but it is very responsive.

Randy Cuberly

Pat · « **Reply #26 on:** August 22, 2012, 06:49:49 PM »

Thank you Ty, that is the kind of input I needed. The Brodak kit will go on my purchase list(Along with a Cobra, Neptune, and a new Nobler).

Pat