Gilbert Engines

[Dick Pacini]

I was a guy's house today who had a slew of RC stuff for sale.  He had a box of engines and one he pulled out was a C/L engine named Gilbert.  It was about a 15/19 size.  The thing that seemed unique was that it had a rear intake and  dual exhausts with a removable header pipe on each side.  He asked me if I knew anything about it, but I had no clue.

I did a Google search and found a couple on eBay.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/GILBERT-11-MODEL-AIRPLANE-ENGINE-CONTROL-LINE-PROPELLER-VINTAGE-/230769364584

[Garf]

Fox .09, Gilbert .07, Gilbert .11, fishing weights.

[Tim Wescott]

That's not rear intake as in rear disk, drum or bell intake, for better breathing and performance and whatnot.  That's a piston-timed intake that happens to be in the back of the engine -- for low cost and to heck with the performance.  It's probably the most modern-looking piston-timed engine I've seen (with the exception of the weed whacker engines) -- but I'm not much of a vintage engine mavin.

Piston timed engines are, uh, economical.  No holes to be drilled in the crankshaft, no extra sweat over the crank to case seal due to the timing, no rear disks, etc..  And, they'll run just as badly well in reverse as forward!

I wouldn't be so cruel as to characterize it as a "fishing weight", but if I got one it would be for an old sport free-flight design that would be built for slow RC for sunny calm days.

[Hoss Cain]

I was a guy's house today who had a slew of RC stuff for sale. He had a box of engines and one he pulled out was a C/L engine named Gilbert.  It was about a 15/19 size.  The thing that seemed unique was that it had a rear intake and  dual exhausts with a removable header pipe on each side.  He asked me if I knew anything about it, but I had no clue.

Back in about the 1964-65 era I purchased a rather nice Gilbert plastic model for my 6 year old son. It had the Gilbert .11. The airplane was eons ahead of the Cox plastics of the time. It flew well. The wing had a symmetrical airfoil and ample area, and as I imagine back, about 24" span. The engine was easy to start, ran very reliably, yet it was not a significant power house. Over the time period I came across probably half a dozen of them. They were designed to do a specific job and IMO for a small price they did it well.

My son was not at that time all that interested in the toy yet he soloed it after a few instructional flights. No recollection of what happened to it. Between my military travels in that era, and on to the airline world, I was lucky to keep up with a handful of good engines over those few years.  

[jim ivey]

we made 250.000 of them. real simple desgn. easy starting. ty hoss cain JIM

[Mike Lauerman]

I built a wood tethercar from scaled-down plans...oak side rails, balsa body, 'Bunch-type' 1930s Midget style. Wheelbase was 15", and it had the Gilbert Twinstack in the engine compartment, very sharp looking. (never finished rear drive, car was a 'static' model when I traded it off)

Absolutely a conversation piece, esp. because of the Twin Stacks, then the observor would exclaim: "It's a Rear Rotor!"

I have a few of those little Gilberts. (one guy called it "the Baby Hassad"...a large compliment.)

[jim ivey]

NOT a rear rotor,  its a rear intake!

[dennis lipsett]

Polks sold a ton of them for $5.00 each your choice with prop,tank and extra plug. I picked up a few at the W.R.A.M. show back in the 80's Never bothered to run them and this thread made me go look for them. still in the bags but they are turning black. I didn't think that they were made out of magnesium.
I believe that Duke fox had something to do with the design. The Gilbert 11 plug is interchangeable with the Fox 09/10 and the Cox 09 plug. Never bothered to check what the 07 fit.

Dennis

[jim ivey]

die cast AUMINUM NO MAG.   DUKE did no design work, bob holland designed it. duke did screw machine work for us. jim

[dennis lipsett]

Jim.
Thanks for the info. I was sure that it was aluminum  and that I had read that Duke had some hand in it.
I remember the adds and thinking that they were some of the ugliest plastics that were ever offered. But the catapult was kind of neat.

Dennis

[George]

I got a few of the .07's when Polks was selling them off. Some of mine were from an ultra-light RTF and came with pusher props, and some came as bags of parts. All ran well except one. That one was in a bag and had an unfinished crankshaft. I keep it for spare parts.

I also picked up a Gilbert .11 at a yard sale that was missing the thrust washer and prop nut. I used ones from a Fox .15 steel head to run the Gilbert, then put them back on the Fox. The .11 ran well for me.

I have only broken-in the engines and have not run them extensively so I can not speak for how long they will last. I can say they started easily and handled well. Being a side port engine, the needle is safe for kids to handle.

George

[Dalton Hammett]

I have used the Gilbert .11 on models like the Sig Buster and they have been pretty quick starters and flew very well.  I used them as trainers and at club outings we had a lot of people fly them.  For the cost they worked pretty well.  You can still purchase them very cheaply as well as the glow heads and parts.

Dalton H.

[Don Curry AMA 267060]

A couple of guys in the Fireballs have several and have had fun with them on 1/2 A sized planes. They may not be competition level but fun is fun.
Don

[john e. holliday]

This is what we need.  Something that starts easily and will perform when needed for the sport flyer.   

[Dalton Hammett]

There is a gentleman named Stephen Brown in Pa. who ended up with a warehouse of gilbert parts and engines.  Last I knew he would sell an .11 with an original store card,  extra head, prop and some other misc. parts for around $25.00. That is for a NEW engine from the 60's.    He also had .07s as far as I know.  I bought a number of the .11s from him for beginner planes.

Dalton H.

[jim ivey]

Same  guy designed the F-22 raptor !!  What engines or jet fighters did you design? it was designed for a partitcular purpose within certain paramaters required by gilbert. it exceded  all !  every time somr one made a rude remark around bob about that engine. he'd say "yeah but it runs good, starts easy too, how about yours?"        jim

[Andrew Tinsley]

Hello,
I back what Jim says. They are great little engines for youngsters to break their teeth on! Being a side port design, they start very easily (Just like a Mills diesel). They have more than enough power to fly free flight models and if you watch the weight, they can pull a basic control line model. Oh and they are cheap and spare parts are still available. Now what is wrong with that? Horses for courses I say! Just one word of warning. don't use the nifty looking silencers for C/L, they rob too much power!

Regards,

Andrew.

[George]

Well put, Andrew. I'm guessing that Gilbert chose those non-standard sizes so they would remain sport engines.

I would guess something like a Ringmaster Jr., a Junior Flite Streak or a Flying Clown for a profile, and perhaps a Wee Duper Zilch for a built-up.

Perhaps .012 x 42' lines.

Does that sound reasonable?

For the Gilbert .07...one of the current 1/2A profiles or a Veco Scout for built-up?

George

[Bill Mohrbacher]

Duke Fox didn't design the Gilbert "Thunderheads".  They look like the old Fox Rocket .09 and are sideports like it was, but they are not Fox's design.  The Fox Rocket .09 was out in 1959.  The Gilberts were out in 1962, built by Dynamic Models (formerly Johnson) and designed by Bob Holland of the Wasp/Holland Hornet fame.  Bob Pelfrey did a fine job of research on them and presented his results to MECA members at EXPO V in Muncie in 2004.  Then Bob's excellent paper was published in Tim Dannels's Engine Collectors Journal, issue #173, September 2005.  You can still get this issue from Tim www.modelenginecollecting.com .

Fox actually made some parts for Dynamic, but did not design the engine!  Bob Holland worked for Lockheed in their "Skunk Works".  I met Bob at one of our MECA conventions (next one to be held in Pittsburgh this fall, Sept. 7-8-9  www.modelenginecollectors.org ).  Bob would never stand in the prop arc of a running engine.  Maybe because his Wasp would throw the blades off the plastic props common in the early 1950s!  Jim Ivey was at Dynamic with Hi Johnson and Bob Holland.