Bouncing a landing

[Paul Taylor]

If a plane lands on a grass circle (not a putting green) and the plane bounces 2 inches up and back down would this be a minor or major error and how many points are deducted?

[Dave_Trible]

When I do judging flying over grass I will usually judge to point the airplane touches down the first time since after that the pilot has little control over the issues in the turf.  However if the plane should flip over on arrival (very seldom since most who fly on grass have their airplane equipped for grass flying) I’d have to downgrade that.  More important is the approach angle and attitude of the airplane as it touches down.

Dave

[john e. holliday]

Most people try to land too slow when flying on grass.   My self I try to land like what we used to do in F2C Team Racing.  Set it down with a little speed and down elevator once wheels touch.

[Paul Taylor]

So would this be considered a minor or major error?

[Dan McEntee]

So would this be considered a minor or major error?

    Hi Paul;
     Consult the rule book and judges guide at the AMA web site. I may be wrong, but I seem to remember that flipping over was considered a crash. Some contests held on less than perfect grass circles would just give every one a set landing score, such as 30 or 35 points, unless was an outright lawn dart!! The SIG circles were on the grass runway at SIG Field in Hazels back yard. The runway had a crown to it, and was used by several GA type of airplanes soo it had some light rutting running length wise in spots, but generally wasn't too bad. You could find good spots to take off from and I found it best to try and land on one side of the circle or the other that was running with the ruts. When ready to set the model down try to aim for those spots, whip it a bit to stretch the glide out, and then try for a nice 3 point landing   just as the model runs out of air speed about 6 inches off the ground. Tricycle landing gear makes this a lot easier. And like anything else, practice makes perfect!!
   Type at you later,
  Dan McEntee

[Paul Taylor]

Thanks Dan I read the rule book.
Just trying to get a consensus of what is a minor and major error with regards to a “hop” possibility due to the terra firma.

[Dennis Toth]

Paul,
It depends on the event. For PA, Classic, N30 the ship should land smoothly with no bounce up where the wheels leave the ground, bouncing on rough ground would be minor (3-5 points), if the wheels leave the ground likely hit for 8 -12 point deduction, if it flips over without losing any parts it is an attempt scored a 10. If it loses parts (like breaks off the rudder) (prop break is not considered a loss of aircraft part) crash.

For OTS if it bounces and stay upright it is likely scored good. If it flips over does not lose parts- poor.

Maybe Keith T can jump in on the flip over issue.

Best,   DennisT

[Paul Taylor]

Thanks Dennis this is a start.

A correct landing is judged when the model descends smoothly to land with no bounce or unusual roughness, and without any part of the model other than the landing gear having touched the ground. Main wheel(s) or three-point landings are permissible. The maneuver ends when the model rolls to a stop. If the model is still moving when the 8 minute time limit elapses, the landing is considered incomplete, is scored as a zero, and pattern points are not awarded.
Maximum 40 points. Minimum 0 points.
Errors: An error is committed whenever the model bounces or when any part of the model other than the landing gear touches the ground. A crash, or a flip over, a belly or upside down landing receives no marks. An error occurs each time the model deviates from a smooth descent. Any unusual circumstances, outside the pilot’s control, which may have caused one of the above mentioned errors, will be taken into consideration by the judges. Note: It is permissible to extend (by whipping) the descent, to achieve the minimum two (2) laps between maneuvers, to maintain eligibility for pattern points.

No deviations from Rulebook dimensions” and requirements seen
Very few minor errors seen:
Few and/or minor errors seen: More and/or medium errors seen: Many and/or major errors seen:
14.10. Consideration of external factors
= Mark 40 points
= Marks range: 39-34 (Note 1) = Marks range: 33-26 (Note 2) = Marks range: 25-18 (Note 2) = Marks range: 17-10(Note 3

           With the exceptions mentioned in Landing (Paragraph 13.15.), “normal” external factors should not in any way affect the marks awarded by judges. So it is not permitted for judges’ marks to allow for the effects of gusty winds in marking any phase of any maneuver, except during the ground rollout phase of the Landing maneuver—for example, if a sudden fierce gust of wind coming from behind the model aircraft causes it to flip over or tip onto its nose during the last part of the ground rollout. This, therefore, means that factors such as wind, turbulence, gusts, and any other factors outside the competitor’s control should not normally influence the marks awarded by the judges. However, some individual exceptions to this general observation may occur occasionally—for example, a safety-related exception should be imminent danger of electrocution by thunderstorm. Exceptions should also be made where a completely “accidental” incident prevents the proper execution of a maneuver or forces a competitor to abandon a maneuver or a flight altogether (for example, an animal wandering into the flight circle). In cases where the head judge feels that such external factors have influenced the result of a competition flight, he should use his discretion and authority to recommend that the Contest Director grant a reflight