Beech Starship

[Dan McEntee]

    I have been working in and around the yard and garage today, and just heard an unusual twin engine sound outside. I live within ear shot of Lambert Field here in St. Louis, but don't hear anywhere near the amount of traffic over flying like we used to. I guess that is the main reason this one caught my ear and I knew I had heard it before. I ran outside and watched as a Beech Starship flew over. I have seen them up close and in the air at Oshkosh (Burt Rutan's airplane) and many years ago at a contest in Quincy Illinois. Bruce Shipp's dad , Alden, was a corporate pilot for Morman Feeds and the Quincy, IL newspaper. He got to fly a leg of a demo trip in a Starship from Kansas City, I think it was, back to Quincy and landed about he time the first round was over. We were flying on Morman's hanger ramp. Alden taxied up, swung around, shut down the engines, opened the door/stairway, got out, dropped to his knees and kissed the ground! He said he had never flown anything that was as heavy on the controls as that thing was! I think it was number 14 off the assembly line, and they may have only built around 20 or 25? I thought they were all recalled by Beech and chopped up. but  few must be remaining like Rutan's personal airplane. Any idea of how many more are still in service? It does have a nice, hot rod twin sound!
    Type at you later,
   Dan McEntee

[pmackenzie]

You sure it was not a Piaggio Avanti? Those are still around, similar layout ,and have a very distinctive sound.

According to Wikipedia only a few of the Beech aircraft are still flying.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beechcraft_Starship

[Pepe Llopis]

There are, at least , one beech starship operative.

[Jerry Eichten]

There's a Starship in McMinnville, Oregon.  I have to drive around it to mow the CL circles.

[Ted Fancher]

There are, at least , one beech starship operative.

I would agree with Pepe.  Seems the story was that one owner refused to return his.  My danged "Old Timers Disease" prevents any more details from emerging intact.  It was an interesting story at the time.  There were a number of the Piaggios still active back when I was still an analyst at the NASA ASRS and worked two or three reports involving them.  I can recall doing some on-line searches to familiarize myself with them; which caused me to do a short search re the Beech product and that was the source of my "then" info.

I have a younger brother up in the Renton, WA area who worked for a Beechcraft dealership in the Portland area during that "era" who might have some first hand info on the subject.  Next time we talk I'll bug him about them.



Ted

Update after a short search.  Here's a link  to one of many pages of photos and history of most of the 53 that were built.  The dates however seem to indicate the data is no later than 2012 at best...and that was just one of many pages of photos and info.

http://rps3.com/Pages/Starships%20NC-01%20to%20NC-10.htm

[Dan McEntee]

You sure it was not a Piaggio Avanti? Those are still around, similar layout ,and have a very distinctive sound.

According to Wikipedia only a few of the Beech aircraft are still flying.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beechcraft_Starship

     You know, I have seen those at Oshkosh also, and oddly enough, there used to be one that overflew my house on a regular basis. Similar , like you say, but still distinctively different if you get a good look at them. On the heading that they fly over, they are on a bee line to fly over the Lambert TCA and heading toward Spirit of St. Louis Airport in Chesterfield , MO. Funny you mention that because at first, that's what I thought it was. But it is low enough, (about 1000 feet at that point I'm guessing) and slow enough that you can get a good look at them. Now I'm REALLY curious as to who it might be!!!

  Type at you later,
  Dan McEntee

   PS to add: Just googled the Avanti to refresh my memory and big difference in the wing. If you have seen both before, and I have, there is no mixing them up. No big, tall T tail on the beech. It's a much more "flat" airplane!!

[De Hill]

There used to be a Starship based out of Riverside airport in south Tulsa. A company had a government contract for testing (?) and had leased the Starship from it's owner. It may still be flying; I haven't seen it in a while, though.

[Brett Buck]

I thought they were all recalled by Beech and chopped up. but  few must be remaining like Rutan's personal airplane. Any idea of how many more are still in service? It does have a nice, hot rod twin sound!

  Quick research suggests 8-9 of them are still operating. It wasn't "recalled" as there wasn't anything wrong with it, aside from not being profitable. Beech destroyed the remainding inventory as a tax writeoff, they sold the parts so someone to maintain the airplanes,  and still offer factory support.

    Brett

[Bruce Shipp]

https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all-news/2017/march/pilot/turbine-beech-starship

This is the most recent article I could find.  There is a Beechcraft fly in at the Tullahoma, TN Beechcraft museum every year and I believe 2 or 3 were there this year.

My dad still remembers that trip. His company, Moorman’s, had flown King Air 200s for many years and Executive Beechcraft in Kansas City, their only Beech dealer over the years, was giving them the hard sell to “upgrade” to a Starship.  His demo flight to Quincy was sometime between 1984 and 1986.  I flew two of the Quincy Contest in college but I had a college conflict that weekend and did not make it home.  That was unfortunate, as had I been free I would have likely been on the Starship and not flying the contest anyway.

Yes, he and the other Moorman's pilots were not exactly “smitten” with Beech’s new offering. They continued to fly KA200s  and  a Beechjet until my dad retired.

Thanks, Dan for the trip down memory lane.

Bruce

[Dan McEntee]

  Hey Bruce!
  I was hoping you would pop in and help me out if my memory was slipping. I figured I spelled Moorman's wrong! I remember your Dad being a big fan of the Beechjet! A Mitsubishi built under license by Beech?? It let them cover a lot more ground much faster and he got to sleep in his own bed more often and more home cooked meals! I'm surprised we never crossed paths at that contest. Between the sailplane contests and stunt contests, I made a lot of trips to Quincy and had a lot of fun. Bob Rogers always put on a good show with some extra fun stuff thrown in. We got to see and fly with all the upstate Illinois guys and some from Indiana. A big part of my memory lane!
  Type at you later,
   Dan McEntee

[dave siegler]

I read a book about someone that flew one around the world on extended vacation as single pilot. 

https://www.amazon.com/Starship-Diaries-Exploring-Planet-Aircraft/dp/0779500741

The book said that Beech had a buy back program. 

Think Beech made a smoking deal on any airplane if you traded in a starship.  They don't want the liability or the support costs, and wanted them out of flight status. 

Some did not take the offer.  but may be on their own on service parts or support. 

[FLOYD CARTER]

And here I thought the Citabria had heaviest controls of any production airplane.  It takes lots of muscle to horse one of those around the sky.

[frank williams]

What was the plane on the ramp at the Reno Nats that was similiar to the Beech or Piaggio?  They had a small building and were doing taxi tests.

[Balsa Butcher]

My educated guess is that would be Bill Lear's "Lear Fan" project. 3 completed, never certified in the USA. Project scuttled in the mid 80's. 

[frank williams]

Right, that was it! ..... a cool looking airplane ...

[Dave Hull]

Heaviest controls?  I've heard it was the B-24 Liberator. I didn't think the Citabria was bad. The Collings Foundation B-24 is on tour, at Torrance airport next week. Maybe their pilot could confirm the controls. The women ferry pilots back during the war years certainly noted the heavy controls.

Most annoying flyover noise?  Definitely the Piaggio, for me. If the Starship was louder or made an even more buzzing sound, then.....

Divot McSlow

[Dane Martin]

The Collings Foundation B-24 is on tour, at Torrance airport next week.

Divot McSlow

They were here at the henderson executive airport recently.

[Pepe Llopis]

Most annoying flyover noise?  Definitely the Piaggio, for me. If the Starship was louder or made an even more buzzing sound, then.....
Divot McSlow

I think the loudest plane in the world is Russian Tu-95 Bear

[peabody]

There was a Starship based at Teterboro a dozen or so years ago. Set the noise monitors abuzz almost every time it flew, especially when they used runway 6.

[Rick Palombi]

I've flown starships a few times. As to the heavy controls, they would seam bad to a King Air driver. More like a midsize business jet.
I suspect it was on purpose because most Rutan canards ailerons have very small breakout force and are easy to get into PIO.
I thought it flew very well. Rare for a Beechcraft it was directionally stable and rode great in turbulence. There were a few in Vegas
because they did the demos on hot summer days to show off the ride. The FAA didn't know what to do with it so they made them
overbuild it. Structure and lightning protection. It had high ref speeds because they were afraid someone would stall the canard in the
flare. They leased most of them with free maintenance. Collins didn't really want to support the mostly one off and obsolete avionics.
It really have a neat trick. You could pull the yolk full aft and let the canard stall. The nose would bob up and down. On the up cycle
apply full power. It would rotate to an extremely high pitch angle climbing and bobbing. Pull one to idle. It just keeps climbing.
Absolutely no drama except for the pilot sitting next to you thinking you are crazy!



Rick

[Pepe Llopis]

I've flown a Long EZ (yes, a lot of smaller) and is a dream to fly, no stall.

[Rick Palombi]

The wing doesn't stall. The canard stalls, flies, stalls, flies, etc. Control full aft. Just like the Long Eze.

[Chris McMillin]

The Staggering does something similar, Rick. Get it in a power off stall attitude but not all the way back on the stick and the top wing will stall and the bottom will keep flying and it will rock in pitch back and forth with a heck of sink rate.
Chris...

[jpollnow]

I can confirm I just saw a Starship on approach to KSUS.


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