Author Topic: your favorite engine in a Goldberg Shoestring (Read 3091 times)

YakNine · « **on:** May 28, 2013, 07:04:53 PM »

I am a retread most of my experience was with 1/2 a planes . I had 2 hand me down larger planes a Shoe String and a Yak Nine I flew the String a few times but really was still into my 1/2a stuff because I didn't have any gear for the bigger planes. The Yak I still have but the String mysteriously got smushed in the garage . I have had a kit for a string since 1983 or so I want to build it to keep in my office with its own set of gear in case I get a chance after work to go fly on a whim, I work about 8 miles from the club field but live about 45 miles away. So many times this year I wish I had a plane handy when the conditions were perfect, so that's my plan. I still have the Fox .35 from my original and it runs like a champ I also have a Fox 15 bb and a Veco 19 bb . I have lots of other engines as well but I would prefer to use an American made engine I can still get parts easily for. I am leaning towards the Fox .35 because I have been having a lot of fun flying an old Ringmaster I got off Craigslist with one
. I was wondering if the 15 would be strong enough, The Veco should be strong enough maybe I should get a Flying Clown for the 15. What are your thoughts,thanks T.J.

Clint Ormosen · « **Reply #1 on:** May 29, 2013, 02:21:03 AM »

My first Shoestring had a Fox 35. YAWN!!! My current one has a ST C-35 (flat top piston) in it. Much more fun!!

Thinking about swapping in ST G-21 .35

RknRusty · « **Reply #2 on:** May 29, 2013, 10:55:07 AM »

I've been told that on a Shoestring, if you want to use a Fox .35, it's such a shaker that the center ribs need to be braced to stiffen the airframe. A member here, Ken Cook, who has built several Strings, told me about it when I was working on mine. He might have said to use one solid balsa piece in place of the two center ribs supplied in the kit. I'll find his post on another forum, or either ask him to reply here with the details.
Rusty

EDIT: I found Ken's post. He said the Shoestring is bad about transmitting the Fox's vibrations. The best fix, he thinks, is to use a 1/2" solid balsa rib in the center under the fuse instead of the two thin ribs in the kit.
Post #2, first paragraph in this thread:
http://www.coxengineforum.com/t4070-my-shoestring-stunter-is-rtf?highlight=shoestring

I'm a lifetime 1/2A guy too. I recently joined here to learn about larger stunters. I just got my SS in the air recently.

Phil Bare · « **Reply #3 on:** May 29, 2013, 12:00:20 PM »

Quote from: YakNine on May 28, 2013, 07:04:53 PM

I am a retread most of my experience was with 1/2 a planes . I had 2 hand me down larger planes a Shoe String and a Yak Nine I flew the String a few times but really was still into my 1/2a stuff because I didn't have any gear for the bigger planes. The Yak I still have but the String mysteriously got smushed in the garage . I have had a kit for a string since 1983 or so I want to build it to keep in my office with its own set of gear in case I get a chance after work to go fly on a whim, I work about 8 miles from the club field but live about 45 miles away. So many times this year I wish I had a plane handy when the conditions were perfect, so that's my plan. I still have the Fox .35 from my original and it runs like a champ I also have a Fox 15 bb and a Veco 19 bb . I have lots of other engines as well but I would prefer to use an American made engine I can still get parts easily for. I am leaning towards the Fox .35 because I have been having a lot of fun flying an old Ringmaster I got off Craigslist with one
. I was wondering if the 15 would be strong enough, The Veco should be strong enough maybe I should get a Flying Clown for the 15. What are your thoughts,thanks T.J.

I would use the Fox .35, It has all the power that you need and there is so much stuff available for it today from after market suppliers plus from Fox themselves there is no good reason to consider anything else.
Phil Bare

Joseph Lijoi · « **Reply #4 on:** May 29, 2013, 02:36:30 PM »

Quote from: Phil Bare on May 29, 2013, 12:00:20 PM

I would use the Fox .35, It has all the power that you need and there is so much stuff available for it today from after market suppliers plus from Fox themselves there is no good reason to consider anything else.
Phil Bare

If you want to tinker and go aftermarket this is a good idea. If you want to fly the airplane and not have to modify lots of stuff buy an OS LA 25 and run it stock. Costs about the same if not cheaper. The Veco 19 would be interesting but I know nothing about these. Have fun!

Phil Bare · « **Reply #5 on:** May 29, 2013, 03:02:23 PM »

Joseph, break the Fox in properly and go fly. It will do the job and then some. I have Fox .29s and .35s that date back to 1949 and they still run and fly airplanes as well as ever.

Clint Ormosen · « **Reply #6 on:** May 29, 2013, 05:53:24 PM »

Quote from: Phil Bare on May 29, 2013, 03:02:23 PM

Joseph, break the Fox in properly and go fly. It will do the job and then some. I have Fox .29s and .35s that date back to 1949 and they still run and fly airplanes as well as ever.

.....and back in those days the Fox was the best choice. Nowadays it's not.

The LA 25 is lighter, breaks in faster, makes more power, vibrates less, and uses less fuel. Seem like the obvious choice.

Geoff Goodworth · « **Reply #7 on:** May 29, 2013, 07:37:54 PM »

If you can find a good one, the FP 20 handles the Shoestring just fine. If you have to use a new engine, the LA 25.

In construction using the Brodak kit, I assemble the root ribs with small blocks of 3/8" balsa in the leading and trailing edges. I also put a very small piece of 3/8" square bearer under the spar doublers. This ties the wing halves together nicely and provides a great bellcrank mount.

Phil Bare · « **Reply #8 on:** May 30, 2013, 06:49:28 AM »

The first post stated that the choices were a Fox .35, Veco .19, and a Fox .15.
No mention was made of an LA .25
I have all of the engines mentioned and all of them will fly a SS.
I have an S1 Ringmaster with a Fox.35 on it, an S1 Ringmaster with an LA .25 on it, a Flightstreak with a Veco .19 on it and a Clown with a Fox .15 BB on it.
They all fly and provide lots on enjoyment.

Phil Bare

Joseph Lijoi · « **Reply #9 on:** May 30, 2013, 10:26:08 AM »

Quote from: Phil Bare on May 30, 2013, 06:49:28 AM

The first post stated that the choices were a Fox .35, Veco .19, and a Fox .15.
No mention was made of an LA .25
I have all of the engines mentioned and all of them will fly a SS.
I have an S1 Ringmaster with a Fox.35 on it, an S1 Ringmaster with an LA .25 on it, a Flightstreak with a Veco .19 on it and a Clown with a Fox .15 BB on it.
They all fly and provide lots on enjoyment.

Phil Bare
[/quote

Phil you have been modeling for years and I respect that. You are correct about the choices stated. The guy also says he is having fun with a Ringmaster Fox 35 combo, so he should run what he is having fun with. My experiences with the Fox on profiles has not been that great, but my definition of fun might be different than his.

Phil Bare · « **Reply #10 on:** May 30, 2013, 03:09:29 PM »

Joseph, T.J. seems to be comfortable with running the Fox .35 so it just seemed sensible to me for him to use it. The Fox will do a nice 4-2-4 while the Veco .19 and the Fox .15 BB both need to be turned up.

Phil Bare.

YakNine · « **Reply #11 on:** May 31, 2013, 01:25:39 PM »

I am leaning towards the Fox .35 , In spite of all their quirks I get a kick out of tinkering with them , I am not out to win any trophies I am just enjoying them and reliving a bit of my childhood that I have so many fond memories of. I am a heavy equipment mechanic for the railroad which has really become hi tech and hi stress, going out to the field with my daughter is very relaxing to me. Plus when I flew back then I wanted a big plane with a Fox on it but cutting lawns at that time meant a lil'Jumpin Bean with a Baby Bee now I can have my Fox and fly it too, I think I actually have about 25 of them of several sizes and a lot of other old 4/2 break engines. My next plane after the String and the Flite Streak is gonna be a Twister with a series 21 .40 McCoy on it is it a good combo I don't know but I always wanted one I have a GMA prepped engine waiting for that one we will see what happens.Thanks T.J.

Balsa Butcher · « **Reply #12 on:** May 31, 2013, 01:38:41 PM »

As has been stated, there are many ways you can improve on a Fox 35. Two that I feel are money well spent is a stuffer back plate and an Aero-Products NVA. The AP NVA assembly does not require drilling out the case. Both items can be ordered through Randy Smith/Aero Products. I also recommend high castor fuel such as Powermaster GMA 10/28% or Sig all castor 10/25%. Other's opinions may differ.

Bill Little · « **Reply #13 on:** May 31, 2013, 02:09:25 PM »

Hi TJ,

I understand where you are coming from. You are more interested in having fun than having the very best competition set up. I am afraid that many of us answer these types of questions with our competitive background in our minds. From a strictly "performance" view point, then an OS .25LA, OS .20FP, Enya .30SS would probably do the best job. Of your "choices", I would go with the Fox .35, I have seen several of them fly with the Fox .35 and they flew well.

With all that said, I *would* get a stuffer back plate and one of Randy's NVA made for the Fox .35. His NVA will not leak air, is turned down to match the factory one, and will hold the setting very easily. Highly recommended.

Have Fun!!

BIG Bear
RNMM/AMM

Dennis Moritz · « **Reply #14 on:** May 31, 2013, 03:49:34 PM »

Tower 40 or equivalent FP40. Use the biggest chicken hopper you can fit. Needle to max revs with something like a 10-4. This is how I flew my Brodak Buster for years. Nice light wood. Always chased the Blues away. A favorite of mine.

Jim Kraft · « **Reply #15 on:** May 31, 2013, 05:46:17 PM »

The Fox aftermarket parts do help some, but on the other hand a well broken in stock Fox will run very nice with no mods. I have some of both and one of my favorite Fox 35's in on my Sterling Mustang. It is an older stock Fox that runs beautifully. My friend Andrew Hathaway has a well broken in one he got off of ebay on his Ringmaster that runs superb also. I have one that I bought new in the 60's that still runs well after many gallons of fuel through it. And for sport flying I just love flying the old Fox 35. There is just something about them that makes them so much fun to fly. Maybe it is just the memories we have of our early years of flying them.

Bill Little · « **Reply #16 on:** May 31, 2013, 06:12:57 PM »

Quote from: Jim Kraft on May 31, 2013, 05:46:17 PM

(snip) Maybe it is just the memories we have of our early years of flying them.

Hi Jim,

That is the reason I try and use all my "old" engines. I especially like my old Red Head McCoys. I have been getting extended life by using the Series 21 piston in the .29, .35, .40. The Dykes ring from Frank adds a lot of durability to them, with no harm to the run quality. When it comes to contest time, I will use my modern engines in my PAMPA class planes, but I often use a period correct engine in Classic, OTS, and Nos. 30. It really adds to the fun factor for me.

BIG Bear
RNMM/AMM

Balsa Butcher · « **Reply #17 on:** May 31, 2013, 06:31:18 PM »

There is an old saying that usually refers to why people like Harley Davidson Motorcycles over Japanese bikes but I find that it also applies to Fox engines: "If I have to explain it, you wouldn't understand".

Jim Kraft · « **Reply #18 on:** May 31, 2013, 06:45:29 PM »

Yeah Bill; I am also a fan of McCoy Red Heads. I run 29's, 35's, and my favorite the 40. I got back into control line in 94 after flying R/C pattern for 25 years, and decided I would just fly for fun. I do fly competition, but not very serious. My plane for classic, profile, and PA, is my Magician with the McCoy 40 Red Head. My old time planes are either Fox 35 or 59's, and also my old spark Anderson Spitfires. I guess I enjoy the challenge of flying old stuff.

Oh Yeah Balsa Butcher, I have an old Harley too. Maybe that explains it. LOL

YakNine · « **Reply #19 on:** May 31, 2013, 07:53:37 PM »

Nostalgia has a lot to do with it for me I farm on the side with a 1942 Allis Chalmers and a 1952 Farmall, I haul my farm machinery behind a 1968 F600 and use a 1967 F100 as my farm truck / equipment service truck. I like the old low tech stuff I just keep it around to keep memories alive Dad taught me how to drive a clutch in the F600 as soon as I could reach the pedals following the hay baler, they were good times. T.J.

RandySmith · « **Reply #20 on:** May 31, 2013, 09:41:01 PM »

Quote from: YakNine on May 31, 2013, 07:53:37 PM

Nostalgia has a lot to do with it for me I farm on the side with a 1942 Allis Chalmers and a 1952 Farmall, I haul my farm machinery behind a 1968 F600 and use a 1967 F100 as my farm truck / equipment service truck. I like the old low tech stuff I just keep it around to keep memories alive Dad taught me how to drive a clutch in the F600 as soon as I could reach the pedals following the hay baler, they were good times. T.J.

Now that's COOl !!

YakNine · « **Reply #21 on:** June 01, 2013, 09:07:40 AM »

Randy it sure has changed a lot around here in the last 35 years if the cops saw a 10 year old going down the road in a big old flatbed truck hauling a full load of hay back to the barn they would impound the truck and lock up the parents back then they just waved. I will say this When I started 5th grade my arm muscles looked like Popeye's from wrestling a manual steering F600 around the fields behind the baler and I am pretty sure I was the only kid in my class who knew how to split shift a 2 speed rear end .

YakNine · « **Reply #22 on:** June 01, 2013, 09:16:38 AM »

Back to the String I have a flea market Fox I have been running in on the stand and its pretty well bedded in , my biggest concern with the Fox is if I can squeeze a big enough tank in, and from the responses it looks like it can be done so I will go with the Fox. T.J.

RandySmith · « **Reply #23 on:** June 01, 2013, 10:02:22 AM »

Quote from: YakNine on June 01, 2013, 09:16:38 AM

Back to the String I have a flea market Fox I have been running in on the stand and its pretty well bedded in , my biggest concern with the Fox is if I can squeeze a big enough tank in, and from the responses it looks like it can be done so I will go with the Fox. T.J.

YOu should be able to put in a chicken hopper metal or a plastic tank, 3.5 or 4 ounces should be no trouble

Randy