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Author Topic: Weird Fox balance question  (Read 676 times)

Offline Larry Renger

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Weird Fox balance question
« on: October 18, 2018, 09:45:26 PM »
I am rebuilding a Ceramic cylinder Fox 35 which had a broken crank. The question is how much modification of the crankshaft balance is needed with the lightweight aluminum piston?

Or is there a way to weigh and calibrate what is needed? I faintly recall an article showing balancing half the weight of the piston and rod somehow.

Or can I do it with a good scale and calculator?

I realize that perfect balance is not possible, and even with the best static bance, dynamic balance will still be off, the ultimate solution being an electric Fox 35. (Electric motor installed in a Fox case, maybe with dual ball bearings in the crank area. (Gah! Kill me before I ppropigate!))
Think S.M.A.L.L. y'all and, it's all good, CL, FF and RC!

DesignMan
 BTW, Dracula Sucks!  A closed mouth gathers no feet!

Offline Dave Hull

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Re: Weird Fox balance question
« Reply #1 on: October 19, 2018, 12:04:34 AM »
Larry,
Glad you are getting the Fox fixed up.

The typical answer is that the crank counterbalance should balance out both the big end of the rod, plus somewhere around half of the reciprocating weight. That is, one half of the sum of the piston, wrist pin, and the small end of the rod.

Weigh the parts on a fractional gram scale. Add up to the total you want to shoot for. Make an equivalent dummy weight that goes on the crank pin. I have used concentric brass tubes trimmed for this. Then fiddle with the crank counterweight until you achieve balance.

If you don't have a fractional gram scale (I have a triple beam balance which only goes down to 1/10th gram), you can measure the parts and make approximations by calculations. Aluminum being around .097 lb/in3. (44.00 gm/in3 if you work in mixed units....) I don't have a Fox rod handy at the moment, but one end is probably around 0.8 or 0.9 gm.

I think for a stunt-Fox, you'd want to go for the full 1/2 recip mass. For a speed engine that doesn't get nearly the running time, you might shoot for less mass, because torsionally you have to accelerate the extra balance weight with each revolution and that takes power. Which is where all the arguing starts over the shaking, loss of power, and reduced mass moment of inertia....

Let me see if I archived one the engine articles.

Good luck,

Dave

Offline Dave Hull

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Re: Weird Fox balance question
« Reply #2 on: October 19, 2018, 12:11:25 AM »
Here's a link to a typical model engine balancing article:

     http://www.modelenginenews.org/etw/etw_bal/p2.html

I think it is generally acknowledged that the Fox 35 crank was underbalanced with the mehanite piston. The Larry Foster mods included packing the counterbalance to help reduce the vibration. So the stock crank might actually work better if the aluminum piston is lighter. Did Fox use the same cranks in the ceramic engines?

I saw a Fox the other day and noticed that the crank had a machining center drilled into it on the prop end. I thought that was probably a custom or aftermarket crank.

Dave

Offline Larry Renger

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Re: Weird Fox balance question
« Reply #3 on: October 19, 2018, 07:38:47 PM »
Thanks for the input. I think that the crank will remain stock with the Aluminum piston as advised, at least at first. It would be tough to unbalance a modified crank!  ;D

Actually, my ABC Fox seems to have some excess vibration, probably a modified crank, too. Otherwise, fantastic 2/4 break, runs with lots o’ power. When the Ceramic engine is back together, I’ll take a better look at the ABC internals.

I may need another stock crank.  :-[
Think S.M.A.L.L. y'all and, it's all good, CL, FF and RC!

DesignMan
 BTW, Dracula Sucks!  A closed mouth gathers no feet!


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