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Author Topic: Safety; why do I have to burp my engine?  (Read 1216 times)

Offline Peter Germann

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Safety; why do I have to burp my engine?
« on: October 05, 2009, 03:44:35 AM »
As I have just had a nasty accident when my own airplane slipped from my left hand when I burped the engine, I wonder why it is that I have to burp the motor a couple of times before the first flight of the day? (PA .75 / 14% Klotz + 4% Castor)

The reason why I do it is that, regardless of the position in which I store/transport the airplane, there is always a real lot of oil in the cavity of the plug when I try to start the motor with the model attached to the stooge. All I can do then (I fly alone) is to remove the plug, clean it and flip the motor a couple of times to empty the cylinder. If then, when trying to start, it floods again, I have to repeat the procedure.

Burping the motor three or four times with the model on its back solves the initial flooding problem permanently for an entire day of flying with mostly one flip starts.

Yes, using a device to hold the model safely on its back would of course help, but since my car is not really big I may have a problem carrying such a fixture.

My question therefore is whether there is a method solving the aforementioned problem of the flooded plug without having to burp the engine?

Kind regards, Peter Germann

Peter Germann

Offline Robert McHam

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Re: Safety; why do I have to burp my engine?
« Reply #1 on: October 05, 2009, 04:35:24 AM »
I think a better way is to remove the glow plug and store it in a caddy like the Higley "six pack" as shown and found here: https://www.quicktechhobby.com/Airplane_Accessories/harry_b%20higley.htm

When you get ready to fly at the field you install the plug. Surely the plug cannot foul with oil if it is in the caddy.

Robert
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Offline Ralph Wenzel (d)

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Re: Safety; why do I have to burp my engine?
« Reply #2 on: October 05, 2009, 04:38:52 AM »
I think a better way is to remove the glow plug and store it in a caddy like the Higley "six pack" as shown and found here: https://www.quicktechhobby.com/Airplane_Accessories/harry_b%20higley.htm

Robert

And loosely screw in an old plug to keep the bugs out . . .

(Too many irons; not enough fire)

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Alan Hahn

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Re: Safety; why do I have to burp my engine?
« Reply #3 on: October 05, 2009, 07:29:20 AM »
My guess is that if you are getting a lot of flooding in an inverted setup, you need to back-off on the initial choking.

I have a Brodak 40 (installed inverted in a Nobler) which also is sensitive to flooding, so I try to get the motor primed with a minimum of fuel. It is a bit tricky of course. However I do still flip the prop, but when I do, I try to remember it is armed and ready to go, even without the battery attached. Also I don't flip the prop with the plane inverted.

Of course that's what I try to do most of the time. I do have an occasional problem where I need to clear the motor like you describe. All I can say is to try and minimize the frequency.

Offline john e. holliday

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Re: Safety; why do I have to burp my engine?
« Reply #4 on: October 05, 2009, 09:24:21 AM »
The fellow I fly with once in a while has a block of foam that he lays his  plane on to burp or even start his engine.  Doesn't take much.  DOC Holliday
John E. "DOC" Holliday
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Shawnee, KANSAS  66203
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Offline Bob Reeves

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Re: Safety; why do I have to burp my engine?
« Reply #5 on: October 05, 2009, 11:27:47 AM »
I think burping does more than just clean the plug, it also insures you have no fuel or oil in the crank case to mess up your start procedure. One of the Tulsa members built us a couple airplane stands we put on pipe that can be removed for mowing. If you will go to the Pictures page on tulsacl.com and click on the 3rd photo from the left in the 3rd row down you will see a picture of one. http://www.tulsacl.com/Pictures.html

The stand itself is really small and transportation shouldn't be a problem.

Offline Peter Germann

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Re: Safety; why do I have to burp my engine?
« Reply #6 on: October 07, 2009, 06:01:20 AM »
Thanks for all the info and good wishes, friends. I will test a couple of the measures suggested  to prevent oil flooded plugs, in particular the idea of storing the motor with the piston at TDC, perhaps combined with removing the plug, seems definitely being worth a try.
First of all, however, I will build/buy, carry and USE a fixture to hold the airplane while burping the motor.
Again, thank you all, I will report findings...

Kind regards
Peter Germann

Offline RandySmith

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Re: Safety; why do I have to burp my engine?
« Reply #7 on: October 08, 2009, 07:25:59 PM »
HI Peter

WE have used for many years a plane holder made out of PCV pipe, it is very eay to make the cradle and you can use it to hold the plane for clean up after flying, working on it at the field, and I even use mine to transport the airplane in the back of my van. just buy enough 1 or 1.5 inch Plastic plumbing tube cut the parts to the proper lenght and Use the foam pipe wrap that is used to insulate hot water pipes, or to keep pipes from freezing. here You can buy that type of stuff at Home Depot stores, these are do it your self stores for home owners, they sell wood plumbing  electrical type items , I am sure you have similar.
I will take and post a picture of the PVC plane holder.

I hope your healing quickly and I was sorry to hear of your mishap

Regards
Randy

Offline michael battley

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Re: Safety; why do I have to burp my engine?
« Reply #8 on: October 13, 2009, 08:46:51 PM »
HI Peter

WE have used for many years a plane holder made out of PCV pipe, it is very eay to make the cradle and you can use it to hold the plane for clean up after flying, working on it at the field, and I even use mine to transport the airplane in the back of my van. just buy enough 1 or 1.5 inch Plastic plumbing tube cut the parts to the proper lenght and Use the foam pipe wrap that is used to insulate hot water pipes, or to keep pipes from freezing. here You can buy that type of stuff at Home Depot stores, these are do it your self stores for home owners, they sell wood plumbing  electrical type items , I am sure you have similar.
I will take and post a picture of the PVC plane holder.

I hope your healing quickly and I was sorry to hear of your mishap

Regards
Randy

Yes please do, I'm interested in making one of these.

Offline Ward Van Duzer

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Re: Safety; why do I have to burp my engine?
« Reply #9 on: October 14, 2009, 02:40:52 PM »
Peter,

The older we get...Well heres a couple of pics from the "dark side" of our field. The second one shows the threaded take apart connector that would help it fit in your car.

(OK, so the photos got reversed!)

Ward-O
I hate spelling errors, you mess up 2 letters and you are urined!

Don't hesitate to ask dumb questions.
They are easier to handle than dumb mistakes!  Ward-O AMA 6022

Offline Terry Bolin

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Re: Safety; why do I have to burp my engine?
« Reply #10 on: October 27, 2009, 08:38:41 AM »
I have two ST 51's inverted in planes and I need to burp them at the start of each day too but a real safe and cheep way to do this is to Purchase a $1.88 styrofoam cooler from walmart and cut a saddle in each end to hold the Fus. Then it all sitting on the ground where you  can hold it safely. ALSO, Hleps carry things like towels and cleaner. Good luck!

Offline Bill Little

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Re: Safety; why do I have to burp my engine?
« Reply #11 on: October 27, 2009, 08:53:26 AM »
I have built a coulpe of th ePVC plane holders for me and friends.  I got the original design from looking at Pappa Dave Hemstraught's.  Only glue needed ina few spots since the pipe will hold from friction fits.  I make an airfoil shaped bend inthe long sections to help cradle the wing.  A heat gun will soften the pipe enough to form it with your hands.  3/4 PVC and some fitting, plus the foam pipe insulation.  The front and rear *hangers* are inverted *U* shape and will adjust (by swinging forward or backward) to allow the plane to sit level.  About $10 worth of parts and 30 minutes to make.  I gave Dale and Derek Barry one which they seemed to really like.  I just have to remember to pack it when I go flying! LL~

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