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Author Topic: Something else for the LA 46  (Read 3436 times)

Offline dennis lipsett

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Something else for the LA 46
« on: September 04, 2011, 01:17:06 AM »
Perhaps this won't be new to many but it did cure a problem that I was having with one particular 46. No matter what I did it still would not settle down and give me the run that a 46 was expected to do. I was using a 12.25X3.75 APC prop, powermaster 5/22 or 10/22 depending on conditions. OS25 venturi, Randy NVA, an extra head gasket.and a thunderbolt plug. Tank was a Sullivan plumbed for uniflow. With all of this I couldn't get the engine to settle down. It was running more like the problimatical LA40's.
Went flying yesterday,Saturday, with some fairly  knowledgable guys and as it ran badly. I said that after all of the changes it had to be something simple that was being overlooked.
Skipping all of the debate on causes and condition the plug came into consideration and it was pointed out to me that the plug OS recommended was an A/3. This got the conversation to the length of the plug and a quick comparison of 2 specimen plugs. The difference is about one thread turn on the length of the plug and makes it I guess a medium thread. So we installed a RO/Jett plug and fired up and flew. The engine behaved perfectly with consistant 5.4 second laps and a clean quit each time. While I was aware of plug heat ranges I apparently forgot that length will also advance the timing as surely as the heat range.
This just might be the solution for all of those badly running LA 40's that we keep hearing about and it only cost a few bucks to find out. as for me I'm going to get a few more of these to put in the box as another trimming tool.
dennis

Offline Steve Helmick

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Re: Something else for the LA 46
« Reply #1 on: September 04, 2011, 10:36:50 PM »
I noticed that about OS A3 plugs the first time I got a "free" one with a .46...or .25LA. You would think they'd work ok on OS engines (newer ones, anyway), but I've mentioned several times that they are a "medium" length and will probably cause problems in other engines. Useful information and some vindication...thanks for posting your findings.

Randy Powell had an OS .35FP that didn't run for squat, and found that the cylinder had not been properly installed; not indexed to the alignment pin, but on top of it. Another potential issue if you take one apart.  D>K Steve
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Offline Bill Little

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Re: Something else for the LA 46
« Reply #2 on: September 05, 2011, 12:48:20 PM »
Thanks for sharing your findings guys.  I'm using the Thunderbolt plugs so I have not noticed that problem so far.

Many years ago we got an OS .46VF from Tower in the "Scratch and Dent section, almost new and for well less than 1/2 price. (gotta figure how "Cheap" I am! LOL!!) but it didn't run worth a hoot.  I pulled it down and found the cylinder was installed wrong from the factory.  Orientating it properly fixed the problem!  Turned out to be a great piped engine.  Later, PaPa Dave Hemstraught gave us one of Randy's AAC sleeve/piston set ups and we used the engine for a long time.

It wasn't the first engine that I had seen with parts improperly installed from the factory.......

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Offline Frank Imbriaco

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Re: Something else for the LA 46
« Reply #3 on: September 07, 2011, 06:43:48 AM »
I'm about to try an Enya # 3 (Hot) as soon as the heavens decide to stop pouring on the N.E.

Offline gwassenaar

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Re: Something else for the LA 46
« Reply #4 on: October 21, 2011, 08:31:29 AM »
I run my OS 46LA on a APC 12*4 with an Enya 3 plug. Due to pinging noises I put an extra head gasket in. Now it runs perfect, on 5% nitro and 20% castor oil.

Offline dennis lipsett

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Re: Something else for the LA 46
« Reply #5 on: October 23, 2011, 07:43:42 PM »
I run my OS 46LA on a APC 12*4 with an Enya 3 plug. Due to pinging noises I put an extra head gasket in. Now it runs perfect, on 5% nitro and 20% castor oil.

The Enya #3 is really a very hot plug and is used mostly in 4 cycle engines. We did use them in smaller heli engines also. The #4 would probably be a better match for the LA46 and you could get rid of the extra head gasket. That ultra hot plug had your timing advanced so far it was preigniting. You could also go down on nitro.
I'm sure that others also have a hint on what works.

Dennis

Offline Bill Little

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Re: Something else for the LA 46
« Reply #6 on: October 26, 2011, 02:06:49 PM »
When we started using the piped OS .40VFs, the Enya #3 was the "HOT" set up.  Only thing I disliked was that once you used your glow plug lighter on one, it wouldn't fit anything else! LOL!!

Big Bear
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Offline gwassenaar

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Re: Something else for the LA 46
« Reply #7 on: November 02, 2011, 02:49:33 AM »
reply to post 5# of Dennis.

In the mean time I had the cylinder heads of my LA 46 engines modified in the sense that the squish band has been narrowed. The result was immediate improvement. I stil run the engines on the Enya 3 plug.
It is respectfully submitted, that with the actual rich settings of stunt engines, there will be no pre-ignition due to a "hot" grade.
Should how ever the engine lean out during flight, then a hot plug will burn it self out, which in it self might be a reason to switch to a colder plug.

Offline gwassenaar

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Re: Something else for the LA 46
« Reply #8 on: October 28, 2012, 09:22:50 AM »
I run my OS 46LA on a APC 12*4 with an Enya 3 plug. Due to pinging noises I put an extra head gasket in. Now it runs perfect, on 5% nitro and 20% castor oil.

Finally, I had all my OS 46LA heads modified. The squish band has been halved and the combustion chamber is more of a hemi head. Now the engines run in a perfect strong 4-2-4 mode.

I now use a wooden 11x5 prop, 5% nitro and 20% castor oil, and a Enya 3 plug.
Lap times on 65 ft lines is about 5 sec.  All my problems are solved.

Offline Bootlegger

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Re: Something else for the LA 46
« Reply #9 on: October 31, 2012, 04:49:33 AM »

  Here in the Southeast we have been running our LA 40's and 46's with the "squish band" reduced to about half for many years.
  Charley Melanson did this for us and we found that it worked well on these engines as well as lot's of others.
  We run T/Bolt idle bar plugs, 5-10% nitro, 22% oil half/half and turn 12x5 APC props as well.
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Offline Steve Hines

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Re: Something else for the LA 46
« Reply #10 on: October 31, 2012, 10:39:26 PM »
My brother had a run problem with his, tryed differents things, it was the back plate. Put on a new one from Randy and this thing run's great.

Offline Andrew Tinsley

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Re: Something else for the LA 46
« Reply #11 on: November 01, 2012, 03:46:11 AM »
Hello Dennis,
Thanks for the tip about plug length. It is something easily forgotten. As to curing the LA 40s with this mod, I am not too sure. The simple fact is that for some obscure reason they do not run as well as the 46 in stunt application. I have seen one or two that have been cossetted and prop chosen carefully that do run reasonably well/ There is a good deal of trial and error (or even just plain luck) when it comes to running an LA 40 for stunt and getting good runs!
  At the risk of a mild hijack, apart from the bore, everything else is identical between the two engines (I think). So what has the bore got to do with a good stunt run? I bet I don't get many explanations that will stand scrutiny! Sometimes I think there is an art to engine design as well as a science!

Regards,

Andrew.
BMFA Number 64862

Offline phil c

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Re: Something else for the LA 46
« Reply #12 on: November 01, 2012, 03:29:28 PM »
Most LA 40 problems are due, I think, to using too much prop and not enough rpm on too big an airplane.  I bolted one in place of a Brodak 40 for nose weight in my Smoothie.  With the everything stock including the muffler, except for putting an OS needle valve up front, it turns a 10/4 prop at about 11,500 in the air in a full 4 cycle.  Slight break at the top of maneuvers.  It uses an A6(formerly A3) plug, 10% nitro, 11/11 oil.  The Smoothie now weighs 39oz. and has gobs of power.
phil Cartier

Offline Chris Wilson

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Re: Something else for the LA 46
« Reply #13 on: November 01, 2012, 04:42:54 PM »
........ apart from the bore, everything else is identical between the two engines (I think).

I thought that the lack of boost port on the 46 may have something to do with it.
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Offline Andrew Tinsley

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Re: Something else for the LA 46
« Reply #14 on: November 02, 2012, 03:45:16 AM »
Hello Chris,
I was under the impression that only the early 40s had a boost port? Later production was without the boost port? I stand to be corrected on this, as I have never owned a 40 or indeed pulled one down, so I may well be misinformed or just a senior moment!

Regards,

Andrew
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Offline Kim Mortimore

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Re: Something else for the LA 46
« Reply #15 on: November 02, 2012, 06:20:08 PM »

I saw a Windy video of Richard Oliver giving an engine workshop, and he said that we want the hottest plugs we can get in stunt.  He said that even hotter ones could be made, but they would last only about 50 flights.

gwassenaar,
What muffler were you running on the pinging 46?
Kim Mortimore
Santa Clara, CA

Offline Leo Mehl

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Re: Something else for the LA 46
« Reply #16 on: November 04, 2012, 11:21:58 AM »
I have always run my la 46 with a Thunderbolt RC long pplug and have never seen a reason to use anything else. I can usually get a full flying season out of one plug. I also use them on my Stalker and Super Tigre engine and I like them because they tell you when they are getting toward their live span by loosing RPM when you take the glow starter off. I also use them on my Fox engines which are verty good at blowing plugs unanounced. Ask me how I know that one. Z@@ZZZ Z@@ZZZ Z@@ZZZ

Offline Chris Wilson

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Re: Something else for the LA 46
« Reply #17 on: November 06, 2012, 02:55:16 PM »
Hello Chris,
I was under the impression that only the early 40s had a boost port? Later production was without the boost port? I stand to be corrected on this, as I have never owned a 40 or indeed pulled one down, so I may well be misinformed or just a senior moment!

Regards,

Andrew
I think that you are right Andrew.
MAAA AUS 73427

You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life.
 Nothing in life is so exhilarating as to be shot at without result.  It's not enough that we do our best; sometimes we have to do what's required


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