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Author Topic: Inside tank mounting on profile Shark 402  (Read 1280 times)

Offline Allen Eshleman

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Inside tank mounting on profile Shark 402
« on: August 01, 2019, 01:26:26 PM »
Good afternoon, 

I have a Shark 402, just about assembled by my brother Ron. It will be pulled by an LA-25 converted to C/L.  However, I am struggling to find tank room on the inside.  I am hoping to use a Hays 4 oz. tank.  Just not enough room inside.  I have had good success with mounting tanks inside.  However, I usually run the engine feed tube through the fuselage behind the engine and then to the spray bar.  I put the hole on a plane to the middle of the venturi. But that will be a squeeze. 

I probably would have to angle the tube slightly backwards for clearance.  Is that alright?

I could also run it through the fuselage to the front of the engine.

What are your experiences with this?  What advice do you have for me?

I don't know how to share a photo from Google photos or I would.

Thanks ahead of time.


Offline Trostle

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Re: Inside tank mounting on profile Shark 402
« Reply #1 on: August 01, 2019, 07:35:55 PM »
Why do you want to use a 4 oz tank?

Keith

Offline Allen Eshleman

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Re: Inside tank mounting on profile Shark 402
« Reply #2 on: August 01, 2019, 07:41:24 PM »
With my FP 25, I am only getting about 5 minutes with 3 oz.  Also with an older O.S. 25, about the same.  I would like to have a 7 to 8 minute run.

Offline Air Ministry .

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Re: Inside tank mounting on profile Shark 402
« Reply #3 on: August 01, 2019, 09:29:35 PM »
Drill a half dozen holes in it . !

Well , two or three , anyway . In all the positions your considering , for the fuel tube .
That way you need not dither & prevaricate , just try em .

My FSR clone worked real wellwith the tank all ( just ) inside the spraybar , side mounted .
So now I try'n plot how to set it up like that , a bit tough with inverted engines ,
Cant see the extra offset being to much of a issue . Mine ran a big intake-
Set for full wellie overhead - and it drops to mean and woffling level , good transition tru hight .
Even saw a 4 stroke benefit from the tank inboard of the spraybar .

You could put a dozen hole through and say theyre custom lightning holes .  ;D

Offline Dave Moritz

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Re: Inside tank mounting on profile Shark 402
« Reply #4 on: August 01, 2019, 09:37:42 PM »
I too am hoping we get some general discussion here about mounting a tank on the inside of a profile model. It seems a bit unorthodox, but it has its adherents. I've got in mind an inside mount for a SIG Skyray powered by a Saito 30 4S. No idea how this would work out.

Dave Mo...
It’s a very strange world we live in, Master Jack.” (4 Jacks and a Jill)

Offline Air Ministry .

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Re: Inside tank mounting on profile Shark 402
« Reply #5 on: August 01, 2019, 09:54:31 PM »
The guy in NZ had a ( OS ? ) 40 side mount , on a profile . clunk tank inboad of carb .

Did the rich dugga dugga dugga bit low , leaned off even overhead .

The ones Ive seen fly have the tank outerwall  about even ( NOT Outside ) the spraybar / N V A .

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Youd assume there could be a differance either way on the relative fuel head , tank further in .
Or could be extra head means differential , low to high flight , is LESS , perhaps .Meaning less ' break ' .

Ideal'd be a tank slot right through the fuselage , to test various latteral positions . If you like big holes in the fuselage .  :-\

Offline Dave Hull

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Re: Inside tank mounting on profile Shark 402
« Reply #6 on: August 01, 2019, 10:07:47 PM »
You can see details of one way to set up an inboard tank on The Dirt's Cheater Slow article in Model Aviation. It has a couple of good photos and some description of the hows and whys. This was for a 4 flowing ozzies Pylon brand feeding a Fox or ST engine. You can see he just ran the feed line under the fuse and straight to the needle valve. He did have a filter and a bracket to support things and keep them out of the prop.

Just access the Model Aviation archives and search on Cheater Slow. May 1977 issue, page 24.


The Divot

Offline C.T. Schaefer

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Re: Inside tank mounting on profile Shark 402
« Reply #7 on: August 02, 2019, 06:11:17 AM »
I have been flying my 402 for a number of years with one set up. LA .25, stock muffler, 9.5x4.5 prop, 3 oz  Veco t-21 tank, std, venturi with ST spraybar, 10 / 22 fuel, 28 oz, .012x60 lines. Plenty of power and range.  TS

Offline Bootlegger

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Re: Inside tank mounting on profile Shark 402
« Reply #8 on: August 02, 2019, 10:23:30 AM »


  Mr Schafer I just sent you a P/M...
8th Air Force Veteran
Gil Causey
AMA# 6964

Offline Peter in Fairfax, VA

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Re: Inside tank mounting on profile Shark 402
« Reply #9 on: August 02, 2019, 03:27:48 PM »
Effectively, an inboard tank gives pressure, so you can open up the venturi and get more power.  They eventually got outlawed in Slow Combat as cheaters.  I can distinctly recall pitting for Howard Rush and me having some difficulty getting the hang  of holding the model at the right angle on the ground so that it:

A.  Ran on the ground.
B.  Ran in the air.

The problem is that the plane needs to be moving to generate the pressure.  Too slow, lean.  Too fast, rich.  Probably less of a problem with a standard venturi opening.

The inboard tank rig was circa 1974, 1975.

Peter

Offline Air Ministry .

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Re: Inside tank mounting on profile Shark 402
« Reply #10 on: August 02, 2019, 11:10:59 PM »
SEEING you brought it up ! ,  S?P

On the Phantom , the tank uniflow vent was inboard , 1/8 plumbers copper , about 1/16 th bore , cut off at 45 or so degrees .

As it stuck out 3/4 or so , one day a pliered it round forward 1/8 off the side , so 5/8 or so longitudeinal . After previous flights that day . !

Straight Off , had to wind in 1/4 turn at about 2 1/2 turns on a Taipan N V A , for same air setting . Gave up after a few flights and back
to straight out , and satisfactory . Verily .
Its one flaw was nerwe duggga dugga , when a fair breeze was steady , rich & lean into and out of wind , level laps .
notta Lotta differance from that once the nose was turned though , clawed away meritously through hail & storm .
Well Storm anyway , the odd damp day , tree , dogfight with seagull and various misadventures ,

Mayve been to wind sensitive with the vent straight into the airstream , so thered be a few variables there to experiment trough , perhaps .

 H^^

Offline Allen Eshleman

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Re: Inside tank mounting on profile Shark 402
« Reply #11 on: August 04, 2019, 03:03:03 PM »
I decided to go ahead with the 4 ounce Hayes tank inboard mounted and I ran the tubing through the fuselage in front of the engine head and under the crank shaft.  We'll see.  I will report how it runs.  I don't do anywhere near a full pattern, just wing-overs, loops, flying upside down and horizontal and vertical 8's - that is, if I get my nerve back.  That's how far I got until I had a few wrecks, especially my Magician that felt really taut at the end of the lines.   I will report how well this works.

Is there any good replacement size wise for the Hayes tanks?  I think I saw something from Hong Kong but not sure.

Offline Allen Eshleman

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Re: Inside tank mounting on profile Shark 402
« Reply #12 on: August 10, 2019, 08:43:29 AM »
Today, I did my first two flights with this 402.  As I said, the Hayes 4 oz. tank is mounted inboard and the tube goes through the Engine mount area in front of the engine and to the NVA which has the pickup end pointed down.  So far, so good.  As noted somewhere here above, I did need to lean it out very lean and due the the fuel being being a bit pressurized from outside from movement toward the outside, it settled in to a very nice run (LA 25).  I one short flight where it was running too rich and once in the air, it became richer and died.

I have a different issue before I can do stunts.  It is tail heavy.  For the second flight a rubber banded a large bolt on the front and the controls were still squirrely.  Oh, the fun, of trimming!

Online Tim Wescott

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Re: Inside tank mounting on profile Shark 402
« Reply #13 on: August 10, 2019, 11:39:45 AM »
Closing the barn door after the horse is out -- I meant to post these earlier, but didn't have time.  You can make those fuel tubes look good if you're careful.  I drilled the holes just below the motor mounts (it helps to think ahead and leave meat for this, but you can do it later).  This is from the thread Build: Cartoon-scale Mooney Mite:



AMA 64232

The problem with electric is that once you get the smoke generator and sound system installed, the plane is too heavy.


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