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Author Topic: Another Liner Question  (Read 463 times)

Offline Dick Pacini

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Another Liner Question
« on: October 08, 2010, 06:11:14 AM »
I have followed several threads here about pistons and liners being removed for cleaning or other tasks.

Back in the day...I was always told to not disturb the piston/liner assembly because the microscopic grooves would never line up and the engine would require another break-in, subsequently wearing parts in a different spot, reducing the life of the engine.

Are today's liners and pistons that much better or have some of the old rules just gone by the wayside?
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Dave Adamisin

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Re: Another Liner Question
« Reply #1 on: October 08, 2010, 12:38:58 PM »
I have followed several threads here about pistons and liners being removed for cleaning or other tasks.

Back in the day...I was always told to not disturb the piston/liner assembly because the microscopic grooves would never line up and the engine would require another break-in, subsequently wearing parts in a different spot, reducing the life of the engine.

Are today's liners and pistons that much better or have some of the old rules just gone by the wayside?

Short quick answer, yes. Don't know if there is actual measurement data from in service parts but ab(c,n,etc) p/c sets are fit differently and the materials are much friendlier to each other than the steel/iron setups were. Modern liners - generally - have a little more taper and in service p/c's actually spend a lot less time touching each other so the "micro grooves" aren't as big a factor...

Offline phil c

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Re: Another Liner Question
« Reply #2 on: October 08, 2010, 12:43:54 PM »
I have followed several threads here about pistons and liners being removed for cleaning or other tasks.

Back in the day...I was always told to not disturb the piston/liner assembly because the microscopic grooves would never line up and the engine would require another break-in, subsequently wearing parts in a different spot, reducing the life of the engine.

Are today's liners and pistons that much better or have some of the old rules just gone by the wayside?

Most of the recommendations not to disturb a sleeve come from the Fox engines.  Most of the early ones, prior to the Schneurle ones, used very thin sleeves and a fairly small lip on the sleeve.  Plus they tended to be, shall we say, less than perfect in the machining of the sleeve, so the lip might be slightly cocked.  Once the engine was broken in it could be impossible to get it back together exactly as it was.  The trick was to spend an hour or so tweaking the headbolts down without introducing a bind in the sleeve.  You have to clean the piston and sleeve very clean so there is no oil on them.  Install the piston, sleeve and head.  As the head bolts are tightened, going back and forth every other screw.  After every little twist turn the engine over and make sure there is no bind.  If one appears back  off the last screw tightened a tiny bit until the bind goes away and then continue.

Most of the modern engines with ABC construction can be disassembled and reassembled with little trouble, as long as everything is spotlessly clean.  Tiny bits of dirt under the edge of the sleeve or head can cause trouble.  Some of the engines made in China have fairly poor tolerances and can be as troublesome as the old Fox engines.
phil Cartier

Offline W.D. Roland

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Re: Another Liner Question
« Reply #3 on: October 08, 2010, 03:13:39 PM »
Yep(on the scratches lining up)
Some times you just gota do it though.

When I was young and the mind and body not so numb I could feel when the sleeve was back in the right position.
A little off one way or another and the friction was very slightly  more.
Couldn't do that today if I had to.


Sometimes putting the piston 3/4 of the way or so up hole and then while holding cylinder vertical move/rotate sleeve until gravity makes piston move.

Both ways are maybe got it, maybe not got it! HB~>

Marking/indexing sleeve to case will not quite get it right.

Just have to do what we have to do and run em.

Have been told about expanding pistons and then refitting but never tried it.

I do try to save all old pistons and Sleeves for later polishing and mix and match until decent fits are found.
This seems to be a requirement for Foxes, Even mixing new stuff to get good fits.
David Roland
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