I personally am not aware of any "Tail Dragger" Sharks beinbg built back in the day. That doesn't mean none were though.

Being a tail dragger might not cause any loss of points at most Classic contests, unless they are awarding points for authenticity, which most contests seem to ignore.

Having said the above, and being a fan of trike geared designs, I cannot imagine why you would be willing to give up the advantages a properly set up trike geared design gives you. For most, this is at least a 10 point advantage.

Hey Big Bear, Glad to see you are building some new ships.

If you've set the trike gear up correctly, You should see an increase in take off points, and in landing points. You really have to mess up to botch a landing, though I have managed to do so.

For those interested, You want to set the plane up, so it sits level, or at most, less than a degree nose down. Avoid having the plane sit with the nose up at all. You will have a bit of a time lifting off cleanly where you want to if you set it up nose high.

You want to locate the main gesr at a popint where the tail will stay down if you push it there, when the tank is empty. This means it will barely sit on the gear with an empty tank. When the tank is full, and you're taking off, it's very easy to rotate and lift off clean and smooth just by the slight motion of standing up straight. Yep, I start my take off roll from a crouching position. It gets the lines closer to level and the inboard wing resists raising during the take off roll.

OK, there's one more thing I do for contest take offs.

Regardless of where I begin my take off roll, I face the point, where I want to take off at (1/4 circle). When the plane reaches that position where it's right in front of me, I stand up, and the plane rises smoothly with me. Almost always good for a 35+ point take off.

Hi Dan,

I really am not familiar with the Classic/Nos. 30 contest scene in the Mid West.  Around here we do not use Fidelity nor Appearance Points for either class, so I don't *think* there would be a problem in the Southeast.  I would almost bet the farm that *someone* made a tail dragger to get some *Originality* points back in the day.

Big Bear

 Hi Dan,

 I'm not 100% sure but I believe some of the Sharks Ken Taylor built out here in the 60's were tail draggers. Certainly 1 of his more recent Sharks is and it looks super cool sporting wing mounted gear with wheel pants.

 Cheers, Rob.

Rob

Any pictures available ?

Big Bear

I guess I may have to move to the Southeast then ! 

Come on down, Dan!  Good weather here in the middle/southern part of NC.  The Huntersville flying site is very, very good.

You know why the sky is Carolina Blue?  Because God's a Tar Heel!

Big Bear

Legal or not, a tail dragger Shark would be like an Olympic without stabilizer tip vertical fins. They are a key element of the design and one of the things that make a Shark a Shark.  My current classic build is a Shark 35, built specifically because it is a nose dragger and will be easier to land without bouncing. They also look cool.

 Hi Dan,
 Sorry so long for the reply,

 I have some pics but having recently bought a new house they are still in storage and I'm not yet sure where they (or anything else for that matter) is.

 I can certainly understand guys building sharks with trike gear as tribute to the original design but they look awesome as a wing mounted tail dragger. If I ever get around to another it would most likely be built that way.

 Cheers, Rob..

Hi Dan,

 I'm not 100% sure but I believe some of the Sharks Ken Taylor built out here in the 60's were tail draggers. Certainly 1 of his more recent Sharks is and it looks super cool sporting wing mounted gear with wheel pants.

 Cheers, Rob.

Ken Taylor at the Australian Nats 1964 with taildragger version of Shark.   Used similar for the 1963 Nats.

HH

Hi Dan,

Herb just gave you all the material needed for a tail dragger Shark to be Classic/Nos.30 legal!

BIG Bear
RNMM/AMM

Hi Bill

I'm missing something here. Don't know your reference to "Herb".  And the airplane in the pic looks like a Shark, but it says Zeus on the wing.  I'm not clear on what you are saying, my friend. Have mercy on me and explain it so even I could understand it if you would. I'm not near as savvy as you about the legalities of all this jazz. 

Hi Bill

Now I understand. I was thinking of doing a Shark 35 as a tail dragger. If the pic is a Shark 45, I guess it won't qualify the smaller version, or will it ?  Thanks for your clear and concise explanation. I appreciate it.

Dan

Thanks Bill. Sounds like chances are slim then on the 35.  I appreciate your input very much.  Thanks !

Dan

Dan:
I'm gonna give you some really bad advice - its your airplane, built it how you like.

Here's the bad advice part - I honestly doubt if a taildragger would keep you out of a local contest- they need all the entries they can get.  At the NATs or VSC - you might catch some grief.

Meanwhile I think a Shark 35 would be a killer in regular PA!

I dont think there is a means in the rules to disqualify in classic, regardless of variations. It would kill you in appearance or authentic points though,,

now steve,, take a deep breath,,
I agree with you on the spirit of the event,, but if there IS evidence, then there is nothing wrong or agains the spirit. Like my Oriental with wing mounted gear, it was totally legit, I even had documentation for it,,

Now I agree that the spirit of the event indicates standard two stroke power,, but the truth is, the RULES dont disallow it. That is what Fidelity points were about, they allowed for a way to "penalize" someone for a non appropriate airplane,, like an open cockpit shark, or a tricycle gear oriental, or,, whatever. but unfortunatly I dont think a lot of contests use fidelity points, they only use appearance points..
so to keep it pure, bring back fidelity points,, ( its no different than a flap bonus in old time)

That may be true in some parts of the country but waaaay out west, BOM and appearance points are alive and well. This a a good thing IMHO but let's not start this friendly debate again. WARNING: Thread Drift!

Bill, every contest out here uses appearance points, the only exceptions being old time, and Profile,,

Dan-

'can't help much either, other than to complicate things. First, it's hard for me to believe that some classic period Sharks were not built by individuals - at least kit builders - as tail draggers. Second, the tail on the Zeus looks enlarged from original. FWIW.

SK

There may have been slight differences due to the different plans available for the Shark 45.  Ken told me that the plan he used was a published one which did differ from the Jetco kit version.  That conversation was 15 years ago so I can't say what the other plan was.

Ken used Enya 45 engines back then and maybe a Fox 59 in one.  That one I can't be sure on.   Why he called the 64 one "Zeus" I haven't a clue!   The one which he used to place 2nd with at the 1963 OZ nats (left of pic) was the same configuration.

HH

If I built a Shark, I think I'd go with something like the pic above. I think that is very cool.

Naw, both hypothetical projects. I like my stock trike-geared Shark and besides, the XP-77 was a homely failure as a fighter. As for stick and tissue models, they are a nice change of pace from C/L but 16 strands of Pirelli?, that would put it into the Jumbo Scale class...no thanks.  

Poor Bill has been waiting years for me to draw up Dad's Shark taildragger. It hangs on my shop wall, all 1969 of it's original balsa and Tigre 46, Spin-A-Flo muffler and Veco spinner. Did I mention it's sexy Sea Fury style fake gear doors over Williams Bros. racing wheels? It's way awesome.

Fidelity Points are only for pissing people off. There is no one capable of judging it fairly without documentation rules and their fair implementation by advertisement before a contest and trained judges using documents only during said judging. Other wise it's a game of chance.

So...Not only have I seen taildragger Sharks, I have one. It has a jet look body and a different name, too. I also have a asymtrical wing mounted gear Smoothie, it competed in the 1967 Nationals.

I have never seen a taildragger Shark 35. Whitely's trike flew perfectly, it was so easy to fly I almost placed at a VSC with his model. Secret? Straight, good controls, lot's of HP.

As long as it was bitchin', Whitely would dig a taildragger Hunter.

Here's my take on Classic. It AIN'T OLD TIME! You can build what was built in the period, which is about any mod one can think of, it doesn't have to be built out of the box, but it sure can be if one wants.

Chris...

Poor Bill has been waiting years for me to draw up Dad's Shark taildragger. It hangs on my shop wall, all 1969 of it's original balsa and Tigre 46, Spin-A-Flo muffler and Veco spinner. Did I mention it's sexy Sea Fury style fake gear doors over Williams Bros. racing wheels? It's way awesome.

Fidelity Points are only for pissing people off. There is no one capable of judging it fairly without documentation rules and their fair implementation by advertisement before a contest and trained judges using documents only during said judging. Other wise it's a game of chance.

So...Not only have I seen taildragger Sharks, I have one. It has a jet look body and a different name, too. I also have a asymtrical wing mounted gear Smoothie, it competed in the 1967 Nationals.

I have never seen a taildragger Shark 35. Whitely's trike flew perfectly, it was so easy to fly I almost placed at a VSC with his model. Secret? Straight, good controls, lot's of HP.

As long as it was bitchin', Whitely would dig a taildragger Hunter.

Here's my take on Classic. It AIN'T OLD TIME! You can build what was built in the period, which is about any mod one can think of, it doesn't have to be built out of the box, but it sure can be if one wants.

Chris...

HI Little Brother!

I know it will get done when it gets done.

I agree on Classic.  Lots and lots of kits were changed, modified to get the extra "Originality" points.  Making a different shaped rudder, different landing gear, different wing tips, bubble canopy in place of a turtledeck and vice versa. 

I love the Classic event, even more than the Nostalgia 30 event, but I do know that not all kits were built straight out of the box and both events can use more entries on the local scene.

BIG Bear
RNMM/AMM