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Author Topic: Home Made C/G Balancer  (Read 2179 times)

Offline Steve Riebe

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Home Made C/G Balancer
« on: January 20, 2013, 07:03:34 PM »
Found this surfing the net this morning. I thought it was pretty slick, and made it with stuff I had laying around in about 1/2 hour. Here is a link to the page where I got it for building instructions:

http://home.mindspring.com/~the-plumber/Vanessa%20CG%20Machine.htm

Anyone know where a Cardinal is supposed to balance? This one is just about dead on the spar. My kid likes the way it flys, I don't think I should mess with it




Offline Tim Wescott

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Re: Home Made C/G Balancer
« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2013, 07:23:16 PM »
You probably already know this, but the plumb bob points to the spot inside the wing where the center of gravity resides.  If you want it to point to the spot outside the wing where the center of gravity is located fore and aft, then you need to have the plane level (think about it).

Moreover, if you make a harness by tying all your strings to a point, then you can measure the side-to-side CG (which, on a CL plane, should be outboard of the center thanks to tip weight).
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The problem with electric is that once you get the smoke generator and sound system installed, the plane is too heavy.

Offline Steve Riebe

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Re: Home Made C/G Balancer
« Reply #2 on: January 20, 2013, 08:01:15 PM »
You probably already know this, but the plumb bob points to the spot inside the wing where the center of gravity resides.  If you want it to point to the spot outside the wing where the center of gravity is located fore and aft, then you need to have the plane level (think about it).

I think I'm missing something maybe, but unless you are balancing something like a canard, isn't the balance point always in the wing, generally 25% to 35% back from the leading edge? For what it's worth I went back downstairs and leveled the plane, the balance point indicated changed 1/8" at most.  ???

Offline Tim Wescott

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Re: Home Made C/G Balancer
« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2013, 08:14:13 PM »
The CG isn't just somewhere between the leading and trailing edges -- in the case of the plane you show, it is inside the wing.  In something like a Piper Cub, it's below the wing; in a low-wing plane like an Ercoupe or a P-51 it'll be above the wing.

Maybe this drawing makes it clear.  The pointer always points to the CG, but you've moved the wing around the CG by changing the tilt of the aircraft.
AMA 64232

The problem with electric is that once you get the smoke generator and sound system installed, the plane is too heavy.

Offline Steve Riebe

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Re: Home Made C/G Balancer
« Reply #4 on: January 20, 2013, 08:27:25 PM »
Okay, I understand now, nice drawing! The 1/8" difference I observed was merely from the tilt of the aircraft. Leveling the plane would give more accurate results. Wouldn't this device be adequate in determining whether tail or nose weight is required to get to a certain point?

Offline Tim Wescott

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Re: Home Made C/G Balancer
« Reply #5 on: January 20, 2013, 08:40:08 PM »
That thing should be great for determining the CG.  I should build one myself!
AMA 64232

The problem with electric is that once you get the smoke generator and sound system installed, the plane is too heavy.

Offline Mike Haverly

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Re: Home Made C/G Balancer
« Reply #6 on: January 20, 2013, 09:53:03 PM »
It is easier to check with the model upside down and hanging from the LG.  Check my posting on http://stunthanger.com/smf/index.php?topic=25141.msg242498#msg242498  That dowl contraption doesn't work as well as the one I made (I tried it).  I didn't invent this one either but it works! 
Mike

Offline Tim Wescott

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Re: Home Made C/G Balancer
« Reply #7 on: January 20, 2013, 10:22:03 PM »
Mike's gizmo is what I was talking about when I mentioned tying all your strings at one point.
AMA 64232

The problem with electric is that once you get the smoke generator and sound system installed, the plane is too heavy.

Online Dan McEntee

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Re: Home Made C/G Balancer
« Reply #8 on: January 27, 2013, 12:39:20 PM »
  It's important to remember, that the CG (center of gravity) is different than the balance point fore and aft or side to side. And the term "vertical CG" is used a lot also. Might be a good point in time for a technical explanation of each by one of the engineering guys here. At certain levels of flying proficiency,  static balance fore and aft, and side to side is all you need to know. As you advance , and can understand and tell the difference in subtle changes, then split the hair a couple of times more. I have been flying expert for several years now and do OK in local and regional competition, but things in my personal life prevent me from doing any building and practice flying that would take me to the next level and be able to make practical use of knowing the subtle little differences. If your son is comfortable with the balance the way it is, I wouldn't change it either for a while. If he gets to the point where he thinks he can step it up a notch or move up in class, then start with the subtle changes and see if he notices the difference and can take advantage of them. He'll tell you with his smile and his eyes when he bumps his scores up significantly!
   Good luck and have fun,
     Dan McEntee
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Offline Tim Wescott

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Re: Home Made C/G Balancer
« Reply #9 on: January 27, 2013, 02:08:03 PM »
Might be a good point in time for a technical explanation of each by one of the engineering guys here.

Ouch.  I tried.  I gave up.  I understand what "center of gravity" means, but I'm having trouble trying to describe it in a way that's less confusing than Wikipedia.

So, here's what Wikipedia says: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Center_of_mass.  I have a nasty suspicion that it'll be perfectly clear if you already know what it's talking about, and as clear as mud if you don't.  I sincerely hope that I'm wrong.

One thing I will say, that may be of help: the center of gravity (or the center of mass) of a rigid object is a fixed point associated with the object.  It is often inside of the object (in the case of a conventional stunt plane, it should be centered vertically in the wing, much closer to the leading edge than the trailing edge, and somewhat to the outside of the circle than the center of the fuselage, to balance the lines).  When you stick weights onto the nose or tail of a plane, you're adjusting the longitudinal location of the center of gravity; when you put weights into (or take weights out of) the weight box on the outboard wing, you are adjusting the side-to-side location of the center of gravity.

So usually when you hear someone talking about "the center of gravity" they're really talking about the longitudinal balance point.  When you hear someone talking about "the vertical center of gravity" they really ought to be saying "the vertical balance point" or "the vertical location of the (one) center of gravity".

So, I hope this helps.  I balked on writing up something about CG when I realized that to do it right I needed to run out to the shop to make some visual aids, and then take pictures or even movies.  If enough people ask, I may go do it anyway.
AMA 64232

The problem with electric is that once you get the smoke generator and sound system installed, the plane is too heavy.


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