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Author Topic: questions for 2nd Combat Kitten build  (Read 1037 times)

Offline Augsburger

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questions for 2nd Combat Kitten build
« on: April 13, 2011, 02:59:28 PM »
  Planning the build of the next Combat Kitten and would like some advice please.  First, I would like to use a .074 engine so that I can fly with a bit longer lines, more pull, and in a bit of wind if necessary.  Any recommendations on this size power plant?  Norvell Big Mig, Cox Queen Bee, what do you think?  Also, what type of internally mounted tank should I use for the type of power plant you recommend?   One can see from the attached photo of the plans section, detailing the internal positioning of the fuel tank that it may be a bit tricky.  (for me at least)  The attached plans photo calls for a VECO T-19 (or similar wedge tank). I plan to fly the model for fun and some stunting.
     If retro type parts are the best, fine, but not necessary this go around.  Would someone also please explain what a clunk tank is and why the name?
     Finally, strictly FYI, my last Combat Kitten had a total weight of 128 gr. or 4.51 oz.  Much of this weight comes from the Rustoleum and Clear I sprayed on the model.  I would really like to try and cut the weight as much as possible next go around. What kind of total weight should I realistically shoot for this next time?
     As always thanks for the advice....cheers
Wilder Eber

Offline kenneth cook

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Re: questions for 2nd Combat Kitten build
« Reply #1 on: April 13, 2011, 04:59:14 PM »
        I built mine using a black widow for power originally. This model had more than enough power(Only when the engine was running correctly) and it had great flying ability. I then rebuilt using a Tee Dee for power. The Tee Dee never seems to work for me. It always starts but I run into problems such as fuel feed issues. The wings are going to turn fast, while doing this using a suction tank your going to starve the engine for fuel. I then tried to run crankcase pressure due to an engine I had already drilled the crankcase for. This run was very inconsistent and to date I put a one way valve and a fine threaded Kirn needle set up on it but have never ran it. I believe the spar on that plane has a knockout or marks for a cutout for the internal tank. You can get a Brodak tank as they have small tanks readily available. I think I used a 3/4 oz. wedge. Keep your pickup tube on your centerline of engine as well.  My overflow tube came out the bottom of the wing just behind the engine nacelle. Do yourself a favor and remove and plug the overflow pipe with solder. The tank was reworked and I fill through the pickup line. I learned the hard way when the landing did it for me as it was hanging down. I feel the Tee Dee isn't necessary as this seems to be way more power than what is needed. I wouldn't hesistate to use a Norvel Big Mig as the AME would probably be like the Tee Dee. The Black Widow kept my balance in order so I feel that anything shorter may require a touch of nose weight. You could always get a used tank for a Cox Bee or a Golden Bee etc. and drill a hole in so you can use an external tank. I keep a few tanks that were drilled. I wouldn't personally drill them but I found some at a swap meet already drilled. It works, you just feed the fuel tubing through the hole and onto the fuel nipple and its ready to go. A clunk tank is a tank generally of plastic. the pickup is a weight or a piece of sintered bronze that attaches to the fuel tubing and rests on the bottom of the tank. The pickup  isn't soldered or fixed,  it floats around. The sole purpose of this tank is to keep the pickup submerged constantly, which is why they work so well. That's only if the clunk is working freely.  When the plane goes inverted the weight falls to the top hence the term "clunk."  These types of tanks are usually found on the larger than 1/2 a size planes. This is mainly due to the compact size of the tank not allowing enough room for a clunk. JK Aerotech used to offer a clunk for 1/2 a engines which was a mount as well. It used a 35mm film canister for a tank with the clunk inside. The tank was large and it leaked if you didn't switch out the canister they provided for a more durable one. I had an article from Flying Models some years ago that used a lot of household containers for 1/2 a fuel tanks. Some were small yogurt containers and a lot of shampoo bottles used for samples which were small. They showed how the designer plumbed them and used clunks extensively within them. Out of all of these styles the 35 mm film canisters got the most play. They didn't drill the lids for the cap , instead a small punched hole was made and the tubes forced through them using a touch of silicone or Shoe Goo. I don't generally weigh my planes so I can't comment on their weights. I would try and work on a good running high rpm engine using a small prop. The Norvel would fit the bill. The Cox engines will work equally as well.  I forgot to mention that Brodak provides all of their tank dimension sizes. You can not only figure out the size by oz's , but you can see how much room you have. Ken

Offline Larry Renger

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Re: questions for 2nd Combat Kitten build
« Reply #2 on: April 13, 2011, 05:01:58 PM »
The Cub .074 and Cox Queen Bee .074s are pretty pitiful.  I would (surprise!) recommend the AP Wasp .061 as it will be much more powerful than either.  If you can find a Norvel .074 it would be good, but probably expensive and hard to get.
Think S.M.A.L.L. y'all and, it's all good, CL, FF and RC!

DesignMan
 BTW, Dracula Sucks!  A closed mouth gathers no feet!

Offline Augsburger

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Re: questions for 2nd Combat Kitten build
« Reply #3 on: April 13, 2011, 05:22:55 PM »
@ Larry and Ken....great info as always from you both.  Thanks much.  I will keep you posted on progress as it progresses this time. Cheers
Wilder Eber

Offline Larry Renger

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Re: questions for 2nd Combat Kitten build
« Reply #4 on: April 14, 2011, 01:07:54 PM »
The tank article was "Tanks fer Nuttin" by little 'ole me.  n~
Think S.M.A.L.L. y'all and, it's all good, CL, FF and RC!

DesignMan
 BTW, Dracula Sucks!  A closed mouth gathers no feet!

Offline Terrence Durrill

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Re: questions for 2nd Combat Kitten build
« Reply #5 on: April 15, 2011, 09:22:58 AM »
If you have a little extra cash, catch a Cox RR1 .049 on Ebay...........those little engines are real screamers and would make that Combat Kitten sit up and meow!  Otherwise, go with a Cox TD .049................TDurrill     y1    #^    H^^

Offline kenneth cook

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Re: questions for 2nd Combat Kitten build
« Reply #6 on: April 15, 2011, 01:36:07 PM »
              Unfortunately, the RR-1 tends to be a bit pricy at costs exceeding $150.00 on Ebay. Reggie, from Vintage Glow Engines is producing a rear rotor Cox engine using a lightened piston and a design of his own for the rotor for the same price. Reggie's engine has a machined aluminum backplate typical to a Sure Start production plate but it houses his rotor. The problem that your still faced with, is that this plane turns fast, I can't see how your going to avoid the fact that your going to run away from the fuel. A bladder would surely solve this situation. It would take a bit of ingenuity to design a compartment to house it. I've had two different tanks in one of my Kittens and both failed running a TD. I haven't tried my revamp using crank pressure yet. Last time out, while using the TD, I ended up tearing a hole in it on the bottom in several places. I highly suggest not to use silkspan on one of these models due to the abuse they take while even landing on grass. The other problem with a TD as I've found out while using crank or backplate pressure is the finicky needling that happens. You surely need a finer needle than the one provided. But, I would try it nonetheless and comment on what works. I've had nothing but problems trying to use TD's and I tried every way possible to get them to run. I do have some that run perfectly, they're just not on combat wings. I'm not sure if the venturi is slightly large, or some of mine have been drilled. I'm sure its possible. Ken

Offline Augsburger

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Re: questions for 2nd Combat Kitten build
« Reply #7 on: April 15, 2011, 03:11:49 PM »
Perfect, and once again, thanks for the info.... Now I'm looking for several different types and will let you know what I decide.  @ Larry...No answers on a weight to shoot for?
Wilder Eber

Offline JamieHolford

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Re: questions for 2nd Combat Kitten build
« Reply #8 on: April 17, 2011, 08:18:02 AM »
Ya gotta show a build thread!!!


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