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Author Topic: Scale Stunt Designs  (Read 28194 times)

Offline Bill Little

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Scale Stunt Designs
« on: April 11, 2007, 04:49:53 PM »
I have been looking over a set of plans that Ron Burn (F-4-F Guy) so graciously has helped me with.  it has given me a WHOLE NEW OUTLOOK on what he, and Al Rabe, in particular, have gone through over the years! 

The secret, classified, on a need to know only basis, super security clearance necessary, new PAMPA stunter at least has a set of workable, plans now!  Thanks, Ron!

Hopefully it will hit the contest circuit in 2008!  I can say that it will have a .61 (maybe larger) piped power train, be VERY scale, and should fly great!!

Now, to get in some handle time to do it justice.............

Bill <><
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Offline George Knott

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2007, 08:36:20 PM »
Bob Litte.

Dear Bob,
 
How are you?

1.   I've just become a member, started searching for Keith Trostle and his winningest Rabe Bearcat III- the Al Williams "Gulf" paint scheme, in my first Log-In, and I come across your Scale Stunt Designs article: " Ron Burns F4F Wildcat"!

2.
a)    Is this THE F4F Wildcat C/L Stunt model design? The reason I ask this is I recall sighting a photo  of a C/L F4F Wildcat stunt model, in a magazine some years ago. I'd win the state lottery if I could recall, all the details of the mag, etc, but I did see a F4F. Was it Ron's?
I well remember this sighting because I entertained thoughts that the Wildcat (Particularly, the FM-2 version-I was attracted to this Hotrod version, tall tail Wildcat, not the Grumman F4F; Sorry) would be ideal for a semi-scale stunt model.

Q.1.   Is it, that is: Rons F4F C/L stunt model plan available via P.A.M.P.A.?

Q.2.   Is Ron's plan an updated version, with a "Large" engine?


3.   While I have you on the email, do you have available Keith Trostles contact details?  Email, mailing address, telephone, etc.,?
I would to talk to him about his Bearcat III  stunt model .

Please let me know. Thanks.

Offline Bill Little

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #2 on: April 12, 2007, 08:05:17 AM »
Bob Litte.

Dear Bob,
 
How are you?

1.   I've just become a member, started searching for Keith Trostle and his winningest Rabe Bearcat III- the Al Williams "Gulf" paint scheme, in my first Log-In, and I come across your Scale Stunt Designs article: " Ron Burns F4F Wildcat"!

2.
a)    Is this THE F4F Wildcat C/L Stunt model design? The reason I ask this is I recall sighting a photo  of a C/L F4F Wildcat stunt model, in a magazine some years ago. I'd win the state lottery if I could recall, all the details of the mag, etc, but I did see a F4F. Was it Ron's?
I well remember this sighting because I entertained thoughts that the Wildcat (Particularly, the FM-2 version-I was attracted to this Hotrod version, tall tail Wildcat, not the Grumman F4F; Sorry) would be ideal for a semi-scale stunt model.

Q.1.   Is it, that is: Rons F4F C/L stunt model plan available via P.A.M.P.A.?

Q.2.   Is Ron's plan an updated version, with a "Large" engine?


3.   While I have you on the email, do you have available Keith Trostles contact details?  Email, mailing address, telephone, etc.,?
I would to talk to him about his Bearcat III  stunt model .

Please let me know. Thanks.

Hi George,

I am not at *my* computer now, so I will get to some of your questions tonight.

As far as Ron Burn's F-4-F, he had at least two of them.  One set on the very back row at the NATS in appearance judging with 3 or 4 points.  It had the most fabulous scale finish possible!  But it wasn't very glossy, of course.  Another story for another time.

His Wildcats are big engine planes (.60s) but I do not know of a plans source.  Unless Ron has them himself.

As to Keith Trostle, he is a member here, and his Profile in the Member's Section contains his contact info.  The Bearcat is Al Rabe's design, IIRC.

Will get back to you later!
Bill <><
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Offline George Knott

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #3 on: April 13, 2007, 10:02:31 PM »
 HIHI%%
Dear Bill,
1.   Thank you very much for your reply. 2.    Please continue with my  F4F-3 Wildcat querie(s). I look forward to hearing from you further.  3.   Now,  I have taken more time and care in studying the Icons and small print, etc., too( Green Horn).
Regards: George K.

Offline Dennis Adamisin

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #4 on: April 20, 2007, 10:20:55 AM »
Attached pix fits the title of this thread but has nothing to do with the F4F project discussed above.  Just thought the gang would enoy seeing it.  BTW pix was sent to me by Charlie Reeves, it was taken at the FAI qualifier in Lexington in (I think) fall of 1972 (sigh). 

* Foreground is my Fouga Magister.  Clockwise from there:
* Charlie Reeves' gorgeous P-63 "Flying Red Horse"
* Al Rabe's incomparable Sea Fury
* Lew McFarland's wonderful Spinks Acromaster
* Keith Trostle's ultra slick Eagle

I find it curious (actually its LOL funny) that by "today's" paradigms on design and engine selection NONE of these would be deemed capable of competitive flight...!

Bring back Originality & Realism...


Denny Adamisin
Fort Wayne, IN

As I've grown older, I've learned that pleasing everyone is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake!

Offline Shultzie

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2007, 10:55:20 AM »
WOW! WHAT A GREAT PHOTO.....REAL EYE CANDY FOR THE MINDS OF ALL SCALE STUNT ADDICTS...
DON'T STOP NOW, DENNIS!! DOESYA' GOT MORE FOOOOTOES'?????? HUH???

Don Shultz

Offline proparc

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2007, 10:07:10 PM »
Dennis, you gots to hit us up with fooootoes, (as Mr. Schultze says) of your Typhoon. There was so much voodoo surrounding that plane. History was made with that plane,(Walker Cup flyoff).

In addition, you have got plenty of talking,(and photos) to share concerning certain high aspect ratio ships!!!!

This is kind of like the end of the Cold War and now we can open the vaults and get the real truth LOL. H^^
Milton "Proparc" Graham

Offline Air Ministry .

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #7 on: May 08, 2007, 06:50:17 PM »


  How did Kieth Trostle's EAGLE fly ?

  Where'd it come,Whats it got in it,

 And several other Questions        .

Offline PatRobinson

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #8 on: May 08, 2007, 09:33:06 PM »
Matthew, (regarding how Keith Trostle's "Eagle" design flew.)
I was fortunate enough to watch Keith fly this airplane several times. My impression was that it was a crisp turning plane that delivered excellent patterns but then Keith is an excellent flyer.  I believe that Keith used a Super Tigre 46 but I could be wrong.  It was a truly sharp looking airplane that was
obviously inspired by the "Little Toni" race plane.
For those of you who have Harry Higley's book "There Are No "Secrets"look on page 20 at picture no.72 and there you will find another Keith Trostle masterpiece.  This was a "46" size Focke Wulf. I am not sure if it was a
Fw-190 D9 or a Ta-152 but for some reason this plane seems to be overlooked when discussing Scale Stunt planes. It seemed to me that this plane flew even better than the "Eagle" which from my perspective mean't it was a great flying airplane.  If I remember correctly Keith entered this "bad boy" in sport scale in at least one contest. Maybe Keith will be kind enough to chime in and and provide some specifications on these 2 excellent airplanes.
I don't know about the rest of you guys but these are 2 airplanes that I would love to have plans for and I think they would make great additions to other PAMPA plans, perhaps.  In any event I think that these are 2 designs that are as impressive today as in the 70's and should be heralded more than they have been.
                                                                 Till next time,
                                                              Pat Robinson

Offline Air Ministry .

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #9 on: May 11, 2007, 07:48:53 PM »

  Lets hear the " WISH LISTS " , particularly the RACING PLANES .

  "Now Ive always wanted to do a . . . . . . . . . ..,

Offline pete beddows

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #10 on: May 12, 2007, 05:04:41 PM »
if your looking for a real challange how about a Art chester jeep you might have to for go the double taper wing,
or a mew gull or i will stop now before i run out of year to biuld them.

                      all the best PeteBeddows

Offline Bill Little

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #11 on: May 12, 2007, 09:31:23 PM »
  Lets hear the " WISH LISTS " , particularly the RACING PLANES .

  "Now Ive always wanted to do a . . . . . . . . . ..,

I am 60% (or more) done with a Bendix Trophy "Paul Mantz #46 P-51B" racing plane that is based on Bob Hunt's P-51 wing.  Will have a PA 61 piped.  I went flying today for the first real time since last October, and I think my "building funk" is cured........... ;D

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Offline t michael jennings

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #12 on: October 18, 2007, 08:08:26 PM »
The attached photo is my P-51C.  This is the modified design of Al Meyers P-51D Mustang.

It has a Fox 40 engine and weighs in at 53 ounces. 

This is the Paul Mantz P-51C that is in the Smithsonian in Washington, DC.

t michael jennings

 ~^

Offline Bill Little

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #13 on: October 22, 2007, 01:15:26 PM »
Hi Ty,

I will have to dig out the book on loan to me from Dennis about the Mantz plane.  The fellow who ended up with it was an Air Force officer tuened airline pilot.  He set it up for osme record flights across Antartica or such.  The logo on the fuselage has to do with him.

Originally the P-51B was in a slightly different color scheme (still red/white) when Mantz won three (IIRC) Thompson races in a row.
Big Bear <><

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Offline dave shirley jr

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #14 on: October 22, 2007, 11:50:14 PM »
actually i believe those were tip radiators. An idea that was tried to reduce drag.
i think i read that the aileron efectiveness was reduced by bad airflow and created quite a problem
very strange looking.
Dave jr.

Offline Air Ministry .

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #15 on: October 25, 2007, 03:13:39 PM »

  Theres a book on the red one from the
 Smithsonian  or whatever when they restored / displayed it,

 The pilot was the Oldham ,who almost put a stop to Air - Racing.When he planted the 'benquine'
 cause related to inertia in  tip mounted radiators . 
                               such is life .

Nice red P-51  .

Offline Bill Little

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #16 on: October 25, 2007, 05:17:18 PM »
  Theres a book on the red one from the
 Smithsonian  or whatever when they restored / displayed it,

 The pilot was the Oldham ,who almost put a stop to Air - Racing.When he planted the 'benquine'
 cause related to inertia in  tip mounted radiators . 
                               such is life .

Nice red P-51  .

Hi Matthew,

That is the book I have, it is from the Smithsonian Museum.
Big Bear <><

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Offline FLOYD CARTER

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #17 on: November 27, 2007, 02:27:40 PM »
My previous three stunters have been semi-scale (as long as you are building, why not build something that looks like a real airplane?).  First was a Hurricane, then a Lockheed SIRIUS, and now "Mr. Sandman".  The later is my design and supposed to look like a '30s homebuilt.  All 3 models have wing dihedral, which not only looks good, but they fly better!

Floyd in OR
89 years, but still going (sort of)
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Offline Leo Mehl

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #18 on: November 27, 2007, 04:57:10 PM »
My previous three stunters have been semi-scale (as long as you are building, why not build something that looks like a real airplane?).  First was a Hurricane, then a Lockheed SIRIUS, and now "Mr. Sandman".  The later is my design and supposed to look like a '30s homebuilt.  All 3 models have wing dihedral, which not only looks good, but they fly better!

Floyd in OR
Floyd, I love these planes you have built lately. I am having plans drawn for my Grinder, You will be the first to get a set. Keep it going Floyd. Never say quit. you are a great builder.

Online Bob Hunt

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #19 on: November 27, 2007, 07:28:50 PM »
Hi all:

Pursuant to the questions about Keith Trostle's Eagle design, I can shed a bit of light on the subject.

I was fortunate enough to get a "ride" on the Eagle in 1974 at a contest in Delaware. After the meet we all exchanged models and flew for a couple of hours. I remember the Eagle as being incredibly smooth and precise. It was one of the better "round" machines I had flown, but it did not possess the corner that I was used to. Please understand that it wasn't a bad cornering model; just not what I was used to at that time.

Keith originally used a very unusual engine in the Eagle. It was an RAF 40 (RAF stands for Roselli and Frye; two custom engine builders of the time). The RAF had a rear exhaust - virtually unheard of in stunt at that time - and might have become an outstanding engine with but a bit more development. I think Keith replaced the RAF with an HP 40, but I can't swear to that...

The Eagle was obviously a Semi-Scale Little Mike Goodyear racer. To my knowledge Keith never released the plans for that one. Too b ad, as it was an excellent design with real character. The flaps were designed as an integral part of the airfoil and Keith had devised a really neat hinging scheme that allowed the flap to pivot about the center of the radius of the leading edge. The result was a hidden flap line and a sort of "Fowler" appearance. I wish he would expound on that technology somewhere...

Keith is an understated kind of guy, and because of that many of his very innovative models do not get too much attention. There are many unique details on his models that make real sense, but require exceptional building skills to achieve. He could teach us all a lot!

I have very fond memories of the Eagle...

Bob Hunt         

Offline Dennis Adamisin

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #20 on: November 28, 2007, 07:59:11 PM »
Keith is an understated kind of guy, and because of that many of his very innovative models do not get too much attention. There are many unique details on his models that make real sense, but require exceptional building skills to achieve. He could teach us all a lot!

I have very fond memories of the Eagle...

Bob Hunt         

AMEN Bob.  I never had the pleasure of flying the Eagle, but I sure like it a lot!  I think the bird was heavier than Keith wanted, the RAF had the power for the job but I recall it being prone to runaways.  Bet it could be fittted with a pipe and flat pitch prop and allowed to spin-up.. but now I am playing in YOUR (other) sandbox!

BTW Keith's earlier Ta152 design also used the embedded (not sure that is the correct adjective) hingeline design.  Plan posted to try to show what it looked like... A remarkable piece of Engineering and very well executed.
Denny Adamisin
Fort Wayne, IN

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Offline Bill Little

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #21 on: November 30, 2007, 09:52:17 AM »
I have been in much contact with Keith about the EAGLE and a Scale Stunter based on the Cosmic Wind/Little Toni.  The Little Toni is one of my all time favorite airplanes for some reason......

Keith is the consumate gentleman and EXTREMELY helpful.

But, my Super Secret, ultra Classified, for your eyes only, Clearance level 29, Scale Stunter under development with the help of Ron (Mr. F-4-F Guy) Burn, is still a year or two away...................... I will have to be retired to give it the attention it deserves.  :'(
Big Bear <><

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Offline Bill Little

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #22 on: March 02, 2008, 12:53:13 PM »
I will be retired as of 1 July. ;D  Some building will actually get done! y1
Big Bear <><

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Offline Steve Helmick

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #23 on: March 02, 2008, 07:22:29 PM »
I will be retired as of 1 July. ;D  Some building will actually get done! y1

Congratulations, Bill! I'm going to be VERY envious, what with you being so young... LL~  I'll be 63 in June and don't see retirement in my lifetime. So, I guess I can't wait for retirement to start building my collection of projects. The wife won't like the dope fumes, but that's fine with me.  S?P Steve
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In 1944 18-20 year old's stormed beaches, and parachuted behind enemy lines to almost certain death.  In 2015 18-20 year old's need safe zones so people don't hurt their feelings.

Offline Bill Little

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #24 on: March 03, 2008, 07:42:10 AM »
Thanks, Steve.  I will be doing something part time, but the everyday job will be history.. ;D
Big Bear <><

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Offline Will Hinton

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #25 on: March 04, 2008, 11:50:21 AM »
DO YOU WANT FRIES WITH THAT?
Seriously Brother Bill, CONGRATS A BUNCH ON THE BIG "R"!!!!!!!!!!!!!  Just a hint, though, don't be surprised to learn that you no longer had time to work anyway - you will very quickly find that you have no time compared to before.
You will need to do like I do, inform all you know that you just left for Peru or some other remote place and then disappear to the workshop, hiding under a set of airplane plans!
Blessings,
Will
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Offline Dave Denison

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #26 on: March 04, 2008, 09:47:54 PM »
BILL.

   Listen very carefully to "brother Will".  Within the first year I retired, I started making custom snare drums for a few clients.  That "few" grew and grew.....then I wasn't retired anymore, the phone was nuts,.....another "job"!!  I'll post a pic. of the LAST ONE.

     Stopped all that early last year, now it's "building time", done at my pace!!  What fun again. y1

     REGARDS.  DAVE
Regards
Dave

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Offline Bill Little

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #27 on: March 05, 2008, 08:28:45 AM »
Thanks for the advice guys.......... (I think!! LOL!! )

Anything I do will not be a business of my own.  Been there, done that, burned the t-shirt..........

LL~ LL~ LL~ LL~

My building will be regulated by my budget! ;D
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Offline FLOYD CARTER

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #28 on: October 17, 2008, 02:40:48 PM »
Here is my version of a Lockheed SIRIUS.  Stalker 50 powered.

Floyd in OR
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Offline Michael Boucher

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #29 on: October 18, 2008, 08:07:40 AM »
Very nice Floyd!  I think I see Col. Charles Lindbergh, not in camera view, getting ready to board with his wife Anne. :)!
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Offline FLOYD CARTER

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #30 on: October 23, 2008, 02:28:42 PM »
Col. Lindbergh and Anne have taken their places and the "clear prop!" has been given.  They are off on another world trip in their beloved Lockheed Sirius.

Floyd
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Online Gordon Tarbell

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #31 on: October 26, 2008, 06:57:53 AM »
Was that built from published plans? What are the specs? WS ,Lngth, Area,? etc.
Gordon Tarbell AMA 15019

Offline Bill Little

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #32 on: March 30, 2009, 12:44:19 AM »
Ok, to come back to this one!  After a while being retired, fixing all the stuff on the house that I couldn't do when I was teaching/coaching full time, I have really started to look at the *Super Secret* project, once again.   It will be very scale, very good moments, and will hide a tuned pipe very nicely.  With Ron's construction tips, inspiration from all of Mr. Rabe's designs, the good Col. Trostle, and what I bugged Billy and Bob about for the last decade plus, I am finally ready to tackle this project.

I have to send the drawings off to Mr. Hunt for a look at a lost foam wing fixture!  There are a couple things that I need for Bob to see and work out. ;D

Things are starting to look up again.

Mongo
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Offline Avaiojet

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #33 on: September 18, 2015, 08:46:10 AM »
I like bringing old Threads back to life, especially great Threads like this one. Gives new members and old alike, the opportunity to read a bit of the past yet participate in the present.

You also get to share information about modeler's past builds. Some really nice ones here.

My contrubution is this Stuka tank buster. As scale as I could get it for my first real stunt design.

Charles

 

Trump Derangement Syndrome. TDS. 
Avaiojet Derangement Syndrome. ADS.
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If you're Trolled, you know you're doing something right.  Alpha Mike Foxtrot. "No one has ever made a difference by being like everyone else."  Marcus Cordeiro, The "Mark of Excellence," you will not be forgotten. "No amount of evidence will ever persuade an idiot."- Mark Twain. I look at the Forum as a place to contribute and make friends, some view it as a Realm where they could be King.   Proverb 11.9  "With his mouth the Godless destroys his neighbor..."  "Perhaps the greatest challenge in modeling is to build a competitive control line stunter that looks like a real airplane." David McCellan, 1980.

Online Brett Buck

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #34 on: September 18, 2015, 10:27:17 AM »

As far as Ron Burn's F-4-F, he had at least two of them.  One set on the very back row at the NATS in appearance judging with 3 or 4 points.  It had the most fabulous scale finish possible!  But it wasn't very glossy, of course.  Another story for another time.

   As a note, pretty much everyone seems to have considered that a travesty.

    Brett

Offline Avaiojet

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #35 on: September 18, 2015, 10:54:47 AM »
   As a note, pretty much everyone seems to have considered that a travesty.

    Brett

Brett,

Well said.

Read some of it here.

http://stunthanger.com/smf/index.php/topic,2930.0.html
Trump Derangement Syndrome. TDS. 
Avaiojet Derangement Syndrome. ADS.
Amazing how ignorance can get in the way of the learning process.
If you're Trolled, you know you're doing something right.  Alpha Mike Foxtrot. "No one has ever made a difference by being like everyone else."  Marcus Cordeiro, The "Mark of Excellence," you will not be forgotten. "No amount of evidence will ever persuade an idiot."- Mark Twain. I look at the Forum as a place to contribute and make friends, some view it as a Realm where they could be King.   Proverb 11.9  "With his mouth the Godless destroys his neighbor..."  "Perhaps the greatest challenge in modeling is to build a competitive control line stunter that looks like a real airplane." David McCellan, 1980.

Offline Air Ministry .

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #36 on: September 18, 2015, 09:32:10 PM »

Offline Air Ministry .

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #37 on: September 18, 2015, 10:24:19 PM »
This was the Yak before a pillock trashed it in the move.



and of course the Supermarine S6 when it was prestine. Must do a tank for it soon . No Cowarice permitted with this .  ;D


Offline Geoff Goodworth

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #38 on: September 19, 2015, 08:49:22 AM »
Keith Trostle sent me a copy of his Eagle plans—which are a work of art—and told me that his Eagle turned out too heavy.

It was inspired by the Goodyear Racer Little Mike. The give away is the raised tail plane. Little Toni was one of the first three examples of the Le Vier Cosmic Wind.


Offline Air Ministry .

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #39 on: September 19, 2015, 09:54:58 PM »






Wots PATIANCE .  :-\

Offline Tom Niebuhr

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #40 on: October 19, 2015, 03:21:25 PM »
Are there any pictures of Keith's Eagle?
AMA 7544

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #41 on: October 19, 2015, 05:31:32 PM »
Are there any pictures of Keith's Eagle?

Tom,

Thanks for asking and thanks to the others here that have commented on that "Eagle".  The only decent picture I have of the airplane is like the one that Dennis posted earlier in this thread.  Yes, it is sort of a semi scale Little Mike Goodyear racer.  It is painted in the blue with white trim and gold pin striping like the original Little Mike racer was eventually painted.  I actually called it the "Continental Eagle" and was an excursion to use a bit higher aspect ratio wing and a bit shorter nose and tail moments from the stunt norm.  It also had the one and only RAF stunt .40 with a rear exhaust.  (There were not many stunt 40's with rear exhausts in the early 70's when this flew.)  The airplane sort of worked, but was heavier than it should have been.  It took 10th at the 72 Nats.  There were arrangements made to have it published in American Aircraft Modeler (the forerunner of Model Aviation).  I completed the plans, inked on mylar.  I still have the plans.  I decided not to have it published because my next airplane, the Fw 190D (with a ST .46), was a much better performing airplane and did not feel that the Little Mike really deserved to be published as it was not what I considered a top performing airplane.  (Maybe with a good engine and a reasonable weight, it would work.) I have sent plans to a couple of people, but nothing has ever come from that.  The plans show a Rabe type moving rudder with the controls for the rudder all enclosed except for one small short pushrod to the rudder horn.  Uses a transfer bellcrank in the tail to get the pushrod to that high placed horizontal tail and the rudder motion is taken from that transfer bellcrank.  I still have the airplane hanging in my shop.  It is still intact but not worth the trouble to get it in the air again.  Maybe a Merlin 40 would make it go.  Oh, the fuselage mounted landing gear on the thing only confirms my thoughts that fuselage gears do not belong on a stunt ship.

That 72 Nats was an interesting contest.  Rabe won Open with his Sea Fury.  Dennis Adamisin won Senior and then won the Walker Cup.

Keith

« Last Edit: November 14, 2015, 06:59:28 PM by Trostle »

Online Brett Buck

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #42 on: October 22, 2015, 02:11:22 PM »
Attached pix fits the title of this thread but has nothing to do with the F4F project discussed above.  Just thought the gang would enoy seeing it.  BTW pix was sent to me by Charlie Reeves, it was taken at the FAI qualifier in Lexington in (I think) fall of 1972 (sigh).  

* Foreground is my Fouga Magister.  Clockwise from there:
* Charlie Reeves' gorgeous P-63 "Flying Red Horse"
* Al Rabe's incomparable Sea Fury
* Lew McFarland's wonderful Spinks Acromaster
* Keith Trostle's ultra slick Eagle

I find it curious (actually its LOL funny) that by "today's" paradigms on design and engine selection NONE of these would be deemed capable of competitive flight...!

Bring back Originality & Realism...

    Just to make you feel old, I was present at that contest as a spectator - when I was a tiny child! I recall the Sea Fury sitting there in the pits, looking like it was going to stomp on all the little gadfly's buzzing around it. I also liked Big Art's airplane - a Dewoitine or something like that. I thought the nose treatment was really good on that one.

   Not to kick the hornet's nest, but I would certainly be among those to suggest that those airplanes would not match up well against modern airplanes. Never was the point illustrated more clearly than this last weekend's Golden State meet, where the classic planes showed what they could and couldn't do in serious conditions. John Callentine flew an early Rabe Mustang as well as I think it could be flown (and likely better than most would have been able to manage in the late 60's-early 70's, because of the abundance of power),  really a masterful performance of compensating for the wind. It was really cool to see it flown the way it was always intended, and I can see why Al was so enamored of the idea.

    But if you compared it Paul/David/Orestes, there was no way - the corners were *drastically* better, and the airplanes could be flown at competitive sizes or under.  The patterns were flown with essentially *no* compromises due to weather, they were just as good as perfect air. Most of the people who tried that with their classic planes had some misfortune.  

   To be fair, this situation didn't change very much until the mid-late 80's, when people figured out the real use for more tail volume, and had better engines.   I have flown competitively in both eras. I can make my airplane do things that were simply impossible in even 1986 and it's not just because I learned to fly better.

    Brett

Offline Shultzie

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #43 on: November 10, 2015, 09:31:42 PM »
Mark Freeman from Vancouver, Wa  had  his amazing Spitfire published in AAM way back in ????
This was an amazingly beautiful model and Mark was and equally gifted flyer.
Don Shultz

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #44 on: November 11, 2015, 08:11:43 PM »
Baloney Perhaps ? .


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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #45 on: November 11, 2015, 08:13:12 PM »
Sorry about the Post per Picture. This computer is Steam Powered .


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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #46 on: November 11, 2015, 08:17:12 PM »
Temted to shoot it , the Wing Frames Ten Years old , I think . Rissole flattened the original Fuse from Wonder wood . woulda bin Going 2008 Otherwise,
But I need a good practise hack , so pulling the finger out on it .



Its pretty much this one. ALL the DIMENSIONS ( bar the Airfoil ) are pretty much directly SCALE derived , bit slimmer in the fuse , bigger empenage.
Spent much time digesting Al's data and contemplations. Figured 60 in. with about the same Fuse. X sction and a bit of grunt would do it .
But used a differant Nose Heavier style airfoil to make it a bit more relaxing to fly , as my 2 kilo 50 in. span MB3 had left an impression.
Designed entirely to Al's formular ( bar weight saving & fixed rudder . the finish wasnt quitye up to it, either ) This thing flew acurate
with a G-51 , I tried a 80 Torp 40 for a 10 x 4 three blade Tornado too, bit the pumper backplate, in 20 knots. it kept it running.
Would back on & off too ( 2/4 ish ) . BUT wasnt at all relaxing. Your Undivided attention even . Hence a differant approach to the P 51 .
« Last Edit: November 11, 2015, 09:19:52 PM by Matt Spencer »

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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #47 on: November 11, 2015, 08:18:36 PM »
A Few Wing frame shots.


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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #48 on: November 11, 2015, 08:20:23 PM »
Took to it with a hearth Brush to remove the vertigriss & deritiss .  LL~


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Re: Scale Stunt Designs
« Reply #49 on: November 11, 2015, 08:28:54 PM »
Quote
I can't believe it!

I'm drawing up a set of plans for that Wyvern.

Matt,

Where did those photos come from and are there plans?

Could save me a bunch of time!

Thats BRIAN DYKE in the AEROMUDDLER Mag. , Olde Blighty .

CLAPA should get you in touch , You have to be carefull on those confuseres as thie thigs wot to little to see proper .  S?P
Noting like throwing it full size on paper !







Just fluked finding these ; 1975.
 http://clstunt.com/htdocs/dc/dcboard.php?az=set_linear_mode&forum=103&page=327&topic_id=222292&prev_page=show_topic
He'd built a previous Merco powere one in a dark colour , I thought looked better , a ' D ' . ?

Wyvern : http://stunthanger.com/smf/index.php?action=printpage;topic=8546.0

We Do TEN of these , before smoko , in Christchurch ( N.Z. )  :##



http://www.clstunt.com/htdocs/dc/dcboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=103&topic_id=51773&mesg_id=51773&listing_type=search

The First ones had Rolls Royce Eagle H 24's , bit like a Sabre but 3.000 Horse . The Turbo Prop ones in a forced landing cremated the pilot
if the exhaust ducts split , which they usually did . Not very nice at all .

Heres a Eagle sucker .





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