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Design => Stunt design => Topic started by: John Miller on January 05, 2012, 01:00:12 PM

Title: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: John Miller on January 05, 2012, 01:00:12 PM
I find I'm getting more fascinated with multi engined stunters. I ran across this one, and find the lines mezmerizing. The best pictures I could find on the net, were of a great plastic model by a gifted modelor in that genre, Brett Green.

The FW T-154 only had about a double handfull built, with a few actually being operational in several modes. The model shows a night fighter version with the Antenna arrays on the nose. It was first proposed as a heavy fighter, and inspired by, and in answer to Englands Mousquito. The Germans named this one Moskito.

The design elements look to be decent to base a stunter off of. I'll have to tweak the A/R, and increase the area of the stab and elevator, but I think the final appearance should look pretty scale like.

I've ordered a book on this design that has about all the information available, that should be here early next week.

Here're a few pictures of Brett's model.

Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: Derek Barry on January 05, 2012, 01:13:01 PM
That will be awesome John!!!!!!!!!

Derek ;D
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: Mark Scarborough on January 05, 2012, 01:24:09 PM
Hey you already have a pilot for it too I bet ;)
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: John Miller on January 05, 2012, 01:56:10 PM
I do, and a fine speciman of tuetonic perfection he is. I understand, that he used to fly a BF 109.   S?P
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: Bill Little on January 05, 2012, 02:02:46 PM
Hi Brother John,

I , too, have grown fond of multi engines stunters and I don't even have one air ready, yet! LOL!!

The HE 219 will be my first one in the air.  A 1973 (Nos. 30 legal!) profile design originally based on two slant plug Fox .15s.  I have a few OS .10FSR that I believe will do MUCH better.  After that, probably a P-38 as designed by Don Hutcherson w/two .20FP.

(too many models never engough time.............. ;D )

BIG Bear
RNMM/AMM
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: Mark Scarborough on January 05, 2012, 02:16:50 PM
I do, and a fine speciman of tuetonic perfection he is. I understand, that he used to fly a BF 109.   S?P

John,, dang it,, sigh,, I guess I really should paint the silly thing, but its a slimer,, and I am going electric,,
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: John Miller on January 05, 2012, 02:37:05 PM
It appears to me that twins, and other multi's have a definate advantage flying CL stunt. The biggest handicap has been ourselves, wanting not one, but two honkin' engines mounted.

When I saw Paul fly his B-17 with 4 OS .15FPs, my eyes were opened. I have the advantage of having one of the best multi engined stunt pilots as a flying buddy. When we built the pair of Pathfinder twins, also powered by OS .15s, we found that using a pair of these smaller engines, totalling .30 sq inches, on a plane sized to what most people used at least a .40 or a .46 on, gave up nothing to the larger single engines. It seemed, as is probably a fact, that the increased prop disk area from two 9 inch props gave us the edge we needed.

The simple facts are that twins, using a pair of large engines, can, and do, handle the pattern with authority. The problem comes when the conditions begin to get edgy. Gordan has related that as the wind comes up, and the line tension goes up because of it, and the plane becomes uncomfortable to fly. He says that the plane may be capable of doing the pattern in those conditions, but, you wind up just hanging on trying to avoid the loss of the plane. As he says, you can't finess the plane under those high, line tension, conditions.

Smaller twin designs, using the smaller engines makes it much easier to do good patterns under wider conditions. And consider this. The prop  disk area of a pair of 9 inch props, exceeds the disk area of the normal 60 sized prop.

The biggest draw back to twins, is learning how to effectivly set up, match, and tune, a pair of engines for best results. This is one of the many areas that Gordy excells. He can get a pair of engines running real sweetly.

For those of us less gifted, I believe that electric may well be the best answer. An added benefit is simple retracts. (Wooohooooo)

Bill, at first you'll be frustrated with twins, after a while you'll find them so much better than a single #^.
 
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: Mark Scarborough on January 05, 2012, 02:58:38 PM


Bill, at first you'll be frustrated with twins, after a while you'll find them so much better than a single #^.
 


You know there is a one liner in there,, but I promised to behave, so I will leave it alone,, besides,, LInda may be watching then I would be in trouble,,
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: John Miller on January 05, 2012, 07:30:36 PM
Mark, your a good guy, Linda  mw~ has you whipped into good shape. y1 LL~ LL~

I really hope you can make your way to Tucson in March. It'll be a blast.
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: Mark Scarborough on January 05, 2012, 08:57:58 PM
I am working on  it,,
the desire is there, no question, its more about a few logistical issues to sort out,, like the whole work thing ,,,,,
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: Clint Ormosen on January 06, 2012, 10:06:29 PM
I am working on  it,,
the desire is there, no question, its more about a few logistical issues to sort out,, like the whole work thing ,,,,,

Meh. No issue. You simply say "I'm not going to be here the 3rd week in March!" Problem solved.
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: Mark Scarborough on January 06, 2012, 10:08:39 PM
Hey Clint, when they say " fine,, so where shall we mail your last paycheck then,," I trust you will offer me a position with equal pay and benefits  LL~
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: Randy Powell on January 07, 2012, 09:36:54 PM
Well, John, this confirms it. You need medication.
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: Mark Scarborough on January 07, 2012, 10:22:48 PM
Randy,
I am thinking I may need medication, or counseling,, maybe you can help me? sigh
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: John Miller on January 08, 2012, 09:04:06 AM
Well, John, this confirms it. You need medication.

Does this mean I are a real "modul desiinr", Or do I need counseling too? Hey, I need the straps on this jacket loosened just a little. n~

Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: Mark Scarborough on January 08, 2012, 09:28:55 AM
John, a note of experience, if you use a track ball instead of a mouse, you can still work with the straps on the jacket tight ,,,,
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: Wynn Robins on January 09, 2012, 08:42:41 PM
that is one cool looking airplane - cant wait to see what you come up with.
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: Randy Powell on January 09, 2012, 09:41:31 PM
John,

Wait till you see what I'm planning for my next PA plane.   ;D ;D
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: wwwarbird on January 10, 2012, 07:31:21 PM
 Thinking of a twin Randy?
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: PJ Rowland on January 11, 2012, 01:19:31 AM
Randy promised me he was going to start on a 4 engine bomber next.

 ;D
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: Randy Powell on January 11, 2012, 10:56:43 AM
John,

No.

PJ,

 LL~
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: Bill Little on January 11, 2012, 11:44:42 AM
You know there is a one liner in there,, but I promised to behave, so I will leave it alone,, besides,, LInda may be watching then I would be in trouble,,

Yeah, back in the day I had a crush on a twin.  Unfortunately she wasn't interested beyond "friends".  Her sister was game but I just didn't have the same "feeling" for her.  ???

BIG Bear
RNMM/AMM
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: Martin Quartim on January 14, 2012, 04:16:43 PM
Hi John,

This will be another great project. I see a tremendous advantage in twin for the VOLTS GUYS!

Cheers,

Martin
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: Tom Niebuhr on January 31, 2012, 06:35:11 AM
John,
That is a great project. It has been a few weeks, is it in the air yet?? ha ha
Title: Re: I'm starting work on drawing this one as a stunter
Post by: John Miller on January 31, 2012, 08:39:26 AM
Not in the air yet. I've collected documentation though. I bought a great book on the aircraft, and a fairley accurated plastic model to construct, so I can get the snapes right in my mind when I start the drawing process.

I suspect this one will be prefect for electic power, with retracts.