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Author Topic: Adj. Lead Out guides  (Read 17622 times)

Offline Chris Wilson

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Re: Adj. Lead Out guides
« Reply #50 on: February 26, 2012, 08:47:06 PM »
Quote from: Bill Little on February 26, 2012, 08:12:10 PM
Well the technical info quickly flew over my head, but I am still wondering what, if any advantage the split LO guide would offer.  Having the LO's close together is already something I do.......

BIG Bear
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Hi Bill,
        two things come quickly to mind mate, one, if the locking bolt mechanism is outboard of the individual guides then you could narrow the gap between them to almost whatever you like, and two, perhaps one bolt per guide is a bit of a fail safe.

One could let go and allow slippage whilst the other is still holding tight, that sounds 50% better than the whole guide system sliding to and fro in the advent of failure!
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Offline Bill Little

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Re: Adj. Lead Out guides
« Reply #51 on: February 26, 2012, 11:24:50 PM »
Quote from: Chris Wilson on February 26, 2012, 08:47:06 PM
Hi Bill,
        two things come quickly to mind mate, one, if the locking bolt mechanism is outboard of the individual guides then you could narrow the gap between them to almost whatever you like, and two, perhaps one bolt per guide is a bit of a fail safe.

One could let go and allow slippage whilst the other is still holding tight, that sounds 50% better than the whole guide system sliding to and fro in the advent of failure!

Hi Chris,

I put up a practice flight at Huntersville one year and found out after the flight that the bolt had come out of the slider and they would just move end to end in the slot!  It felt funny at times during the flight, but definitely not unflyable......... ???

Bill
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Online Howard Rush

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Re: Adj. Lead Out guides
« Reply #52 on: February 27, 2012, 01:03:54 AM »
Quote from: Bill Little on February 26, 2012, 08:12:10 PM
Well the technical info quickly flew over my head, but I am still wondering what, if any advantage the split LO guide would offer.  Having the LO's close together is already something I do.......

I think you can ignore all of the technical stuff above and not miss anything helpful for this question.  Brett posted something useful, and I was hoping that Randy Powell or Paul Walker would write in.  They were fiddling with leadout spacing to fix a problem Randy had.  I forget what it was.
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Offline louie klein

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Re: Adj. Lead Out guides
« Reply #53 on: February 27, 2012, 06:22:47 AM »
For me it's part of the crafting experience and the addition of the learning curve we all go through. I don't feel it takes that much more time to do if all is prept from the begining. As I was tought by this hobbies influence is always try to make the next plane better than the last with some kind of improvement that you learned or want to try. IMO. Good luck!---LOUIE  H^^ D>K
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Offline Mark Scarborough

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Re: Adj. Lead Out guides
« Reply #54 on: February 27, 2012, 09:03:42 AM »
I remember Randy talking about moving one leadout to address a specific issue on one manuever, perhaps the hourglass? but that's about what I recall, not much help,,

HEY RANDY
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Offline EddyR

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Re: Adj. Lead Out guides
« Reply #55 on: February 27, 2012, 10:56:43 AM »
The fences on my plane in the picture above run from front to back on the flaps. They made the plane cleaner in tight corners in the wind. They seemed to hold the air on the flap. These flaps were very stiff and did not bend or flex at all. I noticed I/beam planes flew cleaner,smoother,than foam wing planes. That was the thinking behind the ribs on the flaps. It was one of those things that gets tried but never followed through to prove it was of any gain. mw~
Ed
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Offline Larry Cunningham

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Re: Adj. Lead Out guides
« Reply #56 on: February 27, 2012, 06:29:04 PM »
..much longer than you'll ever need  <=

L.

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Offline Larry Cunningham

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Re: Adj. Lead Out guides
« Reply #57 on: March 02, 2012, 11:27:07 AM »
Charles,

I really couldn't say. All I intend to suggest is that you have plenty, and when it comes down to
your actual useful range, you will find that it's a fairly short adjustment area. No harm in what
you're doing, it's likely wise until you find where your particular model trims in.

Trimming and experimenting will reveal what you seek. Once you determine it, you'll be
able to generalize for that design, in a meaningful way.

I strongly believe in providing options, this is an example of a feature that doesn't really
cost anything.

Good luck in your venture.

L.

"Life is a progress, and not a station." -Ralph Waldo Emerson
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Offline Mark Scarborough

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Re: Adj. Lead Out guides
« Reply #58 on: March 02, 2012, 11:30:57 AM »
Charles, how do you propose to adjust it? I dont think you can get a ball driver through that slot to make any adjustments. Mine are usually closer to 1/8" wide. ( vertically) and depending upon how far back into the tip the adjustor is, you may end up wearing the sides of a narrow slot with the leadouts.
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Offline Larry Cunningham

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Re: Adj. Lead Out guides
« Reply #59 on: March 02, 2012, 12:21:29 PM »
Quote from: Mark Scarborough on March 02, 2012, 11:30:57 AM
Charles, how do you propose to adjust it? I dont think you can get a ball driver through that slot to make any adjustments. Mine are usually closer to 1/8" wide. ( vertically) and depending upon how far back into the tip the adjustor is, you may end up wearing the sides of a narrow slot with the leadouts.


It does look a bit narrow, 1/8" is a practical finished slot height. Problem is, a thin wing tip piece doesn't
provide a lot of room for a wider slot. Also, it is useful to laminate 1/64" plywood strips to upper and lower
slot surfaces to make it durable. This adds another 1/32" to the needed slot height in the balsa, making it 5/32".

I'll attach a couple of snapshots from my 2007 Laser Continental kit AutoCAD design for Bill Sawyer,
which illustrates an approach to a laminated tip. That model used 1/32" plywood on the slot upper and lower
surfaces, but 1/64" would be my choice.  (1/32" plywood was used in the kit because it was available on other
part sheets.)

L.

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Offline Bill Little

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Re: Adj. Lead Out guides
« Reply #60 on: March 02, 2012, 03:37:55 PM »
Quote from: Avaiojet on February 27, 2012, 07:12:12 PM
Larry,

Thanks for the reply.

OK, that's good news.

What measurement will I need? Forward of the CG and aft? Half inch forward and an inch back?

Charles

HI Charles,

Since we do not really have a clue yet as to where you will be starting out with the LOs, it's hard to say how much is a minimal distance to add to both sides. 

How do they adjust?  I cannot see a way to get a tool of any source in there to adjust the guide.  A general guideline is 1/8" to 3/16" opening for the slot.  Always remember the KISS principle especially for things that are simple.

BIG Bear
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Offline Larry Cunningham

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Re: Adj. Lead Out guides
« Reply #61 on: March 03, 2012, 12:38:08 PM »
Sounds interesting. I'd like to see a shot of and/or details of your adjustment device. Did you
show that in the earlier thread? Can you direct me to the earlier thread?

I'm always interested in this sort of thing.

Thanks,

L.

PS - almost forgot - one trick to make your slot more durable, short of adding laminates, is to saturate the balsa
surfaces with thin CA to harden them, and use an emery board nail file to smooth the slot out.

"He was pulled over for speeding, but he let the officer go with just a warning.." - said of The Most Interesting Man In The World
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Offline Mark Scarborough

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Re: Adj. Lead Out guides
« Reply #62 on: March 03, 2012, 01:06:08 PM »
Quote from: Avaiojet on March 03, 2012, 11:37:50 AM
Mark, Bill,

That "slit" is all I need! I'll probably line each side with thin brass or aluminum sheet. Keep the lines a bit snug plus to keep the lines from wearing down the balsa.

I'm not using the traditional adjustable leadout device which is available, as I mentioned above. I said I may not use it.

I've designed a different one, as I mentioned in a Thread, way back, when I first saw what was available.

I'll have to see if it works correctly once installed.

Charles
Charles, remember every gram is significant, 1/32 ply is a lot lighter than aluminum or brass, and it will not fray the leadouts either. You do not want the leadouts to touch the sides of the slot. it will cause problems with in flight control. remember, there is no self centering servo on this, its only line tension and  your deft touch that centers the controls. I typically encourage innovation, but there is also a time to look at what has been done and think about WHY its done the way it is now. often times there is a very good reason.. but then who knows you may come up with the next great mousetrap...
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Online Howard Rush

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Re: Adj. Lead Out guides
« Reply #63 on: March 03, 2012, 05:31:11 PM »
Quote from: Avaiojet on March 03, 2012, 11:37:50 AM
That "slit" is all I need!

Reminds me of some blues song.
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Offline Larry Cunningham

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Re: Adj. Lead Out guides
« Reply #64 on: March 15, 2012, 08:47:44 PM »
Howard, as you no doubt know but are chosing to ignore, many of the more advanced religions on this planet recognize the living status of ALL things, even those you think of as simple material bits. This is why if you curse a stunter, it will typically respond by being a worthless POC. Meanwhile, a beloved model, even if it has a canted stab/elevator, and other aerodynamics which are crookeder than the proverbial dog's leg, it often returns the affection, making itself a beloved creature.

I want you to back down off all this negative crap, my friend. Model airplanes are PEOPLE TOO!

L.

'I had an uncle who was a leper - he only did the  "pull my finger - fart joke" 10 times' -Steven Wright
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Offline Bill Little

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Re: Adj. Lead Out guides
« Reply #65 on: March 21, 2012, 11:32:49 AM »
Hi Charles,

How are you securing the setting with your adjustable lead out?  There has to be some way to adjust and then secure........

BIG Bear
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