Author Topic: Lavochkin La-5 - Brodak kit. (Read 14906 times)

John Miller · « **Reply #50 on:** January 23, 2011, 05:08:49 PM »

Quote from: John Rist on January 23, 2011, 03:41:00 PM

I have John's Fancy piece of bent wire (came in the kit). What I need is the versions that has the the shocks, struts and attached wheel doors. It also looks like John put wheel wells in the bottom of the wing. This feature is not on the plans or in the kit.

I thought profile was supposed to be easy!

John B's plane had retracts originally, designed and built by Bob Zambelli. I understand they had an issue with them so they were removed, and the gear locked in place. With the new timers from Hubin, retracts are a cinch with electric power as you are planning.

The wells for retracts are not on the plans, as at the time it was not a feature that was considered.

Your graphics are coming along great. Your project is coming along really good.

John Rist · « **Reply #51 on:** January 23, 2011, 06:05:52 PM »

I had not planned to install retracts. The rules state that they are not required for profile scale. I plan to omit retracts for several reasons - cost, weight, and effort. I decided to go profile/electric to keep the project down to a level I can handle (cost and skill). Right now I plan to use the stock kit landing gear with some detail added. I'm thinking the landing gear can be dressed up with dowel rods of various sizes and some paint. Right now I plan to fake the wheel wells with trim and paint - same as the panel lines, rivets, & etc. My experience with scale judging is that I will never get close to 100 - so 100 of hours of extra effort and 100 of $ probable won't improve my score. But who knows - a scale ship is never finished ----------------

and I am having fun!!!!

Bill Little · « **Reply #52 on:** January 24, 2011, 09:35:04 AM »

Hi John,

You can split the various sizes of styrene plastic tube sold at the LHS to make the struts look more scale. Evergreen (styrene) and Plastruct (ABS) are two common sources.

Big Bear

John Rist · « **Reply #53 on:** January 26, 2011, 01:58:52 PM »

Quote from: Bill Little on January 24, 2011, 09:35:04 AM

Hi John,

You can split the various sizes of styrene plastic tube sold at the LHS to make the struts look more scale. Evergreen (styrene) and Plastruct (ABS) are two common sources.

Big Bear

Sounds good. I will check it out Thanks!

Bill Little · « **Reply #54 on:** January 26, 2011, 04:06:33 PM »

Quote from: John Rist on January 26, 2011, 01:58:52 PM

Sounds good. I will check it out Thanks!

Hi John,

I hope it helps. I was heavily involved in building plastic display models at one time. IPMS contests and such, and there are a LOT of things the plastic modeler uses that can be used in our "flying models". Especially for scale details. I know in the past I even used watch gears for trim tab wheels, and such, in the cock pit. Model Railroad details can be used too.

Bill

John Rist · « **Reply #55 on:** February 14, 2011, 07:35:26 AM »

Shoulder replacement went well. I am slowly regaining the use of the arm. I already have the full use of my hand at key board level. I am back working on the LA-5 decals (all done on the computer). Control Line Centrial has agreed to cut the stencils for the lettering on the sides. I will get this done done as soon as I finish the art work. I start by sucking the color photo of the aircraft (downloaded off of the net) into a program called paint. With paint I cut and paste the lettering into a new file. I then dump this new file into a graphics program called Visio. I enlarge it to a file 150" long. I then trace each letter segment with a filled polygon. By using many points I can simulate smooth curves and straight lines. When the tracing is finished I can delete the original picture (it is a single object) and have nothing but the black lettering left. I then do some careful measuring on the picture and my model and determine the actual size needeed for the final stencils. I shrink the 150" decal down to size needed (10" to 15") and walla I have the master needed for Control Line Central to produce a decal. Attached is the cut and paist photo I started with and the resulting art work for the stencile. I am working on the other side. PS the below is low res for posting. The actual artwork is much smoother.

Bill Little · « **Reply #56 on:** February 14, 2011, 09:58:02 PM »

Hi John,

Excellent work on the decals/stencils artwork!

I use coreldraw (an older edition) for my artwork, which is about the same according to your description.

Pictures! LOL!!

Bill

Bill Little · « **Reply #57 on:** March 21, 2011, 10:46:51 AM »

Hi John,

Any more progress since the shoulder surgery? Keep updating as it nears completion, OK?
It's been very interesting to follow your progress.

Bill

John Rist · « **Reply #58 on:** March 21, 2011, 10:32:01 PM »

Quote from: Bill Little on March 21, 2011, 10:46:51 AM

Hi John,

Any more progress since the shoulder surgery? Keep updating as it nears completion, OK?
It's been very interesting to follow your progress.

Bill

It's cutting into my nap time but I am getting back to building. Started tail wheel assembly. I will post more when I get in full swing.

John Rist · « **Reply #59 on:** March 26, 2011, 04:15:37 PM »

Well I have finished the tail wheel. It is pretty much per the Brodak Print. However it is longer than the tail wheel on the picture. The 3 view I have does not show the tail wheel. Of course at 15' it my not matter.

john e. holliday · « **Reply #60 on:** March 26, 2011, 07:23:02 PM »

Looks good to me. As they don't have precision scale any more, do they still measure or just eye ball every thing?

Bill Little · « **Reply #61 on:** March 26, 2011, 08:05:24 PM »

Real nice job on the scale strut. It looks like it is going to be very nice when finished, John!
Big Bear

John Rist · « **Reply #62 on:** March 27, 2011, 08:41:23 PM »

Quote from: john e. holliday on March 26, 2011, 07:23:02 PM

Looks good to me. As they don't have precision scale any more, do they still measure or just eye ball every thing?

I am not sure about Precision scale being completely gone but my LA-5 is a profile scale ship. Everything is judged at 15'

John Rist · « **Reply #63 on:** April 02, 2011, 02:42:19 PM »

Well the wing is squared up to the fuselage and tacked in place with CA. A good double check on strightness and I will epoxy it in. Next step it to flare the leading edge into the fuselage.

John Rist · « **Reply #64 on:** April 15, 2011, 10:55:26 PM »

The leading edge has been flared into the fuselage. The plans and the book are different. The instruction book was the best source for this step.

John Rist · « **Reply #65 on:** April 16, 2011, 05:31:44 PM »

Back to the subject of wheel struts: It looks like Robart has a strut that is close. A little work and it will be OK.

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXET59&P=7

The one I would love to have is: http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXES65&P=ML But at $80 a pair I can't see it. It is a real shock - I wounder if it would help or hurt the landing.

Glenn (Gravitywell) Reach · « **Reply #66 on:** April 16, 2011, 05:53:38 PM »

Al Rabe uses a soft sprung landing gear. He says it helps prevent bounce, but you have to get the right tension or it enhances the bounce!

chuck snyder · « **Reply #67 on:** April 16, 2011, 06:36:36 PM »

John, I have that type strut on my Hornet, Typhoon, and HS-129(two Robart, one some unknown brand). They help landings a big bunch!
Chuck

John Rist · « **Reply #68 on:** April 16, 2011, 09:00:44 PM »

Quote from: chuck snyder on April 16, 2011, 06:36:36 PM

John, I have that type strut on my Hornet, Typhoon, and HS-129(two Robart, one some unknown brand). They help landings a big bunch!
Chuck

Very intersting! They may be worth the price. A previous post states that the spring tension needs to be correct. Is there a way to vary the spring tension on the Robart?

chuck snyder · « **Reply #69 on:** April 17, 2011, 10:44:29 AM »

John, you can take them apart and replace the springs or add a spacer to increase the pre-load.
Chuck

John Rist · « **Reply #70 on:** April 19, 2011, 04:18:57 PM »

Well it's time to start dopeing the airframe getting it ready to cover. I plan to cover the whole airplane with silk span. I have on hand Brodak Butyrate Dope, Butyrate Sanding sealer, and Brodak Butyrate thinner. From what I read in the finishing section I am guessing the following is a way to go.
1. Dope intire wood structure with 50-50 thinner/dope.
2. Sand between coats - repeat three times for three coats.
3. Apply silk span wet. Dope in place with 60 - 40 thinner/dope
4. Several coats of Sanding Sealer 50 -50 thinner/dope.
5. Prime with ?
6. Paint with Rustoleam.

This will be my first Silkspan covered airplane since 1960. All of what I have done lately has been Monacoat. SO all comments welcome.

By the way I needed to build a paint stick. Beings this is an electric I came up with the idea of using the mounting plate off of the motor to make a paint stick. Photos attached.

john e. holliday · « **Reply #71 on:** April 24, 2011, 07:41:48 AM »

When I put my silkspan or poly-span on I usually but enough clear dope on the surface wood, thinned to 50-50, til it gets a little sheen to it. Sanding every other coat. Two coats a day max and let sit for a day. Use the thinned dope to put the silkspan/poly spand down. One thing I like about dope and I forgot it from my combat days with silk, is if I see a wrinkle, I dope and pull again.

Now are you ssure the rod for your paint stand is big enough?

H^^I should talk as my paint stand has a steel/iron rod.

John Rist · « **Reply #72 on:** April 26, 2011, 08:56:07 AM »

quote "Now are you ssure the rod for your paint stand is big enough?

H^^I should talk as my paint stand has a steel/iron rod."

When you are pore you use what you have - In this case an old closet rod.

John Rist · « **Reply #73 on:** April 30, 2011, 08:43:42 PM »

CLS sent the spray masks for the lettering. They look great!!

John Rist · « **Reply #74 on:** May 12, 2011, 03:32:01 PM »

Well I am making progress on the landing gear. They will be fixed (retracts not a requirement for profile scale). The Brodak LA-5 kit pretty much leaves the landing gear up to the builder. The kit does have the bent wire for the gear and some wood for the wheel doors. The plans do show the gear installed however the book has no instructions for building a scale looking gear. I will be using Robart scale struts, wood dial rod, and a pair of RC car shocks along with the stuff that came in the kit. The only info I have is from the 3 View.

John Rist · « **Reply #75 on:** May 14, 2011, 06:17:34 PM »

Quote from: Glenn (Gravitywell) Reach on January 23, 2011, 04:17:17 PM

Hi John. Al Rabe did an amazing pictorial on Stuka Stunt on how to paint wheel well openings on and make them look REAL. Do a search there on him and look for painting and finishing. I believe it was one of his P-51's. And as far as the actual strut goes, you can always ask John! Love your project and have been watching it closely.

I went and looked at Al Rabe's P-51 painted wheel wells. They were done in Zinc Chromate because we are talking raw aluminum inside the aircraft. Did the USSR prime the LA-5 aluminum parts with Zinc Chromate? If this be true the inside of the gear doors and wheel wells would be Zinc Chromate and the outside of the gear doors would be blue.

What is the most likely color of the wheel struts? The sliding shock members are shiny steel - what color would the struts themselves be?

John Miller · « **Reply #76 on:** May 14, 2011, 06:43:55 PM »

John, most of the reading I've done on the La's and LaGGs point out that the Russians were realists, with a shortage of aluminum to use to build fighters with, at least until the Lend-Lease program got running up to steam, but they had lots of wood. Much of their fighter aircraft only lasted a month or so in the field, so even using any kind of preservative was not usually done.

I'm not certain how much wood was used in wing construction beyond the spar and ribs. Most likely they were skinned with some type of plywood. If you can get a picture of the inside of the gear wells, I'd almost bet that the colors used are basically the same as the outside.

This lack of preservatives has been the reason few WWll Russian fighters have survived.

John Rist · « **Reply #77 on:** May 14, 2011, 08:25:32 PM »

Quote from: John Miller on May 14, 2011, 06:43:55 PM

John, most of the reading I've done on the La's and LaGGs point out that the Russians were realists, with a shortage of aluminum to use to build fighters with, at least until the Lend-Lease program got running up to steam, but they had lots of wood. Much of their fighter aircraft only lasted a month or so in the field, so even using any kind of preservative was not usually done.

I'm not certain how much wood was used in wing construction beyond the spar and ribs. Most likely they were skinned with some type of plywood. If you can get a picture of the inside of the gear wells, I'd almost bet that the colors used are basically the same as the outside.

This lack of preservatives has been the reason few WWll Russian fighters have survived.

It looks like you are correct. The LA-5 was wood construction.

The Lavochkin La-5 was based on the Lavochkin LaGG-3.1,4,5 The La-5 also had an all wood construction.1 The La-5FN used metal and wood construction.5

Above was found at: http://www.wwiivehicles.com/ussr/aircraft/fighter/lavochkin-la-5.asp

So it is highly likely that the inside of the wheel wells were the same color as the outside. I suspect the wheel doors were also plywood.

Thanks John all good stuff

John Rist · « **Reply #78 on:** May 15, 2011, 11:06:10 PM »

Well I have one gear strut finished - now to make the other one look the same! I should start covering this bird this week.

Air Ministry . · « **Reply #79 on:** May 16, 2011, 01:28:48 AM »

What type of wheel do you have there, looks less fat than the avg. 'r.c. wheel !

John Rist · « **Reply #80 on:** May 16, 2011, 03:43:57 AM »

Quote from: Matthew Spencer on May 16, 2011, 01:28:48 AM

What type of wheel do you have there, looks less fat than the avg. 'r.c. wheel !

Low Bounce Model Aircraft Wheel by Robart. P/N 116- 3-1/2" Scale Straight Tread. Paid about $15 for the pair. Comes with axle bushings for 1/8', 5/32", 3/16", & 1/4". Also comes with spoked or smooth center hub cover.

John Rist · « **Reply #81 on:** May 20, 2011, 12:50:50 AM »

Quote from: chuck snyder on January 01, 2011, 12:14:15 PM

John,
I just bought some exterior latex paint from Home Depot for a DH-4 I am building. Color matched to the Solartex covering. They have "sample" sizes at 7.5 ounces for $2.94 plus tax. Can't beat the price. I may get to paint a couple pieces later this weekend and see how well the color match is after it dries, but it looks good in the can. Even has a screw on lid which is nice for our purposes. It looked to me like the color match machine only needed about a square inch of sample.
Chuck

Just bought a 7.5 ounce sample jar of white latex from Home Depot. Also bought some Floetrol additive. Elsewhere it is recommend that I use windshield washer fluid to thin the latex. Any suggestions as to how much Floetrol to use and how much to thinner to add. And what is the advantage of using windshield washer fluid as a thinner?

chuck snyder · « **Reply #82 on:** May 20, 2011, 10:31:42 AM »

John, what little bit I have used latex, I did not use Floetrol. I have used both WW fluid and plain water to thin. I doubt I measured; just enough to get it through the gun. Don't worry about it looking rough or orange peeled when first sprayed--it will flow out nicely. Biggest worry I had was runs, hence minimizing thinner.
Chuck

John Rist · « **Reply #83 on:** May 22, 2011, 09:38:59 PM »

OK - Today I finished covering the wood frame with polyspan and silkspan. This was my first stab at this procedure. All in all it looks OK. I did apply the silkspan wet. That worked very well. I did find out wet silk span is almost impossible to cut with an exato knife (even with a new blade). I found it best to mark with a pencil and precut with sharp scissors to fit around the wing etc. On the edge just let it extend past and trim after the dope dries some. The fuzzy edges and any minor wrinkles Can be removed by rubbing with a folded paper towel soaked in thinner. In fact your finger and the folded paper towel are the main tools needed to get rid of wrinkles and bubbles.

I have a few spots that are not perfect. Hopefully 3-4 coats of sanding sealer and some light sanding will eliminate most of the ugly spots. However I have been told that an aircraft needs some ugly drag to fly well!

Should be able to post pictures next week of an airplane ready for its first color coat. In this case USSR winter white.

John Rist · « **Reply #84 on:** May 23, 2011, 02:04:16 PM »

Ready for a paint job. 3 coats of sanding sealer a light sanding and then a latex finish.

John Rist · « **Reply #85 on:** May 25, 2011, 06:13:57 PM »

Ready for paint! I am doing all the Little thing such as mount the landing gear while the dope cures. I figure a couple to 3 days should be enough cure time.

John Rist · « **Reply #86 on:** May 27, 2011, 12:43:20 PM »

Didn't like the original esc I bought. It was too hard to setup (no program card). So I bought a Trunigy Plash-60A (60 amp x 6S unit) and the programing card. I finally got around to testing it today. Setup was Trunigy Plash-60A ESC, Trunigy C3548-900 motor, Win Force 3000 4S - 35C battery, APC 11x5.5E prop. Mounted in the the test stand at full throttle the motor ran for 4 minutes 10 seconds at which time ESC shut off the motor. Current draw was around 37 amps. RPMs were 10,300. Recharge took 2391 mah. For a 3000 mah pack this is about 79% capacity. At end of the run battery and motor were warm but comfortable to touch. ESC was close to room temperature. SO all-in-all I feel that I have a good working setup.

About 1/2 of a scale flight is at less than full throttle. Air time for a flight is no more than 3 minutes. SO it looks like I have plenty of battery and 10K on a 11x5.5 prop is plenty of power. I am HAPPY!

John Rist · « **Reply #87 on:** May 28, 2011, 10:04:07 AM »

In the category of you gets what you pay for I bought a Haber Freight detail gun. I was having trouble getting it to work properply. It kept quitting after a little spray time. I would open the lid look to see if it had paint left - and it would work again. Well to make the long story short the air vent hole in the lid was molded shut. I fixed it! works great now.

john e. holliday · « **Reply #88 on:** May 28, 2011, 05:16:23 PM »

Isn't it always something simple. Glad you got it fixed.

John Rist · « **Reply #89 on:** May 28, 2011, 06:15:50 PM »

Well just spent most of the afternoon redrawing the ussr stars that go on my LA-5. The ones in the Brodak kit had two problems for me. The ship I am copying has red stars with black borders. The Brodak stars have white borders. Also I found them to be about 20% to big when compaired to the photo I am using. No big deal mine look good now. Attached is the photo I am trying to match.

john e. holliday · « **Reply #90 on:** May 30, 2011, 12:02:37 PM »

That is going to be something when finished.

John Rist · « **Reply #91 on:** May 30, 2011, 01:57:32 PM »

Quote from: john e. holliday on May 30, 2011, 12:02:37 PM

That is going to be something when finished.

WOW John, I didn't know you were coming over and going to help me paint this bird. My finishing ability is suspect. But hay, this is profile scale so all I need is a 15' finish.

john e. holliday · « **Reply #92 on:** May 31, 2011, 09:11:22 AM »

Read your rules again. BOM remember. I can't do any of the finish for ya.

John Rist · « **Reply #93 on:** June 07, 2011, 02:24:16 PM »

Well the bottom of the wing is finished!!!

Thomas Wilk · « **Reply #94 on:** June 07, 2011, 03:17:12 PM »

It is people like you that caused me to give up modeling.

Great looking work. I could only wish to be that good.

Tom Wilk

Russ Danneman · « **Reply #95 on:** June 08, 2011, 02:26:59 PM »

SWEET!!! rd

John Rist · « **Reply #96 on:** June 09, 2011, 10:40:20 PM »

Tail almost finished.

Bill Little · « **Reply #97 on:** June 10, 2011, 10:51:52 AM »

John, you are doing an EXCELLENT job! The tail wheel assembly looks sweet.

Big Bear

John Rist · « **Reply #98 on:** June 21, 2011, 10:17:00 PM »

Well all I need now is a finished airplane to put in my new toy box!

louie klein · « **Reply #99 on:** June 22, 2011, 07:44:52 AM »

Now that is PRO quality!--LOUIE