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Author Topic: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.  (Read 29385 times)

Online Avaiojet

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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #100 on: February 13, 2016, 06:53:55 AM »
You are typing so obviously rumors of this killing you are overstated LL~

CA...  Wow.  Stretched hand tight that looks pretty darn good.

I've never used silk, just silkspan, and that has been years now.  Everything was wet, and put down with dope, and just brushed into place.  As it dried the slack would go away. 

I am almost inspired to try it... Maybe eventually. 

I look forward to seeing what you do. 

Phil

Phil,

I'm inspired by myself also. I'm kidding! I'm also looking forward to seeing what I do.
Kidding again.  LL~

I'm done with the other side! Took just about an hour. Experience from the first side? I think so.

The first side took much longer. The learning experience.

I didn't precut the pieces, cut them just as I went along.

First side I wet the silk. Not saying that created issues, but it stuck and was harder to move around and put in place.

The side I did this morning I applied dry. BAM! What a difference. I went through the first piece with ease. The largest piece.

The two others followed and I applied them dry also.

Now, here's the thing, around the rudder area, there were some miner wrinkles, I had to spray the area with a dusting of water to pull them out.

Sure, here and there I have a few ripples, but I'm guessing the dope will take them out.

It should wind up wrinkle free.

Photos when my camera battery is charge.

Phil,

Thanks for the reply.
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Offline Fred Cronenwett

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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #101 on: February 14, 2016, 08:02:03 PM »
that kind of fuselage is difficult to cover, looking good

Fred
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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #102 on: February 14, 2016, 08:33:22 PM »
that kind of fuselage is difficult to cover, looking good

Fred

Fred,

Thanks for the compliment.

I was just going to Post a few more photos and read your reply. It wasn't all that difficult using CA.

I did decided I'm going "Extreme" scale with the model. Whatever that means?

Thanks for the reply.

« Last Edit: June 16, 2016, 08:07:11 PM by Avaiojet »
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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #103 on: February 16, 2016, 08:45:54 AM »
Talk about a mix in covering material.

Wing is old silkspan,

Control surfaces are Haboti 5mm from, Dharma

Fuselage is AERO brand silk.

I like the Dharma silk the best.

Shaping up!

« Last Edit: June 16, 2016, 08:07:41 PM by Avaiojet »
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Offline Fred Cronenwett

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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #104 on: February 16, 2016, 10:23:13 AM »
That is going to be good looking model, love the Gee Bee. I saw Delmar fly his replica at Reno...awesome

Fred
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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #105 on: February 16, 2016, 06:01:48 PM »
That is going to be good looking model, love the Gee Bee. I saw Delmar fly his replica at Reno...awesome

Fred

Fred,

That was the GB R-1. Which is much more popular. Probably because of Ben Delmar's aerobatics.

Tell you one thing, I'll never get used to using clear dope. I really don't like working with it.

I have so few pin holes on each open bay, I may just hit each one by themselves. I have a ton of dope on and still have some pin holes.

I always get through this issue.

Thanks for the reply.

Charles

« Last Edit: June 16, 2016, 08:08:47 PM by Avaiojet »
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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #106 on: February 16, 2016, 08:22:55 PM »
I last used Dope in the late 80's and moved on to different paint systems. There are so many different systems we can use to paint the models. Sparky has some great videos on his stunthanger  youtube channel that might help.

Fred
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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #107 on: February 17, 2016, 06:31:22 AM »
I last used Dope in the late 80's and moved on to different paint systems. There are so many different systems we can use to paint the models. Sparky has some great videos on his stunthanger  youtube channel that might help.

Fred

Fred,

For sheeted areas it's a no brainer. That's all I built in R/C. We used glass cloth and it's catching on in CL. There's also Polycrylic, which I have used.

For applying silk to open bays, if you elect to apply the silk wet, I believe dope is the only answer?

For filling weave, I imagine there are other clear products, but except for dope, I don't believe any will shrink and tighten the silk?

I'm still not convinced that iron products are the way to go? I may try it on my next model.

Thanks for the reply.

Charles

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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #108 on: February 18, 2016, 02:22:01 PM »
Still dopeing out of the back of my Tucsun. Total dedication.  ;D

The second generation ARGO II, Casino Royale 007, just about ready for covering.

Couple more coats of dope on the Gee Bee Z and it will be just about ready for primer.

Yes, I'm excited!  #^

« Last Edit: June 16, 2016, 08:13:22 PM by Avaiojet »
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Offline Glenn (Gravitywell) Reach

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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #109 on: February 18, 2016, 02:52:22 PM »
Looking good Charles.....not you, the airplanes! n~ H^^
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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #110 on: February 18, 2016, 08:54:44 PM »
Fred,

That was the GB R-1. Which is much more popular. Probably because of Ben Delmar's aerobatics.


   Not to sound like I'm bullying you, but that would be the R-2, smaller engine Bendix racer.


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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #111 on: February 19, 2016, 12:29:12 AM »
Dan,

I don't mind the correction, I get them mixed up all the time.

I have a book about the Gee Bee's someplace, I should dig it up. Interesting bunch of guys and really remarkable aircraft.

Thanks for the reply.

Charles
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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #112 on: February 20, 2016, 10:00:49 AM »
I did a preliminary assembly this morning. Certainly more will follow when primer is applied.

The Z only has a 59" wingspan, but I find it bulky to handle because of the chubby fuselage and the wheel covers. And a cowling you cannot hold on to.

No paint yet, but I think it still looks nice assembled.

There's still plenty that remains to be done on this model, but it has come a long ways.



« Last Edit: June 16, 2016, 08:15:16 PM by Avaiojet »
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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #113 on: June 16, 2016, 08:17:55 PM »
Here's another Thread I didn't want to go to the wayside without the photos.

Just replaced all the lost photos.

In fact, I'm hoping to get back on this model soon.

Charles
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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #114 on: July 11, 2016, 07:12:25 PM »
Watching with interest, Chaz! I am still 'taken' by your wing fillets, add those to your using silk!
 
I built a Half-Fast lll in the '50s, (combat flying wing, by Midwest)
I used silk, and 3 or 4 coats of brushed clear dope, then 2 coats of Corsair blue. Loved the final finish...sanding lightly between coats, just like the real stuff!

Hoping for more installments...

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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #115 on: July 11, 2016, 07:51:37 PM »
I'm with Mike.  This has always been a plane that has grabbed my attention.  From the first time I saw it on one of those old Jello airplane discs (hows that for ageing me!) till today.  Every time I see one I am in awe of the Granvilles and their creation.  Can't waite to see some in the air shots of this beauty!
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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #116 on: July 11, 2016, 08:39:33 PM »
Watching with interest, Chaz! I am still 'taken' by your wing fillets, add those to your using silk!
 
I built a Half-Fast lll in the '50s, (combat flying wing, by Midwest)
I used silk, and 3 or 4 coats of brushed clear dope, then 2 coats of Corsair blue. Loved the final finish...sanding lightly between coats, just like the real stuff!

Hoping for more installments...

Mike,

Thanks for the kind words and thanks for Posting. I'm sure you know the thread isn't recent.

I lose interest quickly, so I bounce around from model to model. I actually like working this way.

I will be back on the Gee Bee Z soon. As soon as I get a bit more done on my AG Cat 164A. There's no build on this model.

I'm currently designing the wings and will get the file off for laser cutting, along with a few other parts.

I am working on the ARGO II also, getting the ARGO II ready for paint.

Thanks for the reply. BTW. Are you still doing combat?

Glenn,

Hey! Hey!

What is a Jello airplane discs? I'm old also but I don't know it. 

The Gee Bee Z is my all time second favorite airplane to model. I've built a few of the Gee Bee Z's in R/C, Flew some, sold some and I still have one left, besides the Z, that I expect to convert to CL.

I'll get back on the Gee Bee Z soon.

Charles





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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #117 on: July 17, 2016, 01:39:55 PM »
Floyd,

What "Class?" And how did you manage to place 1st, when the color scheme isn't documented?

I thought that stuff was important?

Charles



My document package explained that the surviving "D" models underwent several modifications, including engine changes and color schemes.  So my colors were in the "possible" category.  I got dinged on color authenticity, but I guess I made up for it in the flying, or something.

But, hey!  I just put up flights, and the judges did the rest.

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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #118 on: July 17, 2016, 02:52:25 PM »
My document package explained that the surviving "D" models underwent several modifications, including engine changes and color schemes.  So my colors were in the "possible" category.  I got dinged on color authenticity, but I guess I made up for it in the flying, or something.

But, hey!  I just put up flights, and the judges did the rest.

Floyd

Floyd,

Thanks for the reply and kudos on that model and the win.

Speaking of models and winning.

There's much to be learned when choosing a model for scale compitition and what it takes as far as the flight plus documentation.

I might start looking into this.

Thanks again for the reply.

Charles
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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #119 on: July 07, 2018, 06:28:14 PM »
Rarely do I receive great photos, let alone photos at all, from modelers who use my graphics.

These two models are 90" or so in span. Took him a bit of time but as he said he would, he did send them.

Makes me want to drop everything and finish my Gee Bee Z. Nah!

Charles
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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #120 on: July 13, 2018, 08:20:40 AM »
Did you ever get this one buttoned up?

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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #121 on: July 14, 2018, 08:28:22 AM »
Did you ever get this one buttoned up?

TJ,

Thanks for the reply.

The GBZ is temporarily on hold. I'm looking into surface detail and how I'm going to represent this?

I'm also out of room or space. I have to get rid of a few models if I wish to continue on the others I have in various build stages.

I miss my two car garage.

Thanks again for the reply.

Charles
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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #122 on: March 02, 2020, 03:39:46 PM »
Wow!

I haven't added anything to this thread in a year and a half. Yes, I'm still alive.

I'm not in limbo but a model or two may be.    n~

"I'M GOING ELECTRIC!!"

I'm doing the GBR-3 first then I'll do the Gee Bee Z.

I'm currently educating myself on electric systems. And there are as many of these as there are people in India. I believe a billion and change.  ;D

I'll get it done.

I'm looking forward to finishing the Gee Bee Z also.

CB

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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #123 on: March 02, 2020, 04:22:28 PM »
I put the CG at 25% of the average wing chord. My Spitfire does not like fast throttle up on takeoff. I generally hold full up elevator when starting the take off run (tail draggers) and then go to neutral once the model has sufficient airspeed. The model is released with the engine at idle and then throttle up slowly.

The Nats this year will have a zero entry fee for first time pilots coming to the Nats. Consider coming to the Nats this year with the Gee Bee!

If you in the St Louis area on June 27-28 come and fly at Buder Park at our CL Fun Fly!

Fred
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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #124 on: March 02, 2020, 05:04:56 PM »
Here is one of my electric videos, I have others on my youtube channel

Fred



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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #125 on: April 02, 2020, 10:02:47 AM »
Received an email this morning from a fellow modeler asking if I was going to continue working on the Gee Bee Z? That doesn't happen every day.  LL~

29K hits and change on this Build so I'm guessing there's interest.

The model is on hold. It will be converted to Electric.

I haven't learned enough about Electric set-ups to make a decision.

I'm still working on a set-up for the GBR-3, which is ready for flight. I just need a great
"overpowered" set-up.  ;D

CB
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Online Dan McEntee

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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #126 on: April 02, 2020, 03:37:22 PM »

I haven't learned enough about Electric set-ups to make a decision.

I'm still working on a set-up for the GBR-3, which is ready for flight. I just need a great
"overpowered" set-up.  ;D

CB


     Oh, Really?  Ready for flight? Sure doesn't look like it in the photo posted today??
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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #127 on: April 02, 2020, 05:20:42 PM »

     Oh, Really?  Ready for flight? Sure doesn't look like it in the photo posted today??
   Type at you later,
  Dan McEntee

"Never let your emotions get in the way of your vision."

 I was taught this in the mid 60's when I started training to become a pilot. I looked it up in my old log book, 11/11/66. My very first introductory flight in an all aluminum Luscombe 8E, N1885B. I've never forgotten this passage because it was my absolute very first flying lesson, and I was tested.

My instructor, Mary Lippitt and I were over trees, lots of them, and she pulled the throttle back. "OK," Mary said, "Now where are you going to go?"

We did an hour or so of introduction on the ground, stuff about the aircraft and emergency procedures while at altitude and dead stick landings. Mary spent some time on this. I was wondering if we were going to actually fly? My first hour, I wasn't sure.

We did fly!

As I said, we were over trees when Mary surprised me and pulled the throttle back.
"Now where are you going to go?"

I'll never forget what I said because she kept reminding me from time to time,

"Looks like I have no choice, I'll have to find some friendly trees."

The test was to see if I could keep it together mentally. "Fly the plane and don't bring emotions into the cockpit," Mary would always say.

Well I received a 3+ for that day and 1.45 hr. of instruction time. I could photograph the page if you like? Prove it happened.  LL~ LL~

That Post? I said the Gee Bee Z is on hold and will be converted to Electric. That model has a long way to go.

The GBR-3 is ready for flight. I just need a set-up for it.

The photo I Posted was of the Gee Bee Z because this is the Gee Bee Z thread. The models do look alike.

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Online Dan McEntee

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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #128 on: April 02, 2020, 11:12:39 PM »
  Oh no, you must have forgotten the photo you posted in your playpen of the "GBR-3" with the nose still basically cut off. it says it was posted today. With all the photos you have posted today, why not post a photo of it all assembled, and ready to fly, paint or no paint?  You always have some excuse for not flying a model. Ready for flight means "READY FOR FLIGHT." That means put fuel in it, (or battery) hook up the lines and FLY IT. Getting a "set up" whatever that is, should not be an issue, plenty of stuff out there, or maybe you have figured out that you can't fit what you need in the fuselage, and that you maybe should not have cut the nose off? Come on, get it really ready to fly and let's see it fly!! Why get this close to the finish line and then park the car?

   As to the story, that is a lot to cover on an introductory flight. They usually spent an hour on the basic stuff like "These are the wings, that is the nose and that is the tail." type stuff. You know "That is the ground, and that is the sky. All aviation operations will take place within those boundaries."  When Mary pulled the throttle back, she was probably just seeing if you would pee in your pants. What you should have done was put the power back up and said "I'm going back to the airport to get me another instructor." If she was really going to test you, she would have cut the switches. Again, an awful lot of advanced stuff for the first lesson, when you should be learning to trim the airplane, proper operating parameters for the engine, proper air speeds, coordinated turns, top rudder and bottom rudder control, just making the airplane go where you wanted it to go, especially in a Luscombe. And then there is the really important thing you need to learn first, and that is how to land and get your wallet out to pay for the lesson as fast as you can.  That is where you can quote Bob Hoover and say "Any landing you can walk away from is a good landing. Any landing where you can use the airplane again is a great landing!" After that you get into stall initiation and recovery, and spin recovery. Things that you need to know in an emergency. Then you can quote Bob Hoover again and tell her "Always fly the airplane as far into the crash as you can." Again, this is especially true in a Luscombe.

     The only thing that the GeeBee-Z has in common with the GBR-3 is that they are both airplanes with wings and propellers. The resemblance stops there. The Granville brothers designed the GeeBee-Z. They designed better than you just using just chalk on a concrete floor. I don't know who claims responsibility for the other. Don't really care either.
 
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Offline Fred Cronenwett

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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #129 on: April 12, 2020, 09:40:02 AM »
The taller the prop is off the ground will create a larger pitch moment if you throttle up too quickly, the hard surfaces is better, the rough surfaces where it can catch the wheels is a big problem. fly from a fully paved circle for the test flight!

This is how I do test / maiden flights

1) reduce the engine to full idle, throttle up slowly and do a taxi lap. You are looking to see if the nose has a tendency to turn inwards or not. Adjust the tailwheel as required

2) throttle up until you have enough airspeed for the tail to become effective, if everything is good, throttle up some more to hop the model off the ground but not too far. The point is to see if the CG is not too far aft before you get too high.

3) If step #2 feels good throttle up some more and climb out, the only goal is to see if the handle is set right and the CG is in the right spot. Come in for a landing and see how that works.

I saw a friend years ago launch a model, throttled up too quickly, the model got airborne, stalled and crashed 1/2 lap later. The bigger and heavier the model the longer the takeoff run. that model came in at 11 or lbs and it needed more airspeed before climbing out.

I test flew a brodak bearcat one time, the CG was back too far so on step #2 when I was about 4 feet off the ground I knew I was in trouble, so I locked my hand and throttled back to land. There was only minimal damage to the landing gear doors. We were able to add nose weight and get a good first flight in. Had I gone to full power on the first run I probably would have crashed the model due to the CG location.

Fred
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Re: Gee Bee Z, "R/C to CL" conversion.
« Reply #130 on: April 12, 2020, 10:53:18 AM »
Fred,

Thanks for that.  H^^

I'm working with two different models.

GBR-3

Gee Bee Z

Both close to getting in the air.

The GBR-3, I was considering Electrical equipment strictly for stunt. I do expect the model to stunt. I'm considering Rogerio's stuff with a Plettenberg 25-16. No R/C TX.

The Gee Bee Z. I believe I'll follow in your footsteps for this full scale model. It is IC right now but the conversion will be simple seeing the model is only framed and covered.

I was going to send you the specs, weight of the model actually, to see what you would recommend for a great, "over powered," electrical set-up. Short nose moment so it'll need a bit of weight. R/C TX on the hip like you do.

https://hobbyking.com/en_us/turnigy-9x-9ch-transmitter-w-module-ia8-receiver-mode-2-afdhs-2a-system.html?countrycode=US&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIveb8lavj6AIVUfDACh0H7gIHEAQYAiABEgJKYfD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

I'm just about ready to purchase this stuff now, for both models.

Did you see the progress I'm making on the TEXACO 13? This will be another Electric model.

We could go to emails.

Fred, thank you for your interest and help, it's appreciated.

Charles

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