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Author Topic: Engine Size  (Read 888 times)

Offline Bryan Higgins

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Engine Size
« on: October 06, 2009, 09:03:38 PM »
Hello Pilots

I am going to build my first scale model this winter and i need some help
with engine size.

I have ordered Fokker D7 plans from Clevelandairline in 1/6 scale.  This
gives me a 56"Wingspan and about 8-9 lb. in weight.  This is for CL Scale
at an event in my area next year.

I want to use a four stroke Saito and i figured that a .62 would handle
this small plane with medium detail work.  Or will it?  Is the .62 to much?
Please help as i am ordering the engine from Horizon soon.  Thanks Bryan
Bryan R higgins Jr.
Arvada,Colorado
AMA#885188

Offline Bryan Higgins

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Re: Engine Size
« Reply #1 on: October 06, 2009, 10:40:50 PM »
I have been looking at plans from Nexus and cleveland through kit cutters
and there is not much info on engine size.  Most plans are RC.  So i have
to convert eveything over.  I will basicly redraw my own CL version plans
then build.

But i need to know what would be the perfect 4stroke for this scale plane.

Thank You  Bryan
Bryan R higgins Jr.
Arvada,Colorado
AMA#885188

Offline Bryan Higgins

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Re: Engine Size
« Reply #2 on: October 06, 2009, 10:59:23 PM »
This engine was almost used by are last champion i think.  Hope he dont mind i
used his picture for reference.  I will mount the saito as far down on the engine
barers as i can and make the fuselage sides higher to a degree to hide the top of
the engine.  Because it has to be mounted upright.  The Fokker Prop shaft is low.
Bryan R higgins Jr.
Arvada,Colorado
AMA#885188

Offline Bryan Higgins

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Re: Engine Size
« Reply #3 on: October 06, 2009, 11:07:24 PM »
Here is a closer picture of the engine detail.  This picture is from arizona models
great site.  Of course everything is designed for RC.  Im sure there plans can be
converted to control line use.
Bryan R higgins Jr.
Arvada,Colorado
AMA#885188

Offline chuck snyder

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Re: Engine Size
« Reply #4 on: October 07, 2009, 06:04:59 AM »
Bryan, I would suggest a .91 4 stroke would be a better choice for your model. When comparing to R/C models remember that the C/L engine has to overcome all of the drag from the flying lines. On my conversions of R/C to C/L I have used the largest engine that was recommended for the R/C application, and this has worked well for me. I also like to use large diameter, low pitch props. The D-7 will have plenty of drag from the model too. For reference here are my model weights, power, and prop combinations. Profile deHavilland Hornet, 7.5#, two .30 2 cycle, 10-5 props. Sport D3A1 Val, 7.5#, .61 2 cycle, 13-5, Sport Hawker Typhoon, 15#, 1.20 4 cycle, 16-6. FAI Henschel 129, 15#, two .46 2 cycle, 12-5. Your D-7 will have more drag than any of my monoplanes. Also try a search on RCUniverse in the controlline forum for Steve Couch's SE5A and see what size engine he used (I can't remember) His model may be just a little smaller than yours.
Chuck

Offline Bryan Higgins

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Re: Engine Size
« Reply #5 on: October 07, 2009, 11:47:27 AM »
Chuck

Thank You for the reply.  I knew i needed help with the engine size.
I been taking notes and studying Scale but have no idea what to do
for engine sizes.  Now i have a place to start.

I decided to build the Fokker D7 for my first scale model because of
it's clean lines and simple structure.  It's not overpowering with
detail so it should build lighter for me. 

Thanks again     Bryan
Bryan R higgins Jr.
Arvada,Colorado
AMA#885188

Offline John Rist

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Re: Engine Size
« Reply #6 on: October 07, 2009, 03:38:33 PM »
Scale models tend to be tail heavy, especially WW I models.  The original engines were heavy for there HP and therefore most WW I birds have short noses and long tails.  Also U-control models need the CG forward of the RC location. If you are going to use a throttle you can always cut back on power.  The scale I am flying now is converted RC.  I have a ST 90 in a 60 size ship, (GP EXTRA 300S kit).  I have gobs of power but the throttle works well.  I fly wide open only when running the smoke generator.  The point I was leading up to is that even with the oversized engine I still had to add weight to the nose to get the CG far enough forward to get her to grove.  My approach is that it is hard to get too much power and under powered leads to crashes. And if you have to add lead why not add HP instead.

PS looks like a fun project. Good Luck   #^
John Rist
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Offline Allen Goff

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Re: Engine Size
« Reply #7 on: October 07, 2009, 04:04:31 PM »
Bryan, I agree with Chuck. If there was one thing I picked up on with scale, they are all heavy, and under powered. (speaking from a stunt flyer's point of view) I have been flying C/L scale for about six years now and have noticed that the four strokes idle so much better that the two stroke. And I think more power is much better than not enough. I have been flying a 9+lb Waco Classic with a Saito .91, and there has been times when I have needed all that power, but for the most part I use maybe 50% to 75% power. I have looped this aircraft at the Nationals in 10 mph plus winds and to my surprise it handled it very well. I'm sure some of the "seasoned scale vets" have great advise as well. Hope to see ya in the scale circle some where next year. Good luck with the new ship.

Blessings
Allen

Offline Bryan Higgins

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Re: Engine Size
« Reply #8 on: October 07, 2009, 06:55:29 PM »
Thank You everyone i have an idea where to start now.  All of you sure have great talent.
I have seen some of your models in magazines and in internet articles maybe one day i
can fly at your guy's level or atleast be in the same event.   Bryan
Bryan R higgins Jr.
Arvada,Colorado
AMA#885188

Offline Bryan Higgins

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Re: Engine Size
« Reply #9 on: October 07, 2009, 07:18:39 PM »
I have made my decision,  Im going to order the Saito .91 special AAC 4 stroke.
Allen i sure like your Waco, i remember seeing it in the FAI Scale Championships
along with Chucks Hs 129 in Model Aviation last year.  That article really got me
enterested in CL Scale.

Allen was your Waco painted with Brodak Paint.  Did you use any toners?

Bryan
Bryan R higgins Jr.
Arvada,Colorado
AMA#885188

Offline Allen Goff

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Re: Engine Size
« Reply #10 on: October 08, 2009, 05:24:24 AM »
Bryan, I did use Brodak paint, no toners, with a two part auto clear, (no buffing needed) I believe the name was Pro Finish Clear. One other thing, the guys and gals in C/L scale are quick to help, don't be shy about seeking help.

Blessings
Allen

Offline Bryan Higgins

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Re: Engine Size
« Reply #11 on: October 08, 2009, 01:44:21 PM »
Allen

What a great dope paint job.  Thanks for the help i will  be starting the Fokker D7
soon.  I will post some pictures through the build and im sure I'll have questons
I'll need to ask.    Thanks to everyone   Bryan H. H^^
Bryan R higgins Jr.
Arvada,Colorado
AMA#885188


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