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Speed,Combat,Scale,Racing => Rat Racing and Team Racing => Topic started by: BillLee on July 05, 2016, 06:34:57 AM
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New Miss San Bernadino Sport GY/AMA GY combination. Plane built primarily for SGY but by changing the engine/tank/mounting plate, it will fly in AMA GY as well.
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Thanks Bill, I need to finish the one I have on the hook waiting to be finished. Lazy in my old age. D>K
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Don't ask me how long it took to build this one! :-[ :-[
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Hi Bill, sharp looking ship. Forgive the ignorance, but what does SGY stand for? H^^
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I'm going to be the nasty one. Read the title. Sport Goodyear/Class II Goodyear. If you seen his published article on the Margaret June scale racer you will know more. People have a hard time getting the old Fox .15 Schnurle to run fast and restart hot and Sport Goodyear now allows an alternate power source. VD~
Actually any AMA Class Goodyear can be made for Sport Goodyear. H^^
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The title only mentions "Sport", not GY. So making the leap to Good Year wasn't there for me. I have never flown or competed in any speed contests, nor do I get to read many magazines. Sorry again, sorry for my ignorance. So why do they call it "Good Year"?
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Post WWII, an air racing class was created for the "every man". It used small home-built aircraft with 85-90 HP, 4 cylinder engines. For several years, the Goodyear Company sponsored this midget racer class, so it got the nickname "Goodyear racing". When the model event was created in the 60's, it took the same name.
The formal name of the full size racing event is now International Formula One, or IF1 for short. These planes can now average over 250 mph around the pylons.
AMA Goodyear racing has no engine restrictions other than a max displacement of .15 cu. in. Planes can go 110-120 mph on 60 ft lines. Sportsman Goodyear has some engine restrictions designed to "level the playing field". They go 80-85 mph on 52 ft lines. With the introduction of some new engines into the event, it has gained popularity in the last couple of years. Novices have a chance; pros aren't guaranteed a win. It's about the doing, not the winning <=
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Stemming from the mid-1900's there existed a class of full-scale air racing called "Goodyear", evolving over the years and eventually being called called "Formula I".
In the 60's, a CL racing event was created and was called "Goodyear". That event still exists, now officially renamed as "Scale Racing" in the AMA rule book. Most still refer to it as "Goodyear", hence: "GY". The CL racing event requires a 1/8 scale profile of an actual Goodyear or Formula I airplane along with a number of other rules that define the event.
AMA GY (i.e., Scale Race) is not widely flown, for a number of reasons.
The "Sport GY" event, several similar versions around the country, is intended to simplify the event to attract the "casual" racers. The version we run in Texas can be found at http://www.dmaa-1902.org/Rules/Sportsman_Goodyear.pdf This event is proving to be popular, flown unofficially at the NATS (sponsored by the DMAA or others). Performance is reasonable as is cost (no high $/high performance engines are allowed).
My model was built primarily for Sportsman Goodyear but also easily converted into an AMA Scale Racer for the one contest a year where the event is flown (the NATs). As a consequence, several concessions were made in the construction that would not have been made with a full-blown AMA GY.
Bill Bischoff had a great construction article (Margaret June aircraft) published in Model Aviation a year or so ago that further describes what we're doing.
(Bill and I were obviously typing at the same time! ;D )
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Where do you get the engines, and which are popular? Everything I see is out of stock...
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Cal Smith published the first 1/8 scale model Goodyear racers in the July 1961 American Modeler. Paul Plecan published some more in a follow-on article in the January/February 1963 AM. These plans and a number of other designs are available from AMA Plans Service. In addition, Goodyear racers published in M.A.N. are available from Air Age Stores plan service.
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Thanks for the great info Bill#1 and Bill#2 (I'll let you decide who's who!LOL). That sounds like a lot of fun. Is that the racing where you have a pit man, or is it just round and round as fast as you can go? Love the look of you plane, very nice. H^^
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Where do you get the engines, and which are popular? Everything I see is out of stock...
The Magnum XLS 15A is in stock at hobbypeople.net for $69.99 with free shipping. I can provide needle valves and venturis for $10 each plus $3 postage.
Bill Bischoff
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Is that the racing where you have a pit man, or is it just round and round as fast as you can go?
Glenn, and anyone else who may be wondering...
RACING is flown with multiple pilots simultaneously. Races are often 10 miles, which would be 140 laps on 60' lines. During the race, the planes make pitstops where the model is refuelled and the engine is restarted.The fastest time wins.
SPEED is flown one at a time, usually for a distance of 1/2 mile, which is 7 laps on 60' lines. No pitstops, single fastest time wins. Speed flying is usually done with a center pylon, that post that sticks out of the ground that the pilot puts his hand in and runs around like crazy!
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ok, thanks for the description Bill. I have seen video's of both types of racing and speed events and now I know the difference! LOL I sure wished I was able to participate in the speed and or racing event. It looks so exciting....oh well, maybe next life! %^@ H^^
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Glen you can be a pit man in racing, in fact in speed some one else can fly your entry.
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Hi Glenn
If you're interested, and are able to make it to the ACFC "Prairie Fire" Stunt contest, I can bring along a couple of Scale Racers, (ie. "Goodyears") for you you to look at, and explain some of the details of the racing format.
My landing gears are all set up for pavement flying, but If I can figure out how to get a big enough set of wheels onto one of my Sport Goodyear models , can probably do a flight or two...
Les
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Heres a few of the plans from the Mags shown above . Theyre downloadable from the RC Groups - Control Line - Racing Plans . Flogged here froma ebay THING .
(http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTI1MFgxNjAw/z/RaAAAOSwBahVT8AY/$_1.JPG)
(http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTI0OVgxNjAw/z/3aoAAOSwEeFVT8AQ/$_1.JPG)
(http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTI1MlgxNjAw/z/QIsAAOSwPgxVT8AG/$_1.JPG)
presumably youd just use them as a basis , unless you wanted to build a historic authentic ' period piece ' genuine brand new 50 year old Good Year .
Nice Plane , Mr Lee . :)
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There Seems TO BE something vaugly familiar , about the Plane , on Page NINE , HERE . http://www.modelaircraft.org/files/072116_Outdoor.pdf ;)
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There Seems TO BE something vaugly familiar , about the Plane , on Page NINE , HERE . http://www.modelaircraft.org/files/072116_Outdoor.pdf ;)
Initial outing was a mixed bag!
Tried it as a AMA Scale Racer but had a split solder joint in the tank. Ended up taking off theNelson and reinstalling the Sport GY engine (ASP) and tank and then flying on the 60' lines for AMA GY. Obviously not competitive although it did finish the race.
Sport GY on the other hand was a screaming success! With BillB flying, we turned an 8:27 for its first SGY competitive race, a time that is among the top 2-3 we've ever done. The model is fast and apparently flys and lands well.
Kudos, though, have to be given to Bill Bischoff who flew in EVERY race of the NATs. Many for me, all for himself, many for Mike Greb, and then whoever else needed it done!
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How many races total? I can still remember one year in which John Ballard was in every race except one. That was when we would have as many as 20+ entries in AMA Goodyear. I think he also did it in AMA Rat Race that year. Bill B. must be an iron man to do this.
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It was about 3800 laps for the week, not counting test flying.
BB
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...The model is fast and apparently flys and lands well. ...
Will have to leave the "take" on that to BillB since I don't fly the thing! Sure looked good from my perspective though! ;D
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To be pitting and have the approaching plane landing smoothly, on the line, just the right speed....that's the perspective Bill Lee was seeing Bill Bischoff provide.
Now, you take team Phil/Dale, poor Phil rarely got such a good perspective, but, we did pretty well there for a few good years...hence the name "Good Years". That's my perspective.
dg
Huge thanks to Phil Dunlap!
Apologies for torpedoing another's thread.....
dg
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The Magnum XLS 15A is in stock at hobbypeople.net for $69.99 with free shipping. I can provide needle valves and venturis for $10 each plus $3 postage.
Bill Bischoff
As of February 2017, what is the current status?
What engines are currently allowed?
Can they be obtained anywhere other than old engine sales?
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MBSModelSupply.com is stocking the ASP.
The current rules are available on the DMAA website: DMAA-1902.org
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Matt:
Where did you find those plans on RC Groups? I've looked all over and can't find them, so I must be doing something wrong in my search...
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I was reading those rules, apparently you're allowed to run a modified Fox 15 on pressure with no venturi restrictions?
Yes, and they are competitive.
But nobody is building those, and they are simply grandfathered in to allow them to compete. (Read that: there MAY come the day when the old rules will no longer be included.)
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Although, the engine didn't come with a pressure fitting, so wouldn't installing one be adding material to the engine? S?P