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Author Topic: Custom Decals  (Read 1779 times)

Online Tim Wescott

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Custom Decals
« on: December 23, 2010, 02:02:13 PM »
The Waiex proceeds, slowly since it's flyable.

I need decals*.  See the picture.  Preferably I need a decal that's compatible with the Rustoleum finish I've put on the plane, and is, when all is said and done, fuel proof.  So I either need a decal that'll go on and stick, or I need one that can be covered with some clear that'll go over Rustoleum and under fuel.  Also preferably, the decal will be white where the gif file says white, and transparent (or not there) where the gif file says transparent.

Any suggestions?  Is this something that can be done with vinyl?  Some other stuff?  I'd consider home-made waterslide, but I can't find white ink for my printer.  I'm toying with the notion of finding a clear that's compatible with Rustoleum and doing decalage with the logo on printer paper, but that's a bit too hacked even for me.  What sort of clear coat can I put over the Rustoleum if the decal I get can't hack fuel?

* I also need my AMA number on the upper** right wing!  I don't know if the folks at Salem didn't notice its lack, didn't care, or gave it a pass 'cause I'm a beginner (I would have borrowed a Sharpie if anyone had said anything).  But just in case I come in 3rd at some contest with four entrants, I don't want to be DQ'd on a technicality.

** And don't start that argument in my thread!!
AMA 64232

The problem with electric is that once you get the smoke generator and sound system installed, the plane is too heavy.

Offline Bob Reeves

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Re: Custom Decals
« Reply #1 on: December 23, 2010, 03:49:07 PM »
Cheapest would be to buy the decal kit from Micro-Mark and make your own. You can either have clear or white but not both on the same decal. Not sure what a print shop would charge for stickers, ones I have seen done by local print shops were low quality and not fuel proof.

Only thing you can put over rustoleum is polyurethane and I haven't found one that was fuel proof that didn't turn yellow over white.

I would mask it and paint it on.

Edit: Might check with a local sign shop, they can usually cut you paint masks that would be much better than decals.

Online Tim Wescott

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Re: Custom Decals
« Reply #2 on: December 23, 2010, 03:57:30 PM »
...
ones I have seen done by local print shops were low quality and not fuel proof.
...
I would mask it and paint it on.
The yellow in the sun needs to be lighter than the yellow on the plane -- which is Rustoleum yellow.  So I'd have to spray it out, hand mix it with white, and brush it on.  Ditto the slate blue -- I'd have to mix blue and black to get that color.  Considering how (un)steady my hand is, it would be tedious and wouldn't look nearly as good as something printed.

How low quality were the decals from your local print shop, and how not fuel proof?  These are going toward the back of the plane -- if it was a matter of not lasting for a Really Long Time, then I may go ahead and do it any way.  Particularly if the decals could be removed cleanly and replaced, it may be better for this particular plane to just get 'er done than to agonize over the last shred of quality.

I'm actually hoping that there's someone out there that knows just what to ask for (or who prints these things) that can tell me who to talk to and what to ask for.
AMA 64232

The problem with electric is that once you get the smoke generator and sound system installed, the plane is too heavy.

Offline Bill Little

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Re: Custom Decals
« Reply #3 on: December 25, 2010, 08:27:49 PM »
Hi Tim,

See if you can find an ALPS 5000. They are discontinued, so ebay is about the only source.   Microscale sells the decal paper to use in it, and it is "laser paper".  Then make sure you have all the color cartridges you need for at least the decal you are going to print first.  The 5000 carries 7 cartridges at a time (one slot has to be open so the printer can "exchange" carts. while it's printing.  You will need to have some fairly recent coreldraw program (and learn how to use it if you don't already) to make your artwork.  Make your color "layers", and use the "single ink" function to underlay all the decal with white as the first layer.  All the images on that layer (1st one) will need t be any color that the printer can "see'.  It cannot "see" white.  Then print each layer. As you hit "print", go to the settings and use "overlay" under the the selections.  Other wise, the printer will spit the paper out when it prints and you can never get it to register correctly again.  There is a "project manager" feature which will automatically go from layer to layer, but i have never used it.  The ALPS 5000 is the "sharpest" printer you can get.  It prints at 2400dpi dots per inch).   Also, use "cardboard" (not "laser paper") for the setting when you go to print.  Otherwise you will burn up the anti curl motor.  Done correctly, you can print an object that is totally clear that you will need an optivisor to read any lettering.  Oh, yeah, you will need to use a Windows 98 or older system.  There are no drivers available for newer operating systems.  But then there is no other printer under a couple thousand dollars that will actually print "WHITE".  The are very fragile printers, but I have taken care of mine, been very cautious and it is getting pretty old.  The printer alone usually goes for around $300 last time I checked, as long as it's a working one.  No service available in North America anymore.
Big Bear <><

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Online wwwarbird

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Re: Custom Decals
« Reply #4 on: December 26, 2010, 12:22:39 AM »
 Jim and Emily at Control Line Central can make pretty much any decal you would want. y1
Narrowly averting disaster since 1964! 

Wayne Willey
Albert Lea, MN U.S.A. IC C/L Aircraft Modeler, Ex AMA member

Offline Balsa Butcher

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Re: Custom Decals
« Reply #5 on: December 26, 2010, 06:32:22 PM »
What Wayne said...highly recommended.  8)
Pete Cunha
Sacramento CA.
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Offline Bill Little

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Re: Custom Decals
« Reply #6 on: December 29, 2010, 01:27:19 AM »
Jim and Emily at Control Line Central can make pretty much any decal you would want. y1

Hi Wayne,

I've got to contact Jim about making a decal for the "Little Chief".  I can even do the artwork in coreldraw if necessary.  Some intell before I contact them:  Do they do waterslides, or just vinyl and masks?  That decal is a cowl insignia.

Thanks!
Big Bear
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Offline RogerGreene

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Re: Custom Decals
« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2011, 01:49:35 PM »
You can make your own decals by going to www.testors.com then search decal paper. They have decal paper that is 5.5"x8.5" for your inkjet printer and follow their instructions.
Fly Stunt <><
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Offline Bill Little

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Re: Custom Decals
« Reply #8 on: January 02, 2011, 02:20:49 PM »
You can make your own decals by going to www.testors.com then search decal paper. They have decal paper that is 5.5"x8.5" for your inkjet printer and follow their instructions.

hi Roger,

You are right!  For a design as simple as Tim's that would be the way to go if he just wants a waterslide decal.  For a decal to be used on a scale entry for the World's, where a high degree of detail would be needed, a "vector" art program would be needed to insure crisp lines and readable text down to the "optivisor level".  "Raster" programs, which many art programs are, will pixelate, or become fuzzy, when the size is altered, way to easily.  Vector is a math based program, whereas raster is more of a "copy" program.  The dpi capability of the printer is also a limiting factor.  I'm involved in another hobby where this is highly noticeable. ;D

Big Bear
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Online Tim Wescott

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Re: Custom Decals
« Reply #9 on: January 02, 2011, 02:31:49 PM »
You are right!  For a design as simple as Tim's that would be the way to go if he just wants a waterslide decal.  For a decal to be used on a scale entry for the World's, where a high degree of detail would be needed, a "vector" art program would be needed to insure crisp lines and readable text down to the "optivisor level".  "Raster" programs, which many art programs are, will pixelate, or become fuzzy, when the size is altered, way to easily.  Vector is a math based program, whereas raster is more of a "copy" program.  The dpi capability of the printer is also a limiting factor.  I'm involved in another hobby where this is highly noticeable. ;D

The main thing holding me back from looking into the water slide decals is not knowing what I can use over them that will protect them from exhaust, but will not eat Rustoleum.

Do you know what I should be looking at?
AMA 64232

The problem with electric is that once you get the smoke generator and sound system installed, the plane is too heavy.

Offline Bill Little

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Re: Custom Decals
« Reply #10 on: January 02, 2011, 03:54:52 PM »
The main thing holding me back from looking into the water slide decals is not knowing what I can use over them that will protect them from exhaust, but will not eat Rustoleum.

Do you know what I should be looking at?

Hi Tim,

I have never used the ink jet printer/paper, personally.  I have used decals done this way though!

As with any decal, you can always TEST.  I have sprayed Duplicolor clear over all types of decals.  The Dulpi clear is not impervious to RAW fuel.  Duplicolor does make a Clear Wheel Coating that is.  You need to paint a scrap with the Rustoleum , apply a small decal, and spry the different clears over them  I would start with the Duplicolor Clear wheel coating.  Auto Zone carries it. 

I have never tried clear dope, sprayed, over Rustoleum.  But, from past experiences, I would want to think it would not be compatible!  Dope tend to eat up enamel.  But, a test would confirm.

Quickest way out to get something for immediate (or as soon as possible) would be to have a vinyl decal made.  The ones in kits that I have seen used are often not covered with any coating after application, and seem to hold up well.  I use Major Decals for my WWII models sometimes.  They are "pressure sensitive vinyl".  Never have coated over those, unless it would be for a NATS plane and then I probably wouldn't use decals! LL~

If it isn't a rush job, then get some ink jet decal paper and go for it.  It isn't hard at all to do. And you can run test panels cheaply.

Big Bear
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Offline RogerGreene

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Re: Custom Decals
« Reply #11 on: January 02, 2011, 06:02:29 PM »
I use a CAD program to design my planes, so the decal I make will be made on CAD. Thanks for the tip about the raster programs. I didn't think about the pixelating, thanks.
Fly Stunt <><
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Online wwwarbird

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Re: Custom Decals
« Reply #12 on: January 02, 2011, 06:38:17 PM »
Hi Wayne,

I've got to contact Jim about making a decal for the "Little Chief".  I can even do the artwork in coreldraw if necessary.  Some intell before I contact them:  Do they do waterslides, or just vinyl and masks?  That decal is a cowl insignia.

Thanks!
Big Bear

 Sorry I missed getting back to you here Bill. I guess I don't know for sure, but I think they only do vinyl work.

 I suppose I should be talking "stickers", which would mean vinyl, and "decals", which would mean waterslide. I know Jim and Emily can do most stickers.
Narrowly averting disaster since 1964! 

Wayne Willey
Albert Lea, MN U.S.A. IC C/L Aircraft Modeler, Ex AMA member

Offline Bill Little

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Re: Custom Decals
« Reply #13 on: January 03, 2011, 06:43:51 PM »
Sorry I missed getting back to you here Bill. I guess I don't know for sure, but I think they only do vinyl work.

 I suppose I should be talking "stickers", which would mean vinyl, and "decals", which would mean waterslide. I know Jim and Emily can do most stickers.

Thanks, Wayne.  The project is a ways off, and I might just pop for some cartridges for the APLS and do the artwork.  It is very complicated and the local sign shop can't do anything with it.  Too many small (tiny for them! LOL!!) details for their cutter to make.  It is the profile view of an Indian Chief's head in full war bonnet.  I have a 1/72 scale decal to trace over.

Bill
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Offline Avaiojet

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Re: Custom Decals
« Reply #14 on: October 16, 2011, 01:39:32 AM »
Well Tim,

I know it's been some time, but I just came on board. I actually have this graphic. I don't even remember why.

I can make it in vinyl only or mask.

Charles
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Online Tim Wescott

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Re: Custom Decals
« Reply #15 on: October 16, 2011, 09:48:12 AM »
I know it's been some time, but I just came on board. I actually have this graphic. I don't even remember why.

I can make it in vinyl only or mask.
I had sent you the file, but you never sent me a quote.  I think you must have gotten busy.

I didn't push things for one because various things happened, not least of which was my entire customer base dried up for several months, which meant that I was spending no money on non-essential stuff.  That, and enough crashes to bring the appearance down from "reasonably well executed profile" to "scruffy profile" meant that just printing the logo out on printer paper, cutting it out and taping it on with shipping tape, worked pretty well.  It gave me an idea of how the thing would look if it had a "real" decal on it, it looked just fine from ten feet away, and I didn't have to spend a dime.

Since business picked up again I've bought some of the water slide decal paper and I've been experimenting with that -- I think it'll be great for small, intricate stuff, but I'll be keeping vinyl in mind for big, simple things.
AMA 64232

The problem with electric is that once you get the smoke generator and sound system installed, the plane is too heavy.

Offline Avaiojet

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Re: Custom Decals
« Reply #16 on: October 16, 2011, 10:21:03 AM »
I'm kinda remembering, Did I mention the yellow should be outlined? The whole thing should be outlined.

What size did you want them?

CB
Trump Derangement Syndrome. TDS. 
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Amazing how ignorance can get in the way of the learning process.
If you're Trolled, you know you're doing something right.  Alpha Mike Foxtrot. "No one has ever made a difference by being like everyone else."  Marcus Cordeiro, The "Mark of Excellence," you will not be forgotten. "No amount of evidence will ever persuade an idiot."- Mark Twain. I look at the Forum as a place to contribute and make friends, some view it as a Realm where they could be King.   Proverb 11.9  "With his mouth the Godless destroys his neighbor..."  "Perhaps the greatest challenge in modeling is to build a competitive control line stunter that looks like a real airplane." David McCellan, 1980.

Online Tim Wescott

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Re: Custom Decals
« Reply #17 on: October 16, 2011, 11:11:26 AM »
I'm kinda remembering, Did I mention the yellow should be outlined? The whole thing should be outlined.

What size did you want them?
I don't need them, now -- the plane has met its end, and I haven't decided yet whether to build another one or build something else.  It was a great beginner's plane, because it's aerodynamic shortcomings were masked by my flying problems.  But I'm a better flyer now, and need a plane that I can grow into instead of out of.  I'd have to modify the plane even more from the scale prototype to make it more like the typical stunter.

I'll let you know if the project comes live again, though.
AMA 64232

The problem with electric is that once you get the smoke generator and sound system installed, the plane is too heavy.

Online Howard Rush

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Re: Custom Decals
« Reply #18 on: October 16, 2011, 04:42:48 PM »
If it isn't a rush job, ...

No, it sounds like it's just a little job.
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