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Author Topic: Drying Time  (Read 3758 times)

Offline Motorman

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Drying Time
« on: September 28, 2015, 03:05:42 PM »
Trying to get this Ringmaster fuselage/tail painted before Sunday. It's got 3 coats of thinned nitrate on it right now.  My plan is to put on 1-2 coats of polycrylic then 2-3 coats of K&B Superpoxy.

How long does the nitrate have to dry before I paint with polycrylic and how long should the polycrylic dry before the superpoxy and how long should the superpoxy cure before coating with hot castor oil. I've got 5 days.


MM

Offline Tim Wescott

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Re: Drying Time
« Reply #1 on: September 28, 2015, 04:04:32 PM »
I would not put Polycrylic over dope -- I don't think you'll have any appreciable adhesion at all.  If you have buterate dope I'd switch to that, since you're over wood you can probably stick to nitrate.  In either case I'd just finish it out with dope and put Superpoxy on top of that.  If you're looking for sanding sealer and you don't have any, mix baby powder with clear dope -- it works great.

Of course, a really ratty finish on a Ringmaster is probably more period-correct than a pristine one, so maybe you should stay on course.
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Offline Motorman

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Re: Drying Time
« Reply #2 on: September 28, 2015, 04:21:10 PM »
Polycrylic works fine over or under most anything but you need a couple coats of nitrate so the water base doesn't swell the wood. I'm just worried about how long to let the nitrate dry before I put it on. Was thinking 24 hrs.

MM

Offline Tim Wescott

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Re: Drying Time
« Reply #3 on: September 28, 2015, 06:01:22 PM »
I've done five models that were finished with polycrylic direct onto wood.  With the exception of the center sheeting on one model getting warped, I haven't seen any problems -- and that center sheeting was slightly oversized and jammed down to fit, instead of giving it a few more strokes with the sanding block so that it eased itself into place.

I do brush the first couple of coats on very dry before I really go to town.

Ideally you probably want to give it a week to really gas off, but I think you'll be OK with 24 hours.  At least you'll know...
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Offline Motorman

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Re: Drying Time
« Reply #4 on: September 29, 2015, 09:38:22 PM »
thought this thread would get more traction.


MM

Offline Dan McEntee

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Re: Drying Time
« Reply #5 on: September 29, 2015, 09:52:07 PM »
  Like Tim mentioned, if you are going to top coat with epoxy, why even bother with the polycrylic stuff? It has been preached and mentioned more times than I can remember in Stunthanger's existence that it is best to stick with one finishing method though out the finishing process to avoid compatibility issues, and the difficulties in making patches and repairs later on. It avoids questions like the one you are asking. A couple more coats of the nitrate (or buterate) with some sanding, then the epoxy, and you should be good to go .
  Good luck and have fun,
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Offline Larrys4227

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Re: Drying Time
« Reply #6 on: September 30, 2015, 05:25:06 AM »
It avoids questions like the one you are asking.

Several weeks ago, the owner of this site clearly stated that there is not a question that can't be asked.  Lets not start this again.

Offline Tim Wescott

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Re: Drying Time
« Reply #7 on: September 30, 2015, 05:15:56 PM »
thought this thread would get more traction.

Probably no one has tried that particular combination and thus doesn't know the answer.  You may be the word's foremost expert on Polycrylic over nitrate dope.
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Offline john e. holliday

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Re: Drying Time
« Reply #8 on: September 30, 2015, 05:19:11 PM »
I quit using Nitrate because it will not go over any thing with out problems.  If you do a search you will find all kinds of answers about finishing.
John E. "DOC" Holliday
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Offline Dan McEntee

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Re: Drying Time
« Reply #9 on: September 30, 2015, 08:10:56 PM »
Several weeks ago, the owner of this site clearly stated that there is not a question that can't be asked.  Lets not start this again.

  No one is "starting anything again." Don't take the statement out of the context of the post. If one wasn't trying to pile on so many different materials on top of a model you wouldn't have to worry about drying times and compatibility issues. It's that simple. I just don't see why guys are trying to find the magic "quick bullet proof finish" when it doesn't exist and complicate the matter by using multiple finishing materials .Stick with the nitrate all the way through, and you can be done with build up coats in a day or so. Let gas off a day or so. The finish with the epoxy which only needs a day or so for it to be ready if applied properly. Since all he is doing is the solid balsa parts, there is no reason he shouldn't be ready to fly by this weekend if he had started last weekend.
   Hey Doc! Nitrate is not intended to go over anything. It is supposed to be a primary coating, but if fuel proofing isn't an issue, such as in stick and tissue rubber models, or hand launched gliders, it can be used through to finish. Some think that it has the best adhesion for applying tissue paper. Lots of different things work for lots of different people but if you look into it, they did a lot of trial and error to come to the system they like best. Allen Brickhaus had his favorite finishing method that he described on this forum several times and published in construction articles several more times, that some people have problems with, but Allen used to quite good effect. I finished several airplanes the way he described with very satisfying results. You just have to find what works well for you in your situation and stick with it.
  Type at you later,
   Dan McEntee
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Offline john e. holliday

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Re: Drying Time
« Reply #10 on: September 30, 2015, 09:43:24 PM »
So true, that last statement. 
John E. "DOC" Holliday
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Online Howard Rush

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Re: Drying Time
« Reply #11 on: October 01, 2015, 01:30:29 AM »
So true, that last statement. 

That he'll type at us later?  I hope so.
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Offline Ken Burdick

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Re: Drying Time
« Reply #12 on: October 01, 2015, 09:32:27 AM »
I asked an very knowledge stunt flier what he thought of nitrate...he said
"Nitrate is for those free-flight sissies"
(he also flies ff)  LL~

Offline Motorman

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Re: Drying Time
« Reply #13 on: October 01, 2015, 11:13:33 AM »
I like this method because polycrylic doesn't smell and cleans up with water and you don't have to thin it. It's just so easy to use. Also, you can paint anything over it and you can get it at any hardware store. Love the polycrylic.

I use the nitrate for good adhesion and protection from any water base problems. Then you have to top coat it with something fuel proof and SuperPoxy cures fast and only takes enough coats to fill in the color in this case black so probably 2 coats. Done in one week with monokote wings.

MM

 

Offline Gerald Arana

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Re: Drying Time
« Reply #14 on: October 01, 2015, 04:24:17 PM »
I like this method because polycrylic doesn't smell and cleans up with water and you don't have to thin it. It's just so easy to use. Also, you can paint anything over it and you can get it at any hardware store. Love the polycrylic.

I use the nitrate for good adhesion and protection from any water base problems. Then you have to top coat it with something fuel proof and SuperPoxy cures fast and only takes enough coats to fill in the color in this case black so probably 2 coats. Done in one week with monokote wings.

MM

 


Got any pictures MM?

Jerry

Offline Dan McEntee

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Re: Drying Time
« Reply #15 on: October 03, 2015, 06:11:00 PM »
I like this method because polycrylic doesn't smell and cleans up with water and you don't have to thin it. It's just so easy to use. Also, you can paint anything over it and you can get it at any hardware store. Love the polycrylic.

I use the nitrate for good adhesion and protection from any water base problems. Then you have to top coat it with something fuel proof and SuperPoxy cures fast and only takes enough coats to fill in the color in this case black so probably 2 coats. Done in one week with monokote wings.

MM

 

     I think you can leave either the nitrate or the poly-stuff out and save a step and a bit of weight. Since you are finishing it off with epoxy, you could eliminate one or the other. I don't know what kind of "water base problems" you might be expecting, but if it's a material made to be applied to wood, I wouldn't think there would be anything tragic. With either you are going to have to use the sanding block to knock down raised up wood grain after the initial applications. I think it's just a redundant and unnecessary step and since it was untried, made for an needless worry about compatibility issues.
    Type at you later,
    Dan McEntee
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Offline Motorman

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Re: Drying Time
« Reply #16 on: November 01, 2015, 06:07:59 PM »
Sucess!

Offline Avaiojet

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Re: Drying Time
« Reply #17 on: November 04, 2015, 04:19:52 PM »
Motorman,

Just took a look at your model.

You did a nice job.  H^^

Charles
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