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Author Topic: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??  (Read 4132 times)

Offline IdRatherBeBuilding

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Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« on: February 16, 2019, 01:27:53 PM »
I'm planning to finish my Ringmaster Jr. It's covered with silk over the wings. I believe I used butyrate dope, but I very well may have used a water based poly. It was a while ago..
I'm about to spray some markings for a design and was looking for a good clear before I choose my paint. I'd like to go all rattle cans for convenience, but if I have to go with a gun thats fine too. I just don't want to hassle with the mixing and cleaning.


David
David Miller

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Online Dan McEntee

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Re: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« Reply #1 on: February 16, 2019, 02:02:58 PM »
   There is nothing really in a single component spray can. There is some stuff out that is ion a spray can, that you activate a catalyst in the can and you have a varying amount of short time shelf life before it all kicks off. If you have spray equipment, look into the Nason two part system that is what used to be DuPont. It comes in quarts, is thinned ready to shoot, just mix up what you need with catalyst. Do a search on the forums for it. We have several guys that are world class luthiers ( they make stringed instruments) and several of them use it. Only concern yourself with the nose and tank area and the leading edge of the wing near the fuselage. No need to do the whole airplane for fuel proofing. Make your trim paintings, then shoot clear dope. If all OK then do the nose and such with the Nason. If you ever have to do a repair on the wings and such, it will be lots easier just dealing with dope. It will also be a bit lighter as the dope will gas off, but I don't think the two parts stuff does.
   This is a subject that has been asked about almost as much as "How to  you set up a FP, LA. 40?"  There is lots of stuff from the hardware store that in opaque colors is fairly fuel resistant, not fuel proof, but there has been a world wide search for the magic bullet clear that is fuel proof, and I believe it doesn't exist in a single part spray can. Top Flite had their Luster-Kote paint out, and their clear wasn't too bad, but there were problems just spraying that stuff and with Great Plains going bankrupt, I think it was pulled from the market.
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   Dan McEntee
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Offline IdRatherBeBuilding

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Re: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« Reply #2 on: February 16, 2019, 03:18:47 PM »
awe.. So the magic potion still doesn't exist...  :-\

I love Nason. Good price and quite forgiving. I paint my cars just with it. So I'll dig around in the basement and try to find my guns.

Great Planes is gone??? What Next, Tower Hobbies? I've sooo out of the loop sitting under my rock all these years

David Miller
David Miller

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Online Dan McEntee

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Re: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« Reply #3 on: February 16, 2019, 06:34:01 PM »
   Tower Hobbies is still around, bought out of bankruptcy by Horizon Hobbies. The Great Planes product line was drastically cut back. This was within the last year, and at this point in time I'm not sure what all is available from Tower. I haven't been on their website in quite some time. For doing the little jobs, an air brush or a Harbor Freight gravity feed touch up gun should do the job.
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   Dan McEntee
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Offline IdRatherBeBuilding

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Re: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« Reply #4 on: February 17, 2019, 12:00:59 AM »
 ~^ So Tower was going to?
So Don Anderson is completely out of the game?
I have decent collection of the Great Plane kits from the 80s. I keep wanting to build them, they are one of the most enjoyable kits to build. I guess I should start on them sometime soon!

What about spraying Butyrate for clear? how is that? Does it Yellow in time? I remember there was a white back in the 80s that would look great. Then it get a little yellowish patina from the uv sunlight. I have no idea what make it was. My mind is going...

David Miller
David Miller

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Offline Jim Svitko

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Re: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« Reply #5 on: February 17, 2019, 07:49:34 AM »
Butyrate dope, clear or color, is not fuel proof.  Some formulations might be more resistant than others, but none are as fuel proof as the two-part products.

I have heard that the Sig Lite Coat clear dope is the most fuel resistant as far as clear goes.  I sprayed it on my last plane so we shall see.  Brodak Crystal Clear, from what my tests showed, has almost no fuel resistance.  It dulls even if fuel is wiped off almost immediately.  Randolph clear is about like the Sig regarding fuel resistance, maybe not quite as good.

Anything can yellow or fade over time.  I do not know of a way to stop that.

There is a product called Diamond Clear coat, or something like that.  It is a one-part system, no catalyst needed.  It can be sprayed or brushed.  I have never used it but it might be something to investigate for fuel resistance and compatibility with other finishing systems.

Online Dan McEntee

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Re: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2019, 08:20:54 AM »
    I would concur with what Jim said. The Diamond coat stuff has caused some people some troubles also, and it has been discussed at length on the forums also.  Your favorite brand of clear dope, sprayed over the whole air frame. should suffice for normal protection from exhaust emissions. Raw fuel is usually dripped and spattered on the nose when fueling and such, and that is why you want to use the Nason on the nose area only, with maybe a dusting on the leading edges at the wing roots. Careful sanding and buffing will make in invisible. A regular, good coat of paste wax over the entire airplane will help also. And this all can be repaired more easily that with a thick stack of a mix of products in search of a answer that you really don't even need. Think about it.
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   Dan McEntee
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Offline Serge_Krauss

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Re: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« Reply #7 on: February 17, 2019, 05:56:07 PM »
One thing I discovered the hard way concerning Butyrate clear dope that might apply to colored dope:

I mixed "fade proof" ink with Brodak's clear and prayed this on over "B-25 silver" for a metallic finish (Brodak's 'candy' colors faded fast in the sun).  I either did not final-coat with clear, or used too little, because the fuel (5% and 10% nitro) really took that finish off. I had assumed that, since my paint was based on clear, it would stand up. After cleaning off my plane's nose, I sprayed clear butyrate generously. With just a couple or so

 days to set, I flew the plane, and no more fuel damage occurred. Apparently the clear is much more fuel resistant pure than it is with pigment added.

SK

Online jfv

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Re: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« Reply #8 on: February 19, 2019, 12:48:47 PM »
Duplicolor Wheel Gloss Clearcoat works well.  I've used it on a number of my sport planes without any issues.  Just make sure you give it time to cure.
Jim Vigani

Offline Chancey Chorney

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Re: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« Reply #9 on: February 28, 2019, 06:26:11 PM »
I use this, and have yet to have a problem. I have only used this on 1/2a planes, but I am also using 20% nitro.
https://www.lowes.com/pd/Minwax-11-5-fl-oz-Gloss-Oil-based-Polyurethane/999913663

Offline IdRatherBeBuilding

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Re: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« Reply #10 on: March 03, 2019, 12:16:40 AM »
I Have a Few Cans of That!!!

Thanks Chancey!!!

I'll give it try!
David Miller

A society grows great when old men plant trees the shade they know they will never sit in

Offline Dennis Toth

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Re: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« Reply #11 on: March 03, 2019, 11:28:43 AM »
Chancey,

Does the Miniwax Polyurethane go on over Sig dope? Is it crystal clear or varnish color? Last, how long do you let it dry/cure before it is fuel proof?


Best,    DennisT

 

Offline James Holford

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Re: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« Reply #12 on: March 03, 2019, 02:19:05 PM »
Jamie Holford
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Offline IdRatherBeBuilding

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Re: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« Reply #13 on: March 03, 2019, 03:12:23 PM »
Wholly Crap James!

You friggin Found IT!!!

That is SO Sweet.
No more filtering or mixing or CLEANING.

Kinda pricey. But Very convenient.


David Miller

A society grows great when old men plant trees the shade they know they will never sit in

Offline James Holford

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Re: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« Reply #14 on: March 03, 2019, 03:14:29 PM »
And short shelf life! Keep refrigerated after initial use.... and let it get to room temp before use again.

Really is great stuff

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Jamie Holford
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Offline IdRatherBeBuilding

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Re: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« Reply #15 on: March 03, 2019, 03:30:17 PM »
 :o
It has a shelf life after you mix it?
How long have you noticed it to last??
I just assumed, use and then throw away.
David Miller

A society grows great when old men plant trees the shade they know they will never sit in

Offline James Holford

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Re: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« Reply #16 on: March 03, 2019, 03:33:15 PM »
Some claim a few months atleast. My last can lasted 2 months after initial use.

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Jamie Holford
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Offline Dennis Toth

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Re: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« Reply #17 on: March 03, 2019, 03:54:34 PM »
I have used this 2K Maxs product over Sig dope with very good results. After activation I applied a second top coat over dope after one week and it was just fine. It is completely fuel proof, just be careful and use gloves and a good high quality paint mask and apply outside or in a paint booth. There is another product from Spraymax.com - 2K Rapid clear coat (Prod. No.: 684 06), 8.5oz, this is a little small amount and is good for a top coat on an normal size stunter for one coat and a second around the nose/tank area (https://www.ebay.com/p/SprayMax-2k-Rapid-Cut-Clear-Coat-250ml-Spot-Repair-Faster-Drying-Spm-3684064/9019631343?iid=332468368274&chn=ps) about $17.75 per can.

Go to https://www.spraymax.com/en/products/product/clear-coats-and-spot-blender/2k-rapid-clear-coat/ for application information.

Best,   DennisT
« Last Edit: March 23, 2019, 12:18:51 PM by Dennis Toth »

Offline IdRatherBeBuilding

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Re: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« Reply #18 on: March 03, 2019, 04:10:28 PM »
ok, I just ordered 2 cans... ouch!
But if it last that long. heck if it last just a few days, it's worth it IMO.

I assume since it's named 2K, it's the same as Dupont's 2K line, or similar.

I guess I gotta get to work on some planes now..
David Miller

A society grows great when old men plant trees the shade they know they will never sit in

Offline phil c

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Re: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« Reply #19 on: March 03, 2019, 07:22:20 PM »
Valspar makes a clear, water-based floor varnish with polyurethane in it.  It is fairly fuel proof to spills as long as you don't let them sit.  For planes this is only good as a top coat or a sealer base coat.  It is too hard and brittle to use directly on silkspan or other covering.  The finish will craze as it dries.

If you really want fuel proof get epoxy or polyurethane 2 part paints, or autobody 2 part clear, heavily thinned.
phil Cartier

Offline Bob Mears

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Re: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« Reply #20 on: March 13, 2019, 07:41:47 AM »
I've been using rattle can Rustolium for color, then shootiing over it with the Minwax. So far up to 25% fuel doesnt effect it. But the Rustolium alone is NOT fuelproof, contrary to what I've heard from other folks. The Minwax makes for a nice finish too.
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Offline James Holford

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Re: Is there a Decent Nitro Proof Clear in a Rattle Can??
« Reply #21 on: March 22, 2019, 02:24:28 PM »
I've been using rattle can Rustolium for color, then shootiing over it with the Minwax. So far up to 25% fuel doesnt effect it. But the Rustolium alone is NOT fuelproof, contrary to what I've heard from other folks. The Minwax makes for a nice finish too.
The Rustoleum 2x isnt fuel proof.  The Protective Gloss Enamel is after you let it cire for week or 2.

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Jamie Holford
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