Author Topic: Shipping damage (Read 2762 times)

Gordon Tarbell · « **on:** July 26, 2007, 07:10:41 PM »

Have many of you been experiencing more damage to your post / ups delivered stuff the last year or so. I sure have. The last set of wing cores I received from Phil at the core house were munched pretty good, and the last three other model boxes were put through the stress test. My neighbor saw the Postman throw these boxes over my 6ft. fence . I could go on and on. In the last two years most of the packages I have received (all carriers not just Postal) were brutalized. I fill out paper work to report it but it just keeps happening. The posts on the drawing thread prompted this tirade from me .

Leester · « **Reply #1 on:** July 26, 2007, 07:32:09 PM »

I must say here in Illinois my mail carrier,UPS and Fed EX are very good, they put packages inside my back porch like I asked. On occasion something is damaged but not very often.

Wynn Robins · « **Reply #2 on:** July 26, 2007, 07:36:31 PM »

Seeing as I live in New Zealand- everything gets shipped interational air - what I find is that EVERY box that has the word "fragile" on it - gets dinged,dented or crunched - but EVERY SINGLE ONE that does not - arrives in perfect shape - must be something to it.

john e. holliday · « **Reply #3 on:** July 27, 2007, 06:50:58 AM »

You are so right. Don't mark fragile on the package. They will pick it up and shake it first to see if it rattles. Then it gets thrown into the cart to be shoved onto the truck. I have personally seen this at my local post office. Have fun, DOC Holliday

Scott Hartford · « **Reply #4 on:** July 27, 2007, 11:21:15 AM »

Remember the opening scene to Ace Ventura?

Steve Kientz · « **Reply #5 on:** July 27, 2007, 12:24:35 PM »

I work in a whse that does a great deal of business with the these shippers. The word "FRAGILE" means " I bet you can't break this!" in their language.

Steve

Paul Smith · « **Reply #6 on:** July 27, 2007, 01:38:23 PM »

I think buying the insurance would help.

My theory is that if it's insured, they will insure that they don't have to pay a claim.

If it's uninsured, they will insure that you buy insurance next time.

James Mills · « **Reply #7 on:** July 27, 2007, 07:31:35 PM »

Quote from: Ty Marcucci on July 27, 2007, 02:05:57 PM

WRONG. Have you ever tried to get anyone at UPS give you a straight answer about a damaged package?? They claim whoever packed it did it wrong and they are not responsible for their idiots stomping in it, foot prints or not. Been there, tried that. Remember, back in 1996 or so, UPS went on strike. The end result was most of the drivers and almost all of the sorters are part time help. My old bosses son was a manager of the site in St. Louis. You get what you pay for. None Union, non professional work. I am not pro union, but soon after, all my packages for my tool business came in busted open, bent, lost, you name it. I had the HQ switch me to Over Night. Never any more damage. But my stuff was all heavy and or large. Not models.

Locally I find that if the UPS guy rings the doorbell, the package is OK. BUT if he drops it and runs, it is bent. Received three kits like that via UPS. Never a problem with Fed EX. I'll give the local USPS a 95%. Same two mail delivery people each day. One on the day off, the other 5 days a week.

Ty,

Sorry that it seems you've had some bad experiences with UPS, but I can promise you that all of that work there aren't "idiots", so don't let a few bad ones make us all bad. I was there during the strike, it's still a union job (and that's not saying thats something I enjoy, but its the way it is). When we put the package down and run it's not that we're trying to get away with anything, just have alot of ground to cover and constantly less time by what the company says it should take us.

The long and short of it is, there isn't a perfect company out there and anytime you deal with a large corporation the red tape is unreal. For what it's worth, there have been several surveys that have shown UPS damage percentages are usually one of the lowest in the industry (and they own Overnight as well). The company hasn't been around for 100 years because they suck (like I said, there isn't a perfect company out there, always room for improvement).

James

James Mills · « **Reply #8 on:** July 27, 2007, 07:34:05 PM »

Quote from: James Mills on July 27, 2007, 07:31:35 PM

Ty,

Sorry that it seems you've had some bad experiences with UPS, but I can promise you that all of that work there aren't "idiots", so don't let a few bad ones make us all bad. I was there during the strike, it's still a union job (and that's not saying thats something I enjoy, but its the way it is) and I am full time, not part time. When we put the package down and run it's not that we're trying to get away with anything, just have alot of ground to cover and constantly less time by what the company says it should take us.

The long and short of it is, there isn't a perfect company out there and anytime you deal with a large corporation the red tape is unreal. For what it's worth, there have been several surveys that have shown UPS damage percentages are usually one of the lowest in the industry (and they own Overnight as well). The company hasn't been around for 100 years because they suck (like I said, there isn't a perfect company out there, always room for improvement).

James

minnesotamodeler · « **Reply #9 on:** July 27, 2007, 08:05:48 PM »

Well said. Any time you start blasting a profession or company, it's a sure bet that someone who works there is reading it. Probably a good thing to always keep in mind during our "rants". Modelers are a varied bunch--we're everywhere! So no matter who or what you blast, you're probably talking about one of "our own".

James Mills · « **Reply #10 on:** July 28, 2007, 08:26:16 AM »

Quote from: Ty Marcucci on July 27, 2007, 10:07:56 PM

Granted, not all that work for UPS are idiots. But come here to Huntsville, and try talking to the supervisor or what ever she is called about a busted package delivered by them. They are terrible here. I never had this kind of trouble in St. Louis. No matter what you say, I don't care for UPS and the way they deliver stuff. Once they claimed the driver put it on my porch and no one was home. I was home all day, and I don't have a porch. Seems the package ended up in Huntsville, Texas. Go figure. I though they used zip codes. Apparently not.

Like I said, there isn't a perfect company and I'm not trying to "convert" you over to UPS. The point I'm trying to make is that I have had customers tell me the same thing about Fed Ex, USPS, and anyother company out there. As far as the package being delivered on your porch and it ending up in Texas, the system showed it being delivered there (just a mistake, not trying to lie to you), it only takes one little problem in the address label to have it end up in the wrong place. There are millions of packages delivered daily, world wide with no problems (like I said they haven't been in business this long for nothing). Again, I'm not trying to convert you over to UPS (and after almost 17 years with them I have many days that I wish I had never left teaching) but it's the same old story, "when we did something right never heard a word, what was done wrong we hear about forever".

James

Steve Kientz · « **Reply #11 on:** July 28, 2007, 10:07:02 AM »

I had a DHL salesman bragging about a 3 day delivery that only took 1 day. I then asked him about a customer who was a 90 minute drive from Indy, who had been waiting for 5 business days for his parts. Told me he would have to look into that,he called me and said " We don't deliver to that area every day. With that comment we became a 100 % ups delivery customer. Yes, they do make mistakes but the % is very small. With models we might get better service if you pay for next day service.

Steve

Wayne Collier · « **Reply #12 on:** July 29, 2007, 03:11:51 AM »

Working in a regional distribution center for one of the nations larger home improvement retailers, I deal with several parcel and freight delivery companies on an almost daily basis. I personally accept and sign for dozens of packages per day from UPS, FedEx Ground, FedEx Express, and DHL. I also have some dealings with several other carriers. Overnight is a UPS company. We get some terrible loads on Overnight and FedEx freight. It may not be the companies as a whole, just the regional hubs that serve us. We have equally bad loads on other less than truck load carriers such as Estes and Saia. The loads that arrive in the best condition are usually carried by full truck load point to point companies that do not reconsolidate loads. On the parcel side, I have never seen a problem with DHL or FedEx Express-even on packages shipped from China. The FedEx Ground driver that usually serves us is an independent contractor that bid on the route and provides his own truck painted to FedEx specifications. FedEx Ground and UPS seem to be neck and neck in terms of quality. I have personally seen, on several occasions, a UPS driver walking on packages. We get miss delivered and damaged stuff from both companies. I've met the personnel and seen inside the trucks. I'm convinced that the quality of service has more to do with people who handle your package that the name painted on the truck. I'm convinced that it is good to learn who does the best job in your neighborhood and then insist on that company. In the neighborhood where I live the United States Postal Service is the best. We've had a real problem with UPS leaving packages at the wrong house. For what its worth, FedEx Ground and FedEx Express have different delivery networks. In the same neighborhood one may be first rate while the other isn't. When someone says they will ship something FedEx, its good to find out which FedEx service they use. In all cases highly protective packaging is highly recommended. Extra padding in a stronger box is probably more valuable than labeling something fragile.

minnesotamodeler · « **Reply #13 on:** July 29, 2007, 06:40:57 AM »

I use USPS exclusively mailing my kits; never had a problem yet. Timely delivery, no damage.

Willie Johnson · « **Reply #14 on:** July 29, 2007, 06:37:30 PM »

I work for one of the major companies mentioned above and was going stay out of this thread but as a participate in this hobby, I also have used all of the companies mentioned above. In transportation and all other industries the thing that is allways evident is customer expectation. The customer does and should expect their package to arrive on time and intact. 99% is good but not if the 1% is your package. To help keep your package from being in that 1% there are some things you can do to help. Ensure that your package is packed correctly. Most companies have packaging advice on-site or on line. It is best to overpack and if it is perishable, first seal the contents in a plastic bag. Your package is moving with thousands or even millions of others that may or maynot be as durable. Most companies are heavily automated with conveyors and divertors. You would be surprised at the speed and miles your package can travel within a sort facility not just on the road or in the air. Read the shipping agreement if its available. Get insurance if the cost justifies it. If there is a problem, report it or file a claim. Everyone in the industry knows how well they and everyone else are performing and for some employees it effects their paycheck directly. Put responsibly on your shippers for adequate packaging and insurance. This includes Ebay sellers. Once again please report when there is a problem. Email with pictures is great. Sometimes one employee makes everyone look bad. I had one USPS courier who was just terrible. They would not leave delivery attempt notices. I had kits sitting at the Post Office that I wondered if the shipper had shipped. I have had other couriers who were great. Not having a control line hobby shop in town, I order a bunch of stuff and it burns me up when I have a shipping issue.

Willie

Wayne Collier · « **Reply #15 on:** July 30, 2007, 05:24:17 PM »

I here you on the automated sorting. The building I work in has a few miles of conveyor belts and 135 automated divert lanes. We process on average about 200,000 cubic feet of freight in a ten hour shift. Poorly packaged items are at a real disadvantage which is why I believe better padding in a stronger box may be more effective than writing fragile on the package. I still hold the opinion, based on personal experience, that the delivery personnel in your neighborhood are a key part of the equation.

Douglas Babb · « **Reply #16 on:** July 30, 2007, 11:25:52 PM »

I order stuff all the time and it seems that if the shipper does a real good job the gorillas don't damage the contents but I have had packages that looked like they did everything possible to destroy the contents. I wonder how the HSI for my plane faired since it was not marked instrument but was insured, guess I will find out when it's inspected before installation. UPS delivered a 30# box from Aircraft Spruce the other day, the guy pulled up and I met him at the door. The bugger put the package down close to the screen door, looked at me and turned for his truck leaving me pinned inside and wouldn't come back to move it. Pr*&k drove off before I could get out the back which is probably a good thing. Calling the center only got a so what response. I'll use someone else from now on if I have a say over who ships it.

Warren Wagner · « **Reply #17 on:** July 31, 2007, 10:51:06 AM »

Folks,

With all due respect to conscientious UPS employees, I have NOTHING good to say about the quality of the handling of parcels by UPS !!!

Invariably, anything that I receive by UPS will show significant box damage, sometimes important, and sometimes not.

I would not normally comment on their poor service, accepting it to be a fact of life, but this morning, I received two packages from UPS, showing external compression damage, with a matching damage internally. One was not critical, but the second was a Flite Streak Trainer kit for my granddaughter. Though the kit box was damaged, fortunately nothing inside was damaged, but my respect for UPS continues on a down hill slide.

In the past, I ordered 6 gallons of fuel in metal cans. When I retrieved the box from my front (cement) porch, four out the six cans were crushed on the bottom, obviously from a drop, probably at waist level. A talk with the delivery man resulted in only a suggestion to place a claim.

A discussion with the manufacturer of the fuel said a claim through a company that size is next to worthless. It is dragged out for months, and in the meantime, you have to replace the order.

It should not be forced upon the consumer to be the final QC inspector in UP *Service*. That is an internal responsibility that should come from within the company, but what do they care about a few *model airplane supplies*. They have bigger fish to fry!

No....Dale Jarrett may like that Big Brown Truck ( it brings him $$$$), but I cringe when it stops at my doorstep !!

Cheers.

Warren Wagner

p.s. If you detect some steam coming from my ears, that is a good observation.

Leroy Heikes · « **Reply #18 on:** July 31, 2007, 11:17:18 AM »

I would just like to say I have had very good service from UPS at my house. My delivery person even wraps my packages in a plastic bag if I'm not home.

Leroy

john e. holliday · « **Reply #19 on:** July 31, 2007, 02:52:33 PM »

Quote from: Warren Wagner on July 31, 2007, 10:51:06 AM

Folks,

With all due respect to conscientious UPS employees, I have NOTHING good to say about the quality of the handling of parcels by UPS !!!

Invariably, anything that I receive by UPS will show significant box damage, sometimes important, and sometimes not.

I would not normally comment on their poor service, accepting it to be a fact of life, but this morning, I received two packages from UPS, showing external compression damage, with a matching damage internally. One was not critical, but the second was a Flite Streak Trainer kit for my granddaughter. Though the kit box was damaged, fortunately nothing inside was damaged, but my respect for UPS continues on a down hill slide.

In the past, I ordered 6 gallons of fuel in metal cans. When I retrieved the box from my front (cement) porch, four out the six cans were crushed on the bottom, obviously from a drop, probably at waist level. A talk with the delivery man resulted in only a suggestion to place a claim.

A discussion with the manufacturer of the fuel said a claim through a company that size is next to worthless. It is dragged out for months, and in the meantime, you have to replace the order.

It should not be forced upon the consumer to be the final QC inspector in UP *Service*. That is an internal responsibility that should come from within the company, but what do they care about a few *model airplane supplies*. They have bigger fish to fry!

No....Dale Jarrett may like that Big Brown Truck ( it brings him $$$$), but I cringe when it stops at my doorstep !!

Cheers.

Warren Wagner

p.s. If you detect some steam coming from my ears, that is a good observation.

Have not heard complaints about FED-EX yet. With the number of parcels these companies handle, I wonder how we even get them delivered in good condition. Have fun, DOC Holliday

Steve Kientz · « **Reply #20 on:** July 31, 2007, 04:52:43 PM »

We used FED EX at work for a while ,but our "independent contractor" was never on time. If you complained then you might not see him for several days. Needless to say we are once again100% UPS. we ship auto radiators and A/C parts,probably have a survivability rate of 90 %,I guess it could be worse. We had a UPS regional claims mgr tell us that TIRE TRACKS on a package might have been intentional, I just figure someone needed a wheel chock.
Personally I haven't had any trouble with my hobby shipments,but I don't order much.Remember the probability of damage goes up with each shipment. As for rude ,inconsiderate claims or delivery people, there is no excuse. Use to be said that every customer you p$#@% off,knows 100 people who are liable not to use your company,with the web that number could be ALOT higher.

Steve

Douglas Babb · « **Reply #21 on:** August 09, 2007, 04:15:26 PM »

Hate to spoil it for you Doc, the ARC oriental I ordered arrived by Fed-Ex in its carton complete with shoe imprints and signs of bending. The wing is in two pieces with several broken ribs and the fuse sheeting is punctured near the firewall, guess the fragile stickers on the box meant step on me with the ends supported and see what breaks.
Claim filed so we shall see. By the way they dropped a $ 9,000.00 Hartzell propeller off on my doorstep, I shure hope it's not dinged.

Wayne Collier · « **Reply #22 on:** August 11, 2007, 07:57:01 PM »

Is it just my neighborhood? One evening this week a delivery driver knocked on my door asking directions to the address printed on the package he was trying to deliver.

James Mills · « **Reply #23 on:** August 11, 2007, 09:49:20 PM »

Quote from: Wayne Collier on August 11, 2007, 07:57:01 PM

Is it just my neighborhood? One evening this week a delivery driver knocked on my door asking directions to the address printed on the package he was trying to deliver.

Why is this a problem, just because the driver is in your area doesn't mean that they know the area. Better to ask if not sure and avoid some of the previous complaints.

James

Wayne Collier · « **Reply #24 on:** August 11, 2007, 11:17:32 PM »

Maybe I'm strange but I figure if you have a regular route in an area you should know the area. I want the fireman to be able to find my house. I want the ambulance driver to be able to find my house. I want the mailman to find my house. In fact its a required part of those jobs to know the area. If a driver is new to an area an experienced person should be ridding with him. I'm not talking about some freight company that seldom makes deliveries here. I'm talking about a company that has trucks in the area every day. Further more, in our entire county there is a local law that requires addresses to be posted within a certain distance of the road. Also he wasn't looking for a new building but one that had been in the same place since the 1940s. Also drivers for this company seldom get signatures at delivery even if the shipper and the consignee both require it. I was told by a representative of this company that getting signatures was the drivers option. Once when a package never arrived my wife contacted the shipper about a refund. A few hours later the local delivery person called our house and insisted that the package was left in our garage. Because we have an open carport rather than a garage my wife ventured, "we don't have a garage." The driver then said the package was left in the garage of a brick house on the corner. Our house has wood siding and it is not on a corner. To my knowledge the package was never found. Our money was refunded. Several times other peoples stuff has been left on our porch and I have taken it to the rightful owners. I suspect that some of the people in the neighborhood wouldn't return the favor. Once I had a package left on my porch that belonged to some people who were about ten miles away. As said before I believe that a delivery person with a regular route should know the area. If a company moves its drivers around to much for them to learn an area or assigns to big of an area for them to learn or pressures them to make to many deliveries in a given amount of time it just proves that to that company profit margin is more important than the customer. The money comes from the customer in the first place doesn't it. Wouldn't it make sense to treat the customer well.

I will say this in this particular drivers favor. He did ask for help before just throwing the package down and running. I am very thankful and appreciative for that.

Jim Thomerson · « **Reply #25 on:** August 12, 2007, 03:53:40 PM »

Numbers are confusing on my road. When I first moved in I received several UPS packages not mine. I think we have had the same route driver the past several years and no more problems. There is a construction company two driveways down, with a number one letter different, which is back off the road with no sign. Periodically someone shows up at my door with a load of doors or lumber. Fortunately I am quite good at giving directions in Spanish.

Our regular mailman will put a small package in a garbage bag and hangs it on the mailbox. He will bring a larger package down the driveway and put it on the porch. Unfortunately mailmen are human and go on vacation from time to time and a replacement driver delivers the mail. Usually the mail comes around 2:00 PM but when it comes at 9:00 PM, I know a replacement driver is on the job. We had one replacement driver who simply put random batches of mail in mailboxes. The second day he was followed by a supervisor who straightened every thing out. We have done a lot of ebaY mailing out through USPS with no problem. Even one package where I used the wrong zip code. I read an 8 as a 6. Even so the package was delivered in reasonable time and the customer had no complaint.

We received a large Delft plate from Holland which was poorly packed. Did not have to open the package to get it out. My wife is a nut on packing, and even criticizes me, an acclaimed expert. I explained to her that the Dutch packing was adequate. Adequate packing is packing that gets the item there intact, right? We have received one postally bashed box with broken stuff. The packing was completely inadequate, and the stuff would have arrived broken in any case. Got no cooperation from the sender on insurance claim. Enough unbroken stuff that it was still a good deal so we let it slide.

James Mills · « **Reply #26 on:** August 12, 2007, 04:27:47 PM »

Quote from: Wayne Collier on August 11, 2007, 11:17:32 PM

Maybe I'm strange but I figure if you have a regular route in an area you should know the area. I want the fireman to be able to find my house. I want the ambulance driver to be able to find my house. I want the mailman to find my house. In fact its a required part of those jobs to know the area. If a driver is new to an area an experienced person should be ridding with him. I'm not talking about some freight company that seldom makes deliveries here. I'm talking about a company that has trucks in the area every day. Further more, in our entire county there is a local law that requires addresses to be posted within a certain distance of the road. Also he wasn't looking for a new building but one that had been in the same place since the 1940s. Also drivers for this company seldom get signatures at delivery even if the shipper and the consignee both require it. I was told by a representative of this company that getting signatures was the drivers option. Once when a package never arrived my wife contacted the shipper about a refund. A few hours later the local delivery person called our house and insisted that the package was left in our garage. Because we have an open carport rather than a garage my wife ventured, "we don't have a garage." The driver then said the package was left in the garage of a brick house on the corner. Our house has wood siding and it is not on a corner. To my knowledge the package was never found. Our money was refunded. Several times other peoples stuff has been left on our porch and I have taken it to the rightful owners. I suspect that some of the people in the neighborhood wouldn't return the favor. Once I had a package left on my porch that belonged to some people who were about ten miles away. As said before I believe that a delivery person with a regular route should know the area. If a company moves its drivers around to much for them to learn an area or assigns to big of an area for them to learn or pressures them to make to many deliveries in a given amount of time it just proves that to that company profit margin is more important than the customer. The money comes from the customer in the first place doesn't it. Wouldn't it make sense to treat the customer well.

I will say this in this particular drivers favor. He did ask for help before just throwing the package down and running. I am very thankful and appreciative for that.

I read your original post again and saw nothing about the driver being you regular driver. Even if the driver is in the area everyday I still think it's best to ask if there is any doubt (I've been on the route I have for 3 to 4 years and am still learning something new all the time). Please also keep in mind that at this time of the year it get above 120 in the back of those things (I checked once and it was approaching 130 and I was really questioning whether I should have left teaching and coaching). I know there are some bad apples, but I really believe that most of us are trying to do the best we can. As I put in another post, I emailed this thread to one of my bosses, for what it's worth.

James

Author Topic: Shipping damage (Read 2762 times)

Steve Kientz

Steve Kientz

Steve Kientz