When does it go from hobby to hoarding

[YakNine]

Well Happy almost New Year's everybody, I was in the cellar at my Mom's place where I have all my plane stuff stored getting my flight box and little Sig Buster ready for the Garden State Circle Burner New Year's Day fun fly. I don't know why but I got the urge to count how many engines I have , I love engines I own from Pee Wee .020's to Veco .61's In the last few years, probably 6 or so I have made approximately 12 flights but I have burned 7 gallons of fuel running engines, anyway I counted 99 engines and thought well I guess I gotta buy one more, then I found a shoebox with 8 more in it. I have 3 flyable planes and 107 runnable engines, I am not counting parts engines just engines that if I bolted them to the stand that would run, I must be crazy, but it was all fun! T J

[Robert Zambelli]

Now here's some hoarding!
Actually, these are just some of the engines going into the museum.
Bob Z.

[Gerald Arana]

It's only hoarding when you have to move stuff to walk through the house.

MM

My wife made me move my airplanes out of the living room and now I don't have enough space in the garage to do much building..........

Oh well, Jerry

[Tim Wescott]

It only becomes hoarding when you die and your kids have to clean up.  Until then -- enjoy!

[Avaiojet]

YackNine,

I fly more than you do.

[Jim Kraft]

Well now I know I am not alone. I love running old sparkers on the test stand. I have had some really bad back problems that last two years and have not been able to stand on concrete long enough to get a flight in without loosing the feeling in my left foot and extreme pain in my lower back. But my second hobby is old engines. I have a couple of dresser drawers full plus engines on 20 plus planes. I built this little test stand 35 years ago to run my then knew OS 60 FS open rocker 4 stroke. It has run many more engines since then and has served me well.

[Randy Cuberly]

I too have a lot of engines.  I don't really consider it hoarding.  As a competitive expert flier I've been caught many times without a spare of "this or that" and never enough time to get one because it's been discontinued or some manufacturer found out that CL people were using their product so, stopped making it...     This is especially true with engines and engine parts!   

Just look at the situation with glow plugs for competitive stunt engines today!  The stinking electric furor probably caused that! 

Years ago before I retired I knew I would be a "Poor Boy" after retirement so I thought "stocking up" was a smart thing to do.  Well, some of it was and some of it wasn't!  I wound up with a LOT of dope that turned brown in the can and couldn't be replaced because the manufacturer said it has a shelf life and that's it...never could tell me what that shelf life was supposed to be!   

Anyway I simply figured GOOD popular engines would always be a good investment and excellent trading material for whatever else was needed.  That has proven to be correct but it really hurts me deep down to think about selling a PA or RO Jett or VF...  maybe that's when it could be called HOARDING! 

Oh yeah...Kits!  uhhhh well kits are another story; too many of those too!

Randy Cuberly

[Sean McEntee]

YackNine,

I fly more than you do.

[Scott Richlen]

I suppose I have to plea "(sort-of) guilty as charged!"  But not really - I plan to build all of my kits!  Should have them all completed by by the time I turn 250.

Sadly, we had a guy in our club that actually did fill his house with stuff, but then never used it.  In 30 years he only came to 2 club meetings and he  never did show up at the flying field to fly with us.  He's now in a care home and someone is selling all of his stuff on Ebay.

Its sort of like being in bed with a beautiful woman and then not making love.  All those kits and engines never got the chance to be built and fly.  How sad.

[YakNine]

I just really enjoy taking a neglected forgotten engine cleaning it up freeing it up making some new gaskets for it and firing it up for the first time in years, I like figuring out their quirks , what they like what they don't like, it's a lot cheaper than a therapist! TJ

[Terrence Durrill]

           I am with you.......guilty as charged.  Seventy-seven years old, bad knees that interfere with flying time, and over 100 engines in the shop, along with somewhere in the neighborhood of 55 kits, stunt, combat, sport, R/C,  etc., etc.  Heaven help us all ! .....         

[Dan McEntee]

I just really enjoy taking a neglected forgotten engine cleaning it up freeing it up making some new gaskets for it and firing it up for the first time in years, I like figuring out their quirks , what they like what they don't like, it's a lot cheaper than a therapist! TJ

     You are absolutely 110% correct!. I have several foot lockers and dresser drawers full of engines and stacks of kits, balsa and covering material. Shelves full of books and filing cabinets full of magazines and thousands of plans. More Cox and Wen-Mac stuff than most people have ever seen. I came from a back ground where my Mom had to raise 9 kids all by herself, and that didn't allow for me to have stuff like that as a kid. So when I started out in adult life and earning a living I began to collect stuff I wanted, or had as a kid, and anything else that interested me along the way. I have always worked two or sometimes three jobs to finance it all. When a comment is made about never being able to build them all, I will agree, but my rationalization is that if I want to build a certain kit or airplane and power it with a certain engine, all I have to do is take it from stock, so to speak! I have never looked at any of it as an investment to make any money off of, but have it all just for the "cool factor." The same for my vintage motorcycle stuff. It is what comforts me and keeps me ticking. I pity people that have no passion for anything, nothing that grabs at their soul. The sights, sounds and smells of what I do are what makes me , well, me! Everything from watching a simple rubber powered model flying smooth circles as it climbs out, to grabbing a handful of throttle on a vintage dirt bike and feeling the response of the engine grabbing the ground at the rear wheel and streaking through some beautiful woods. It's called living life.  It's like the old saying: If you understand, no explanation is necessary. If you do not understand, no explanation is possible!
  Type at you later and HAPPY NEW YEAR!!!
    Dan McEntee

[Avaiojet]

I hoard nothing and collect nothing. I have no kits or engine collections. Never did. I only buy what I need for a project I may have in mind. If I loose interest in the project, I sell what I don't need. This is why I'm selling finished models that I no longer have interest in. When the "Build" is over and I move on to another interesting project. I might even spend some time flying the model, but because I'm not "contest" or "flying" driven, I generally don't.

Sure, I may have a few "scratch built" models that I'll hang on to for that day when you have the time to do a redo but I consider these models difficult to replace. AND I really like them.

I believe Hobbyists "Collect" rather than "Hoard." However, it can still be an "Issue."

Lots of interesting information on line about "Hoarding and Collecting."

Here's one interesting link. This subject is worth exploring.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/fulfillment-any-age/201207/4-signs-youre-extreme-collector

[Jim Kraft]

Oh Yeh! Dan, you are a man after me own heart. I love old dirt bikes. They had something the newer ones don't have. Old Triumph 650c were really cool. But so were the Indian Woodsman 500 singles. Talk about torque. My only bike now is an old 18 year old Harley Softail Custom. The last dirt bike I rode was an old Honda 500 single thumper. I had a 1942 Harley "45" when I was a freshman in high school. Wish I still had it.

And yes, there is a great reward of taking old stuff and making it work like new again. I have reworked many old spark ignition engines just as a labor of love. Nothing like getting a first flip start on one of the old ones. I mostly only stick with stuff that worked originally like Atwood's, Ohlsson's, Super Cyclones, Anderson Spitfires, and Orwicks.

I don't think I have one that has not been flown. I have a cut down Super Zilch that I use for an engine test bed for flying. Sort of Hot wings Zilch.

[EddyR]

  I now have 10 motors or maybe less. Four models ready to fly and no kits or balsa.
  I never have been a motor collector but have worked on hundreds of ST motors for other people.
   
Ed


   


 

[Bill Mohrbacher]

You can be a hoarder or a Collector, but when you begin sharing, you could start becoming a historian.  My opinion.

[Jim Kraft]

Hey Bill. You are our go to guy for history on Fox engines. Many thanks for your pictures and info. It is guys like you that make the stuff we do have more enjoyable. I see you have an OS 60 FS open rocker job. I have one that I just converted to ignition with points and modified the drive spool to serve as a cam. It has many hours of running on several planes, but still runs like new. Neat engines. I bought mine new in 79.

[Bill Mohrbacher]

Thanks for the kind words Jim.  The OS FS 60 is a great engine, easy to handle and impressive to run.  I have put mine away and run a little Saito 30, first version with the cast rockers.  They are quite long and you can really see them.  Spectators love this engine.  I like to set up my demos with 3 blade props; on lookers like them, too.

You know, something that really drew me deeper into engines even after my Fox set was about complete, was the variety in the engines.  Who would ever have believed there was a piston valve and that it was a huge success?  Or the twin intake Atwood Champions? or...or...or?

[mike londke]

I too have a lot of engines.  I don't really consider it hoarding.  As a competitive expert flier I've been caught many times without a spare of "this or that" and never enough time to get one because it's been discontinued or some manufacturer found out that CL people were using their product so, stopped making it...     This is especially true with engines and engine parts!   

Just look at the situation with glow plugs for competitive stunt engines today!  The stinking electric furor probably caused that! 

Years ago before I retired I knew I would be a "Poor Boy" after retirement so I thought "stocking up" was a smart thing to do.  Well, some of it was and some of it wasn't!  I wound up with a LOT of dope that turned brown in the can and couldn't be replaced because the manufacturer said it has a shelf life and that's it...never could tell me what that shelf life was supposed to be!   

Anyway I simply figured GOOD popular engines would always be a good investment and excellent trading material for whatever else was needed.  That has proven to be correct but it really hurts me deep down to think about selling a PA or RO Jett or VF...  maybe that's when it could be called HOARDING! 

Oh yeah...Kits!  uhhhh well kits are another story; too many of those too!

Randy Cuberly

Speaking of kits, did you ever build the Demon Twin Pack you bought from me? Pics? Those were part of the purge I did from my hoard. Just too many to build in a lifetime. I thinned my kit stash down to about 15 of higher quality stuff.

[Fredvon4]

Eyes and wallet were a bit too big as I retreaded back to the hobby in 2012
Managed to acquire more than I will ever need

On several forums and have often thought that a LOT of the Hundreds, Thousands, and Millions (cox) of engines produced are sitting in the shops of a relatively few people

as a kid I had at most 4 engines...2 cox, one Enya .35 and one Fox 35

Now I have 75 running engines and 7 flying planes

OCD like I am inventory, and upkeep of this engine inventory is actually a royal PITA....slowly down sizing as I get a freaquin grip

[john e. holliday]

Bill, is that a GHQ in the second photo?   My brother Bob had one and used to run it in the back yard just to hear it run.   He stated most people couldn't get them o start or run because they didn't flip them the right way.   He used to race a big red sprint car type tether car with McCoy Redhead .60 and won several awards with it when they had the circle in KCMo..    I won't mention how many engines I have now as I have give away some engines to a person I thought would use them.   Now I can't get them back.  Also planes and engine combos I've sold through the years.  Keep thinking I would start listing in the bay, but self says no every time I look at my stuff.  Over 50 years getting this stuff even though I really shouldn't have.  I am still adding to it.

[Chris McMillin]

X2!!!

Quote from: Avaiojet on Yesterday at 05:16:47 PM
YackNine,

I fly more than you do.

* 05FC557C-DC45-4815-AB42-218522A8C098.jpeg (92.03 kB, 960x720 - viewed 22 times.)

[YakNine]

Funny thing is the only time I ever get to fly is the New year's Fun Fly, the rest of the year I'm either Farming or working at the Rail Road or out on the sail boat. But since you guys said it's ok I bid on 3 more  engines today might as well make it 110 . Happy New Year everyone TJ

[Dave Holtsclaw]

When you cant use the second bathroom because its full of kits   that is my house

[Randy Cuberly]

Speaking of kits, did you ever build the Demon Twin Pack you bought from me? Pics? Those were part of the purge I did from my hoard. Just too many to build in a lifetime. I thinned my kit stash down to about 15 of higher quality stuff.

I built one of them.  It's hanging on the wall with a Fox36X in it but not covered yet!.  I will finish it and build the other on as soon as I get the three stunt ships ahead of it Covered and painted!
The Colossus is in final stages. All that's left is gluing in the hinges and mounting the engine and tank.

C'mon...don't laugh.  I actually have eight airplanes all framed up and waiting for covering and painting!

OK laugh if you wish, I hate to paint!  I'm also not very good at it!

Randy Cuberly

[Tim Wescott]

According to my wife, the knitting term is SABLE -- Stash Accumulated Beyond Life Expectancy.

[EddyR]

There is a great deal written on the internet about collecting and hording. There seems to be a big difference between the two. Hording can looked up on Google .It says it takes over your life. I do not think any modelers I know come under this condition. I have only known one person who was a hoarder and he had more books than you can emagine. If you can not get around your house because of the clutter you may be a hoarder.
   Here is a clip from Google that applies to many of US                    " When people think of collecting, they may imagine expensive works of art or historical artifacts that are later sold to a museum or listed on eBay. The truth is, for many people who amass collections, the value of their collections are not monetary but emotional —and often, not for sale. Collections allow people to relive their childhoods, to connect themselves to a period in history or to a time they feel strongly about. Their collections may help them to ease insecurity and anxiety about losing a part of themselves, and to keep the past present [1] Some collect for the thrill of the hunt. Collecting is much like a quest, a lifelong pursuit which can never be complete.[2] Collecting may provide psychological security by filling a part of the self one feels is missing or is void of meaning.[3] When one collects, one experiments with arranging, organizing, and presenting a part of the world which may serve to provide a safety zone, a place of refuge where fears are calmed and insecurity is managed.[4] Motives are not mutually exclusive; rather, different motives combine in each collector for a multitude of reasons"

One area that I see a lot is audio speaker hording. Filling the home with speakers,it is very common.

I have no collections at this time but in the past I did get carried away with a small collection of old radios.
Eddyr

[mike londke]

I built one of them.  It's hanging on the wall with a Fox36X in it but not covered yet!.  I will finish it and build the other on as soon as I get the three stunt ships ahead of it Covered and painted!
The Colossus is in final stages. All that's left is gluing in the hinges and mounting the engine and tank.

C'mon...don't laugh.  I actually have eight airplanes all framed up and waiting for covering and painting!

OK laugh if you wish, I hate to paint!  I'm also not very good at it!

Randy Cuberly

Just like the rest of us. 10 projects going at the same time. 

[Avaiojet]

The wife and I have no speakers in the house at all except for what is in the TV's. Probably why the sound is terrible?

Collecting.

I did search for a bunch of those 1:18 scale Diecast cars for an art project, the 57-58 Corvettes and that Pink Cadillac plus 5 or 6 more. I never did the art project but still have the Diecast cars someplace in a box. This was 1996.

I should dig them up and turn the cars into modeling money.

They are collectibles, you would think after 22 years?

Anyone collect these 1:18 scale Diecast cars. They are quite nice.

[Dan McEntee]

The wife and I have no speakers in the house at all except for what is in the TV's. Probably why the sound is terrible?

Collecting.

I did search for a bunch of those 1:18 scale Diecast cars for an art project, the 57-58 Corvettes and that Pink Cadillac plus 5 or 6 more. I never did the art project but still have the Diecast cars someplace in a box. This was 1996.

I should dig them up and turn the cars into modeling money.

They are collectibles, you would think after 22 years?

Anyone collect these 1:18 scale Diecast cars. They are quite nice.

   No they usually don't. They are like the Franklin Mint Commemorative Plates and such. They sell them telling you that they are collectible, but that's as far as it goes. The only thig that is collectible and increases in value are the objects that no one expected to be, so they were worn out and thrown away. They make those cars and such to fit a general audience, and even though they may be a "limited production" item ( a term which means many things) the audience is also limited in the few people that may actually like that item, and once they are gone, so will the demand. You've seen it in eBay prices for kits and engines going up and down like yo-yos. I collect some die cast airplanes and race cars, not because they may increase in value, but because they look cool, and they had better be really nice or I don't buy 'em. Case in point is Texaco stuff. They marketed their dies cast collectibles through their gas stations, but even though they were "limited production," they didn't tell you they had warehouses full of them to later sell in "complete sets" or the individual pieces to people who started late and needed to catch up. The first airplane was a Lockheed Air Express in "limited numbers." then they went on to release one new one each year and a special price, then if you needed to play catch up, you could buy older ones at an inflated price. The open market had the Lockheed Air Express at asking prices of 300 bucks or more because the concept was they were made in "limited numbers" and "rare" .  The asking prices were just that, asking prices and I know of no one that ever paid that much for the N0.1 airplane in the collection. I got mine by paying a guy in my neighborhood $150 for his whole collection of airplanes ( about 14 or so at that time) because he wanted to concentrate on Texaco trucks. I sold all the others off at half price, made my money back and more, and got my No1 airplane essentially for free.  They come up on evilBay from time to time at the big prices, but even the cheap ones at the original price often sit with no bids or buyers. I collect the die cast race cars that are vintage midgets, sprint cars, champ dirt cars and Indy cars. again, not because they will increase in value, but because they were certain cars driven by certain drivers and such, and very cool! I have a 1/12 scale model of A.J Foyt's DOC Ford powered champ dirt car that I paid a couple of hundred bucks for new. VERY NICELY DONE MODEL!!! They went up in value for a while, and were truly limited production of only a few hundred units made. They go for sometimes less than the original selling price, even though the manufacturer is out of business and you know no more will ever be made, but I don't care. I have MINE because I'm a big fan of A.J.Foyt. The cars you have , you could probably call "genaric" and were made in the thousands. Especially if you bought them through an add in a magazine or newspaper add. The only toy or model cars I ever saw that reached big prices are the old Japanese tin litho wind up and battery powered cars, and the plastic 'promo" cars that dealers used to give out for Dad to take home to little Johnny after he signed the papers to buy his new Buick. But even those prices have dropped in the last several years as that generation of collectors tired of them and/or passed on. If you want to sell the cars you have, list them individually on evilBay at a starting bid of ten bucks each and see what happens. Even if they sell for that you will at least have that ten bucks and more room in your closet.
  Type at you later,
  Dan McEntee

[Avaiojet]

Dan,

Are you a typist? I use 2 fingers that trip over each other from time to time.

I dug those cars up. I didn't pay for them. Well I did but with someone else's money. I was commissioned to do a 3-D rendering of a Bar. The owner changed his mind but told me to keep the deposit. I had Coca Cola stuff also but that stuff I sold.

Here's a shot of the cars. I removed 2 so I could repair the boxes. 22 years I've had this stuff.

Cast airplanes. I don't have any of them, but almost bought the TEXACO 13 because I have that drawn in CAD and will be building that model soon.

CB

[Sean McEntee]

Dan,

Are you a typist? I use 2 fingers that trip over each other from time to time.

I dug those cars up. I didn't pay for them. Well I did but with someone else's money. I was commissioned to do a 3-D rendering of a Bar. The owner changed his mind but told me to keep the deposit. I had Coca Cola stuff also but that stuff I sold.

Here's a shot of the cars. I removed 2 so I could repair the boxes. 22 years I've had this stuff.

Cast airplanes. I don't have any of them, but almost bought the TEXACO 13 because I have that drawn in CAD and will be building that model soon.

CB

Haha he uses same method. Never seen anyone “hunt and peck” that fast, though I guess at that speed it’s just “pecking”. 

[john e. holliday]

Well these key boards might be arranged like the old Smith-Corollas,  but I make too many mistakes when trying to type like I was taught in high school.   Happy new year.

Can't believe I had to type 60+ words a minute after subtracting all the mistakes to pass Typing 101.

[Avaiojet]

Haha he uses same method. Never seen anyone “hunt and peck” that fast, though I guess at that speed it’s just “pecking”. 

Sean,

Thank you for the kind reply.

And thank you for your service to this Great Country. 

Happy new Year!

Charles

[Dan McEntee]

Dan,

Are you a typist? I use 2 fingers that trip over each other from time to time.

I dug those cars up. I didn't pay for them. Well I did but with someone else's money. I was commissioned to do a 3-D rendering of a Bar. The owner changed his mind but told me to keep the deposit. I had Coca Cola stuff also but that stuff I sold.

Here's a shot of the cars. I removed 2 so I could repair the boxes. 22 years I've had this stuff.

Cast airplanes. I don't have any of them, but almost bought the TEXACO 13 because I have that drawn in CAD and will be building that model soon.

CB

   Yup, Toys-R-Us fodder. Especially if the boxes are that bad. A real, true collector of anything will want the box to be as nice as what's inside of it. If they bought them for you, that a key sign that they were cheap cars. Donate them to Goodwill, give them to a neighbor kid to really make his day, or display 'em. But I don't think they have any real value, even the Buraggo cars, or the Maesto (how ever they are spelled).
   Type at you later,
    Dan McEntee

[Jim Carter]

    WOW!!  Hey Mr. Bob Z. .... I sure wish you lived near me  !!  I'd like to "borrow" that one, that one, the one over there and that one next to the the one I'd like you to give me  !!

[Frank Imbriaco]

My hope(just kidding) is that I outlast my contemporaries... the ones  who are responsible for running up the prices on Dooling 61s. Then, I can buy a couple on the cheap.
TJ : You made the GSCB New Years gathering?
 How many showed in the single digit cold and  flew ? Pictures ?
Happy New Year,
Frank

[YakNine]

I went Frank, but it was 3° when I got there at 9:15 I lit the propane space heater but it kept blowing out. I took my Little Buster with your old Fox on it but I didn't even try and start it. Mike Cooper got a flight in with his Electric Fancherized Twister but it was pretty windy so the rest of us chickened out. I have an old Junior Ringmaster that I bought off Larry Scarinzi at the swap meet a few years ago and I am thinking about converting it to electric power for just such ocasions. T J
 

[Allan Perret]

It's only hoarding when you have to move stuff to walk through the house.

MM

OH-OH, I might be in trouble.

Like this thread, looks like lots of others do also.

[FLOYD CARTER]

I have now acquired most of the engines I always wanted or once owned as a youth, except for a 1949 (?) Super Tigre G-19; the very first S.T.  It had a sand-cast case, twin exhaust, and was a ,29 cuin glo or diesel (both were made).  So, if you have one, contact me.

All old engines in my collection are either near-new or restored.  I run them all.

[Fredvon4]

Does having too many sheds/ shops count?

When we moved here in 1994 the 2.5 acres and 3100 Sqf Ranch house was selected as OUR Retirement property.

A plus selling point was a 30X40 out building on a good slab and all metal construction, with electricity

Over the years we closed in the 3 car garage to the main house and used the space as a very large kitchen

Along the way I gained 2 pre-built sheds for yard tool storage...in our area "Jackson buildings"

With no attached garage any more we got one of the larger 20 x 30 x 12 Carolina Car ports for our cars on a nice concrete slab

In retirement we made the mistake of a Winnebago Self contained RV and the requite Car port for it...15 x 42 x 14 tall

As I retired I convinced she who must be obeyed I Needed a Wood working shop...Off site built by "Leylands" came delivered a spec built 14 x 24 lofted barn with double flooring for my heavy wood working machines.... son and I finished out the inside with electrics and dust evac system

Wife had a few hobby desires so we had an on site built 16 x 24 Barn with second floor built, insulated, electrified that she quickly out grew ---so I finished out the inside of the original 30 x 40 metal "shop" and added full AC, internet, and a lot of creature comforts

So to re-cap
20 x 30 car port
30 x 40 original metal building now HER hobby shop
16 x 24 Barn my current Airplane factory and hanger... upper floor is out "ATTIC"... storage of Xmass, Halloween and other STUFF
14 x 24 Lofted barn my current wood working shop
10 x 12 Jackson building #1 yard equipment
8 x 12 Jackson Building... #2 more yard stuff mostly expendables like fertilizer, round up, hoses, mower repair items, and spreaders
15'x 42' x 14 tall RV parking being converted to my new Hanger model shop

So main house and SSEVEN out buildings... my oh my am I ever so screwed if the County Tax ladies come to inventory....before I am 65-- when we get locked in on Tax rate....in this Texas County

BTW.....my USSA insurance agent is more than willing to sell me a listed Fire arms, fine art, or jewelry policy rider.....but has no product to cover my wife machines* or my extensive wood working/hobby collections**

One of 8 machines she has is $16,800.... other sergers and sewing machines are in the $250 to $800 range....not to mention she has MORE Material than any local  JoAnns or Walmart

I have some 75 working engines worth over $7000 and 10s of thousands of dollars worth of tools and supplies

Fortunately we never are gone long enough to be wiped out by theft and fire is a singe building event... (plenty of separation)

Flood and hurricane low risk

BUT Zombie attack could wipe me out as I only have a one week supply of ammo

NOT a hoarder Fred... just trying to prove he who dies with the most toys...wins!