Author Topic: Update on Bob Gieseke's Nobler **** More photos added (Read 24099 times)

EddyR · « **Reply #50 on:** December 20, 2017, 02:05:50 PM »

One thing that I have not seem mentioned in many years is Bob flew very slow lap times. The wing overs were so slow you would wonder if it was going to make it. I think he used 58 ft lines. He did use the short wing in more than one model.
Ed

Dan McEntee · « **Reply #51 on:** December 20, 2017, 09:45:33 PM »

Quote from: EddyR on December 20, 2017, 02:05:50 PM

One thing that I have not seem mentioned in many years is Bob flew very slow lap times. The wing overs were so slow you would wonder if it was going to make it. I think he used 58 ft lines. He did use the short wing in more than one model.
Ed

You know, I don't think I have ever heard the other particulars of Bob G's models discussed either, or his general set up and flying philosophies were. Things like his preferred lap time, line length, favorite fuel, prop, plugs and such. If I was going to try and build an accurate replica to fly, I would want to try and replicate everything just for the chance to experience what he experienced.
When He passed away, I read where he was going home to be buried in his home town of Greeneville, IL. I had no idea he was from a town that close to me, so I made the effort to attend his funeral and I'm glad I did. It was an honor to do so and I was grateful to meet the rest of his family. I was surprised to see that he was buried with his customized EZ-Just handle in his hand, the 5 inch handle with some balsa pieces added and carved to shape. Did he really use this same handle all the time?
Type at you later,
Dan McEntee

Brett Buck · « **Reply #52 on:** December 20, 2017, 09:57:08 PM »

Quote from: Dan McEntee on December 20, 2017, 09:45:33 PM

You know, I don't think I have ever heard the other particulars of Bob G's models discussed either, or his general set up and flying philosophies were. Things like his preferred lap time, line length, favorite fuel, prop, plugs and such. If I was going to try and build an accurate replica to fly, I would want to try and replicate everything just for the chance to experience what he experienced.

He flew pretty slow for a Nobler with a Fox, but not extraordinarily slow. You did sometimes wonder whether it would make it over the top or through the overhead 8s, but it wasn't outlandish. He was also a proponent of "using the shortest lines he could get away with".

Brett

Dan McEntee · « **Reply #53 on:** December 25, 2017, 04:25:17 PM »

Quote from: Brett Buck on December 20, 2017, 09:57:08 PM

He flew pretty slow for a Nobler with a Fox, but not extraordinarily slow. You did sometimes wonder whether it would make it over the top or through the overhead 8s, but it wasn't outlandish. He was also a proponent of "using the shortest lines he could get away with".

Brett

Now that I have had a good Christmas dinner, Let's get back to this!

I would really have to think about how to achieve this set up. I'm used to starting out with lines just a little than I think I might need until I get the engine/ prop combo happy, then adjust the line length accordingly. Kind of the opposite of what is suggested here. I guess what I would need to figure out is the starting point, what engine speed and lap time? I'm used to going to longer lines to slow things down, not speed things up. I'll have to see if I got an airplane I can use to try this, I have a couple of ARF Noblers that would be good for this. They are fairly light So this would probably be a low RPM , high pitch operation? Got any idea what he ran for props? Since the airplanes survived, did he leave props on them as a guide? I have a couple of Top Flite Gieseke Nobler kits that are incomplete, and it would be fun to build up a true replica of his typical set up, including color scheme, line length, prop, handle and such. A kit built airplane with monokote covering wouldn't take too long and should be similar to his early efforts after the stock Nobler.
And with him living in the Texas area for so long, I find it interesting he would like to fly such low lap times in the typical winds down there?
MERRY CHRISTMAS and HAPPY NEW YEAR!!
Dan McEntee

Chris McMillin · « **Reply #54 on:** December 25, 2017, 04:41:49 PM »

Ha! Good one, Dan,

Actually weigh one and look for sub 50 oz all up. High compression Fox (or as high as they are when newly broken in, he used to throw them away when they quit making power.), no muffler, uniflow tank open to ram air, Rev Up 10x6 EW. Start with .015's at 62 feet and try for 5.3 laps and then start cutting off the lines and maintain 5.3 laps all the way to 57 feet or, as an experiment, shorter. It's so slow as to be scary.
Dad used to fly like that with the Shark, it's terrifying.

Chris...

pmackenzie · « **Reply #55 on:** December 25, 2017, 05:01:20 PM »

FWIW - I met Bob when we were down in Dallas for an F2D contest. ( 1998 or 1999 I think)

He was over in the Stunt circle flying a Fox powered Nobler most days we were there. I had one at the time and went over to say hello and see what he was running.
11x5 prop, 15% Nitro. I had also settled on 11x5, always found the model too "jumpy" on a 10x6 EW, despite that being the "standard" prop.
Switched to 15% after that as well.
I used to use 12x5 Rev ups cut down to 11" to get the wider blade. Thinned down and reshaped the tips a bit to match the shape of the 10x6 EW.

I also seem to recall he had little balsa pieces he would put in the venturi to add some choke area to affect the run?
Sort of L shaped parts of various thickness. Balsa presumably because they would not cause any damage if they got sucked in.
Anyone else recall that?

Super nice guy.

Pat MacKenzie

Air Ministry . · « **Reply #56 on:** December 26, 2017, 08:22:47 PM »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=2&v=0LyUL8X1cEo

0:50 on . was windy we're told .

EddyR · « **Reply #57 on:** December 27, 2017, 07:04:37 AM »

Matt I found the video you posted very nostalgic. That was the Bob I remembered from long ago Nats and from my stop overs in Dallas. He was very animated in his stance. Not the stiff stance of many today.
EddyR

Andre Ming · « **Reply #58 on:** December 27, 2017, 07:40:08 AM »

Thanks for the video link! It was great seeing Bob fly!

At Duke's request, I recall building some hand made 35 Stunts for Bob when I worked at Fox. (This would have been early/mid 70s.)

Curt D Contrata · « **Reply #59 on:** December 29, 2017, 09:08:47 AM »

Thank you for posting all of these photos and for performing this restoration. It is a very special model, and the many pictures provide us all an insight to its life and history. It deserves to be preserved and not allowed to fall apart and turn to dust. I cannot think of 2 people more capable of the restoration and respectful of the model than would be Jim Lynch and Charlie Reeves. I look forward to more pictures of the progress and thank you again.

Curt

Les McDonald · « **Reply #60 on:** January 04, 2018, 02:41:42 PM »

Quote from: Paul Taylor on December 19, 2017, 09:35:42 PM

I find it interesting that the tank is built in.

Ah yes the built in tank.
I don't remember exactly when but at some contest Bob figured the feed line had split so Werwage suggested driving in a length of 3/32" tubing.
Later that evening we stopped by Bobs room to see how he was doing and I recall seeing more than half the 12" length of tubing sticking out of a tank that was, at most, 4 inches long. Soon after that the major surgery began!
I loved that guy!

Ken Culbertson · « **Reply #61 on:** April 09, 2018, 03:40:40 PM »

Quote from: Dave_Trible on December 15, 2017, 04:55:45 PM

I was thinking a modification or maybe yet another low outside bottom.

Dave

I think it was either Texarkana or Oklahama City in 1976-7. 2nd Sq Eight. I was there but that was a gazillion years ago so the place and year may be off. I practiced with Bob several times a week from 75-80. He never planted one in practice but he sure could scare the bugs! Bottoms to him in practice were like bat weights in the on deck circle.

Ken Culbertson · « **Reply #62 on:** April 09, 2018, 03:53:18 PM »

Quote from: EddyR on December 27, 2017, 07:04:37 AM

Matt I found the video you posted very nostalgic. That was the Bob I remembered from long ago Nats and from my stop overs in Dallas. He was very animated in his stance. Not the stiff stance of many today.
EddyR

It works, I don't know why we have become so stiff. Look at the international fliers. I would rather watch them than the plane!

Skip Chernoff · « **Reply #63 on:** April 09, 2018, 04:38:09 PM »

Thanks for the update and photos.

PJ Rowland · « **Reply #64 on:** April 12, 2018, 08:54:56 PM »

Nice to see video of him actually flying it.

I personally found that design to be one of the BEST wind planes ive ever had.
Sure I had stupid power.... but it worked very well. I also had Bob himself grinning ear to ear over the design combination.

My point here is.. the wing worked very well.. the design worked very well.. it has a broad operation range.

Yes I had a .61 in it.. but I also flew the .66 in it and noticed virtually zero trade off.

When I talk trade off.. what I mean is weight. YES its heavier and yes it pulls the cg forward.. but NOT as far as you think. But more importantly.. more power = fly slower. Even for that design.. I could drop to 6.5sec on a nice day and its like nothing out there today.

I just wish I could figure out a design thst gives this solid overpower feel.. with todays corner pop..

Lovely restoration.. id repaint it.. im sure thats what bob would have done if he had unlimited time.
He did tell me he wanted to build a copy of my combination just to try it.. but never had the chance..

Air Ministry . · « **Reply #65 on:** April 13, 2018, 12:47:50 AM »

Ya shoulda given him a whirl on the handle , P.J. .

Brett Buck · « **Reply #66 on:** April 13, 2018, 10:56:27 AM »

Quote from: Ken Culbertson on April 09, 2018, 03:53:18 PM

It works, I don't know why we have become so stiff.

Because if you do, you also have to fly 2000 flights a year to stay competitive, and, you *had* to do a lot of that just to get your airplane through the maneuvers by "helping" it at times, pulling here, holding back there, whipping, etc. Geiseke was one of the ultimate masters of the genre, mostly because (like everyone else) the performance of the airplane was so marginal that you *had* to do it. Flying a Fox 35-powered airplane successfully in the conditions (maybe 20-25 gusty and turbulent) as shown could only be accomplished by someone with the remarkable skills of a Bob Geiseke, and if it wasn't a W/C everyone would have just left the airplanes in the car rather than risk it.

This is one of the huge changes since then - now, you don't have to do this sort of thing, because you have so much performance and predictability from the engine/prop that it never needs anything like all that help. Once that is true, and it was possible to just plant your feet and stand there and still make it, then the set of compromises changes, and optimize around the new conditions. You stand up straight and move appropriately in order to create a repeatable reference frame for the maneuvers. And, this has also changed the approach to success, you cannot approach it the old way, because someone else (or everyone else) will do it a better way.

Note also that some/many people have failed to grasp this very fundamental change, and persist in trying to thrash themselves doing it the way they did it in 1966, and then become mightily frustrated when it doesn't work out. MANY more people are competitive than there used to be, and stuff like this is why.

Brett

Brent Williams · « **Reply #67 on:** April 13, 2018, 11:43:17 AM »

This video shows the decided lack of body english that Brett is speaking of. Definitely not waving his arms and body around like a used car lot inflatable.
(I have been watching this video as prep for this season to help make some corrections of my body positioning in relation to the maneuver.)

this:

not this:

Brett Buck · « **Reply #68 on:** April 13, 2018, 04:18:35 PM »

Quote from: Brent Williams on April 13, 2018, 11:43:17 AM

This video shows the decided lack of body english that Brett is speaking of. Definitely not waving his arms and body around like a used car lot inflatable.

I would hasten to add - if I was flying a Nobler/Fox in those sort of conditions (which I *have* done - a very long time ago), I would be doing it more or less like Bear or Billy would have. Either that, or I would probably crash or get blown out.

Flying in the conditions and situation in the linked video is something most people wouldn't even contemplate, and only a few could successfully complete. It is a tribute to the skills of the masters that they managed it as well as they did. You *couldn't* do it the way you see me doing it in 2015 with vastly higher performance equipment and much better conditions (although it's not that much different in high winds).

I wouldn't say the skills are *lower* now than they were (the capability of the human race hasn't changed consequentially in the last 50 years), but the required skill set is definitely different than it was then. The capability of the airplanes/powerplants is vastly superior so the average flight has also gotten much better (something that has been clearly apparent to me even over the last 25 years).

Brett

Mike Haverly · « **Reply #69 on:** April 13, 2018, 04:43:55 PM »

Just one more reply to the "stiff" comment. I launched Paul for this flight. I, as well as many others passed. Eugene Or. is notorious for turbulence. Note the trees in the background. The point is the top fliers still move around when necessary.

A side note. The rest of were sitting around bragging about having the common sense to sit out the rest of the contest when I happened to look over at the intermediate circle. The were still flying.
David won thes particular event.

Back to the original topic.

Joe Gieseke · « **Reply #70 on:** April 13, 2018, 07:51:59 PM »

Hi All

I don't remember allot of things that happened thru the years but I can share a bit.
The three dates on the plane are in relation to the build dates. The wing was built in the original model in the winter of 67, 68 and that plane won the Nats in 68 at Olathe Kansas.
In the winter of 73, 74 he removed the wing and built the existing fuselage and tail around that 68 wing. It won the Nats in Lake Charles and the WC in Prague Checklosavaki in 1974.
In the winter of 78, 79 he recovered and painted the plane, had the inverted landing event and won the 79 Nats in Lincoln Nebraska.

I asked Charlie to restore the plane for me as I prefer to have it looking good and more like it did when I shared that time with my dad and the US team in Checklosavaki.
I appreciate the work that Mr Lynch and Mr Reeves are putting into this project.
I'm looking forward to seeing it's completion and putting it on my wall next to a couple other models of his.

Joe G

Brett Buck · « **Reply #71 on:** April 13, 2018, 08:18:53 PM »

Quote from: Joe Gieseke on April 13, 2018, 07:51:59 PM

I asked Charlie to restore the plane for me as I prefer to have it looking good and more like it did when I shared that time with my dad and the US team in Checklosavaki.
I appreciate the work that Mr Lynch and Mr Reeves are putting into this project.
I'm looking forward to seeing it's completion and putting it on my wall next to a couple other models of his.

I think Charlie and Jim are great choices, and it will come out looking great - maybe as good or better than original!

As an aside, not the topic, but Bear was one of the finest gentlemen I have met in this event, and given the high standard, that is not something I say lightly. He was nothing but supportive of everything I did and at one point he was so effiusive it sounded like he was trying to start my fan club! I which I could have been around hi him more. We all miss him greatly!

Brett

Brent Williams · « **Reply #72 on:** April 13, 2018, 08:25:56 PM »

Joe Gieseke · « **Reply #73 on:** April 13, 2018, 09:03:29 PM »

Thanks for sharing Brent. I saw allot of faces and models that I remember.

Joe G

Warren Wagner · « **Reply #74 on:** April 14, 2018, 09:54:19 AM »

Brett,

Thanks for taking the time to post those photo links. Enjoyed them immensely. Our
sport/hobby has quite a colorful history...fortunately photos were taken so we haven't
lost it.

I'm happy that I did have the opportunity to meet Bob at the Nats one year. I had asked
him a question about measurements on his G. Nobler, and he said that if I still had
problems, to give him a call....the plane was hanging in his garage, and he would go
measure it for me. How often can one get a National and World Champion to do a
simple favor for you??

I sorry that he is no longer with us.

Cheers,

Warren Wagner

john e. holliday · « **Reply #75 on:** April 14, 2018, 11:20:55 AM »

Thanks for those links Brent. It is hard to believe I have been at this that long. Flying/attending many NATS got to meet a lot of those modelers. Wright&Dunkin were my mentors when I was trying/playing with F2C competition.

Larry Fernandez · « **Reply #76 on:** April 14, 2018, 04:17:46 PM »

This thread is great!
It has inspired me to build another Gieseke Nobler, replicating Bobs.
I built the Top Flite kit back in 1985. I didn’t fly well back then, (not that I fly well now)and I
had clue about trimming. But I sure had a lot of fun with that plane!

Larry, Buttafucco Stunt Team

BYU · « **Reply #77 on:** April 14, 2018, 06:00:40 PM »

Quote from: Larry Fernandez on April 14, 2018, 04:17:46 PM

This thread is great!
It has inspired me to build another Gieseke Nobler, replicating Bobs.
I built the Top Flite kit back in 1985. I didn’t fly well back then, (not that I fly well now)and I
had clue about trimming. But I sure had a lot of fun with that plane!

Larry, Buttafucco Stunt Team

What were you thinking, letting that homeless guy hold on to your plane?

Larry Fernandez · « **Reply #78 on:** May 10, 2018, 01:29:04 AM »

Just wondering about the progress of this project.
I started building a Gieseke Nobler last month and I want to replicate Bobs version.
I have the Top Flite plans as well as Steve Moons drawings.
These plans show a very different cowl. I don’t know which version I will use at this time.
Does anybody happen to know if Bob used the kit type cowl on any of his planes

Larry, Buttafucco Stunt Team

Ken Culbertson · « **Reply #79 on:** May 10, 2018, 07:30:46 AM »

Quote from: Larry Fernandez on May 10, 2018, 01:29:04 AM

Just wondering about the progress of this project.
I started building a Gieseke Nobler last month and I want to replicate Bobs version.
I have the Top Flite plans as well as Steve Moons drawings.
These plans show a very different cowl. I don’t know which version I will use at this time.
Does anybody happen to know if Bob used the kit type cowl on any of his planes

Larry, Buttafucco Stunt Team

I didn't personally get to see any of his planes after 1984 but some of the early ones did have a cowling that more resembled the Top Flight (Aldrich Version) Kit than the later versions. I remember the one pictured at the start of this post. I don't remember an early one without the side vents but that was over 40 years ago and memories cloud and merge, so there may have been one. Your best source for later versions will be the Moon brothers but I must warn you that although they may have looked the same , Bob was constantly changing the plane in small ways and was such a craftsman that the "official" plane always looked like it was new. Bob's "version" could be any one of dozens.

If anybody in this hobby/sport deserves the respect of being imitated it is Bob.

Ken

Air Ministry . · « **Reply #80 on:** May 10, 2018, 10:40:35 PM »

Quote

This thread is great!
It has inspired me to build another Gieseke Nobler, replicating Bobs.

Im suffering the same inclinations .

Larry Fernandez · « **Reply #81 on:** May 22, 2018, 03:58:19 PM »

Quote from: Larry Fernandez on May 10, 2018, 01:29:04 AM

Just wondering about the progress of this project.
I started building a Gieseke Nobler last month and I want to replicate Bobs version.

Here is the wing, stab and elevator built up and covered.
I opted for the Big Jim engine crutch as its lighter and much more rigid.
I also decided to update the control system with a four inch bellcrank, carbon fiber push rods, ball links and updated control geometry.

How is the restoration of Mr. Giesekes Nobler coming along?

Larry, Buttafucco Stunt Team

proparc · « **Reply #82 on:** May 25, 2018, 02:56:22 PM »

What you guys are doing is an honor and a tribute to a great man. Keep up the good work!!

Will Hinton · « **Reply #83 on:** June 02, 2018, 02:32:39 PM »

I just have to comment on Bob as a person. I had the privilege of flying out at the circle west of AMA with him and a couple of others. Here was a national champion, a world champion, and one of the icons of the sport talking to an intermediate flyer just like we were equals!
There was not a sign of anything in his demeaner but pure humility and a people lover. We became very good friends over the years at the nats and I always felt like we had known each other forever, and I miss that companionship anytime I return to the nats. What a wonderful man God gave us to enjoy for a time.

Larry Fernandez · « **Reply #84 on:** November 24, 2020, 11:33:02 PM »

I know this is an old thread, but I took the Nobler off the wall ( after two years) and started the finishing process.
After looking at SEVERAL of pictures of Bobs Noblers I can’t really tell the color between the red and the white.
In some of the pictures it looks black, and in others it looks to be dark blue. Could those in the know tell me what
color to use.
As an aside, Bobs son Joe, sent me a section of Bobs painted wing, to match for color. Many thanks Joe.

Larry, Buttafucco Stunt Team

John Park · « **Reply #85 on:** November 25, 2020, 07:00:59 AM »

Quote from: Brett Buck on December 20, 2017, 09:57:08 PM

He flew pretty slow for a Nobler with a Fox, but not extraordinarily slow. You did sometimes wonder whether it would make it over the top or through the overhead 8s, but it wasn't outlandish. He was also a proponent of "using the shortest lines he could get away with".

Brett

I would have shown up on this thread years ago, but the document I wanted was buried in my archives and has only just resurfaced. It's a magazine-sized one-off called The Control-Line Aeromodeller, published by the British AeroModeller magazine some time around 1975, and it contained an interview with Bob which appears to have been conducted by the magazine itself - not, as was often the case, reprinted from one of the US mags.
On the subject of flying-speed, I quote verbatim: "I usually give away the wingover and the overhead eights, as the slow motor run will just not allow these to be flown properly. My competitors will say I give everything away with these slow motors however!"
There's a lot of other information concerning his set-up (presumably at the time of the 1974 World Champs), such as the fact that he was using muffler pressure, Fox Superfuel and a Top Flite 11x5 1/2" prop trimmed to 10 1/2".
Maybe the interview I'm referring to is well known, but if anybody wants a copy I'll be happy to scan it for them - just send me a PM.

Regards
John

Ken Culbertson · « **Reply #86 on:** November 25, 2020, 10:08:07 AM »

Quote from: John Park on November 25, 2020, 07:00:59 AM

"I usually give away the wingover and the overhead eights, as the slow motor run will just not allow these to be flown properly.
Regards
John

This is quite true. However what he was "giving away" most of us will never achieve. I have seen Bob patiently waiting for the plane to make it over the top with 3' of slack in the lines only to have the plane fly a perfectly straight arc and I have seen him on his back saving an overhead 8. The man was one of a kind. He knew how to make wind his friend.

Ken

Air Ministry . · « **Reply #87 on:** November 25, 2020, 08:01:45 PM »

" but if anybody wants a copy I'll be happy to scan it for them "

better to post it on here .

Brett Buck · « **Reply #88 on:** November 25, 2020, 08:41:04 PM »

Quote from: John Park on November 25, 2020, 07:00:59 AM

On the subject of flying-speed, I quote verbatim: "I usually give away the wingover and the overhead eights, as the slow motor run will just not allow these to be flown properly. My competitors will say I give everything away with these slow motors however!"

That's even funnier if you knew what he really meant. But I think I will keep that one to myself for now.

Brett

Chuck_Smith · « **Reply #89 on:** November 26, 2020, 06:08:08 AM »

I liked learning in this thread that one of the most famous stunt ships ever built was really a Frankenstein made up of the best parts. Or maybe it just kept evolving. Pretty cool.

Steve Dwyer · « **Reply #90 on:** November 26, 2020, 08:07:19 AM »

Chuck,

Here's some shots of the Gieseke nobler I was gifted a while back by Lyle, unfortunately, it was too far gone and could not be restored. Interesting it has the original BG colors. Building a Gieseke could become a project this winter, we've discussed this in the past.

Steve

Steve Dwyer · « **Reply #91 on:** November 26, 2020, 08:10:03 AM »

Additional view.

Al Ferraro · « **Reply #92 on:** November 26, 2020, 06:25:17 PM »

On the subject of flying-speed, I quote verbatim: "I usually give away the wingover and the overhead eights, as the slow motor run will just not allow these to be flown properly. My competitors will say I give everything away with these slow motors however!"

Regards
John
[/quote]
A good running Fox 35 in a Nobler will fly 5.3 - 5.2 lap times with 58’ lines and break into a two stroke and have plenty of power to do all the demanding maneuvers without any problem, and is a joy to fly.
Al

Ken Culbertson · « **Reply #93 on:** November 26, 2020, 06:34:45 PM »

Quote from: Al Ferraro on November 26, 2020, 06:25:17 PM

On the subject of flying-speed, I quote verbatim: "I usually give away the wingover and the overhead eights, as the slow motor run will just not allow these to be flown properly. My competitors will say I give everything away with these slow motors however!"

Regards
John

A good running Fox 35 in a Nobler will fly 5.3 - 5.2 lap times with 58’ lines and break into a two stroke and have plenty of power to do all the demanding maneuvers without any problem, and is a joy to fly.
Al

Did you ever see Bob fly one of his '70's Noblers? We didn't time laps much back then but I am willing to guess he flew around 5.6 to 5.8.

Ken

Brett Buck · « **Reply #94 on:** November 26, 2020, 07:03:17 PM »

Quote from: Ken Culbertson on November 26, 2020, 06:34:45 PM

Did you ever see Bob fly one of his '70's Noblers? We didn't time laps much back then but I am willing to guess he flew around 5.6 to 5.8.

Presumably it was the same in the early 80's when I first saw it, I think we got him around 5.5. It would have been a lot happier at 5.1-5.2, but this is Bear we are talking about, he had a plan and it was very successful for a long time.

Brett

Ken Culbertson · « **Reply #95 on:** November 26, 2020, 09:32:45 PM »

Quote from: Brett Buck on November 26, 2020, 07:03:17 PM

Presumably it was the same in the early 80's when I first saw it, I think we got him around 5.5. It would have been a lot happier at 5.1-5.2, but this is Bear we are talking about, he had a plan and it was very successful for a long time.

Brett

I flew with him pre-bear but from what I hear from those in our group that did he was a bit faster with the Bear but still slow. His planes were disgustingly light.

Ken

Brett Buck · « **Reply #96 on:** November 26, 2020, 09:37:55 PM »

Quote from: Ken Culbertson on November 26, 2020, 09:32:45 PM

I flew with him pre-bear but from what I hear from those in our group that did he was a bit faster with the Bear but still slow.

Not the airplane, the man himself. Fox 35 Gieske Nobler, about 1981.

On the topic of the Bear, the airplane, he had one what was 47 ounces with a PA65. At the 2003 NATs, that just made everything worse, it would just nearly come to a stop when it pointed the nose into the wind.

Brett

Ken Culbertson · « **Reply #97 on:** November 26, 2020, 10:29:43 PM »

Quote from: Brett Buck on November 26, 2020, 09:37:55 PM

Not the airplane, the man himself. Fox 35 Gieske Nobler, about 1981.

On the topic of the Bear, the airplane, he had one what was 47 ounces with a PA65. At the 2003 NATs, that just made everything worse, it would just nearly come to a stop when it pointed the nose into the wind.

Brett

I am pretty sure that I have seen that one. Doug Moon had it out last week, it has "03" on the inboard tip. So light you have to use tie downs when it is in the pits.

I last flew with Bob somewhere between 81 and 82 so our time frames overlap. At that point he still had not built his first Bear. Locally some were running 46+ motors, Rabe, Pilgrim, McMillen but most of us were still using .35s. Mostly the OS35s. Not Bob. It was a Fox 35 period and the only pipe around was the one Bob was smoking.

How times have changed - Ken

Doug Moon · « **Reply #98 on:** November 26, 2020, 11:14:25 PM »

Yes I had the 03 plane out this weekend. I haven't flown it in a long while, too busy screwing around with my latest troublesome animal. I have a PA 75 in the Bear now. It's really fun to fly that plane. I run a 65 2 bladed prop on it and it just cruises around. It will carve out rounds like a knife through butter. The round maneuver is always seen as an easy one to get top points on but it can be a bit deceiving at first when you are learning to get all of those points. The book shows the plane instantly into the shape from level lap. It can almost look like a jerking move at entry. You cant just lazily enter that first round or the shape is off. This plane will go from level to the shape with a snap if the wrist and it never gets upset. It instantly locks in on 2 lines with even pull all the way around. You can really focus on the shape and really carve out a nice perfect circle. It's a lot of fun to feel that on the end of the lines. It also lands perfectly. I do his little trick he told me about years ago and it works every time. That thing will stick to the ground and settle right in for a short roll. It's great to have that model and I am really so blessed and thankful I able to have such a beautiful piece of our stunt history. I think his last 35 sized plane is still around as well but I have not seen it at our field. I watched him fly that one when he was getting ready for VSC and it was really great to see him work through patterns with that plane. His skill really shined when "flying" the small plane. He didn't just point and shoot with an overpowered rig. He really "flew" those smaller underpowered planes.

Scott Richlen · « **Reply #99 on:** November 27, 2020, 03:12:36 PM »

Many years ago I had a business trip to Indianpolis and had some free time, so I decided to visit Jack Sheeks Hobby Shop. He had one of Bob Gieske's Noblers, but it was the one with an ST-46. It might have been a bit bigger than a regular Nobler - sort of looked like a Nobler on steroids.