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Author Topic: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......  (Read 4685 times)

Offline Russ Danneman

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SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« on: February 06, 2010, 06:57:51 PM »
FOR NEXT PLANE. WANTING CLASSIC DESIGN PLANE. BEST SUITED FOR THE "CLASSIC FOX 35 STUNT"!YES IT DOES SAY FOX 35.(LOL)THIS WILL BE A WEEKENDER, SCHOOLYARD FLYER, NO COMPETION. SO LET'S HEAR 'UM GUY'S. THANKS RUSS
FLY LOW FLY FAST  RISKY BUSINESS

Offline Russell Shaffer

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #1 on: February 06, 2010, 07:15:57 PM »
Flite Streak.  You can get plans from Pat King and they fly great with a Fox.  They are strong and easy to build and repair.  Someone, not me, who is skilled, can do a complete pattern.  I just have lots of fun. 
Russell Shaffer
Klamath Falls, Oregon
Just North of the California border

Offline Dennis Moritz

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #2 on: February 06, 2010, 07:55:43 PM »
Twister. If you're interested in something with flaps. Easy to build. Can be a competitive in Intermediate. I know one talent who made it into expert flying a Twister with a Fox35. In some ways Twisters are easier than a flite Streaks to build from plans. No hollowed out leading edge. If you decide to do a Twister look into the Fancher modifications. They will improve the flight characteristics of the plane without adding much complexity. The Brodak Streak is virtually identical aerodynamically to the Flite Streak, but uses a convention leading edge and ribs. Better choice as a builder, either from a kit or plans. IMHO.

Offline Russell Shaffer

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #3 on: February 06, 2010, 08:09:28 PM »
I have been building my Flite Streaks with a Twister type wing.  It is pretty easy to modify the ribs to take a 1/2 square LE and just use 1/4 square for the spars.  It looks just like a Twister wing, only smaller. 
Russell Shaffer
Klamath Falls, Oregon
Just North of the California border

Offline Brett Buck

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2010, 08:12:52 PM »
FOR NEXT PLANE. WANTING CLASSIC DESIGN PLANE. BEST SUITED FOR THE "CLASSIC FOX 35 STUNT"!YES IT DOES SAY FOX 35.(LOL)THIS WILL BE A WEEKENDER, SCHOOLYARD FLYER, NO COMPETION. SO LET'S HEAR 'UM GUY'S. THANKS RUSS

   Unless you at least go for the "bypass stuffer mod", I would avoid any profile model. The chances of getting a decent engine run, even for sport flying, with a stock motor on a profile is so low it is not worth the effort. With sufficient modifications it will be OK, but then you are talking a a$200 motor, and for that kind of money, you can do a lot better and get a spare.

      So, with a stock Fox, I would suggest a simple full-fuse airplane - like the Oriental. Flies great, pretty easy to build (no more difficult than a profile), the right size since it was designed for a Fox, and good engine runs with the full-fuselage.

      Brett

Offline LARRY RICE

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2010, 08:16:41 PM »
Both the Fokker D VII and the SPAD-7 from Black Hawk Models were designer for the Fox .35 engine.

Offline Steve Helmick

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2010, 09:59:14 PM »
Smoothie or Squaw. Well, depends...I don't think the Squaw is legal in Oregon, in case you live there.  :-[ Steve
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Offline Warren Leadbeatter

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2010, 10:20:27 PM »
For a Fox 35 you can't go past the old trusty 57 Nobler.  How much more Classic can you get than that?

Warren Leadbeatter
Port Stephens, Australia
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Offline Glenn (Gravitywell) Reach

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2010, 10:34:51 PM »
I had a Squaw (1st plans built plane) on a McCoy .29 and that was overpowered.  Maybe go up to a Cheif.  Thats a nice Fox .35 like plane. H^^  And Steve....I will be getting back to work on that Vector soon....I promise! n~
Glenn Reach
Westlock, Alberta
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Offline Dennis Moritz

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #9 on: February 07, 2010, 12:27:44 AM »
Twister. Fox 35. Or one of the Streaks. Mike Palko ran a stock Twister powered by a stock Fox 35 all the way into Expert. Run the Fox a bit hard, don't expect a 4x2 break, that way it'll power a Flite Streak fine. The dreaded profile vibes, much less of an issue. Get the tank to feed similarly upright and inverted. Don't use Superfuel. Run Powermaster, if you can find it, 22% (50/50) 5%, 10%. Use a good plug. A broken in Fox will work well on a profile if you don't drive yourself crazy trying to get a good 2/4 break. In my club there are over a dozen planes that fit the description. Flite Streaks, Busters, Shoestrings, Ringmasters. Grungy Foxes powering all of them. Full bodied planes are a challenge. Harder to build than a profile. Lots more to get right.

You might want to try the Carl Goldberg knockoff Brodak kits or get plans for those planes. They all fly well. Fox power will work with them. Simple to build. Busters use a non-tapered wing. Very easy to build. Mine does all the tricks in the pattern no problem. If I could get it to land without flipping over, I'd try it in classic. Also need to figure out how to hold more than 3.25 ounces of fuel on the short nose. Mine is way overpowered running a Tower 40 screaming leaned out. Other club members use foxes, their Busters, Shoestrings, Cosmic Winds, Ringmaster etc. work reliably as sport planes. Fun knock around planes.

Offline Alan Buck

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #10 on: February 07, 2010, 06:26:26 AM »
Russ you have to pick from. Like a Cavalier, Magician,FancyPants,Olympic and more too pick from. I like a I-Beams ARES, ATOM,ARGUS,COBRA.
ALAN E BUCK

Offline EddyR

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #11 on: February 07, 2010, 06:44:24 AM »
Fox= Fangy Pants
Locust NC 40 miles from the Huntersville field

Offline Russ Danneman

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #12 on: February 07, 2010, 07:40:19 AM »
Thanks for input so far.always have flown OS engines in the past . heard the negatives about Fox's.seems you love um or hate um. i want to give the MADE IN USA a shot. either profile or built up is ok with me. seems that most responses say profile fuse ok .always heard too much vibration from Fox for profiles.thanks again .keep em coming. rd
FLY LOW FLY FAST  RISKY BUSINESS

Offline Terrence Durrill

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #13 on: February 07, 2010, 10:55:46 AM »
If you are a weekend, schoolyard type guy.....and don't fly every weekend......want something fairly easy to build that is a great sport flier, build the Sterling S-1 Ringmaster.  I know a lot of people here will disagree, however, I started C/L in 1953 and built my first S-1 Ringmaster in 1955.  Since then, I have always had at least one flyable Ringmaster in my shop.  I currently have two S-1's flying, one with a 1955 Fox .29 stunt and the other with a 1960's era Fox .35.  This  .35 powered S-1 is the best flying Ringmaster I have ever had.  It was built in 1975, covered with parachute nylon and painted yellow with red trim in the pattern shown on the kit box.  I have been a schoolyard sportflier since my last competition in 1968.  I wouldn't be without my Ringmaster/Fox .35 combo......great little airplane........My thanks to Matt Kania and Duke Fox.......TDurrill   H^^

Offline W.D. Roland

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #14 on: February 07, 2010, 03:16:12 PM »
Steve Helmick got it right #^

If you make the fuel tank removable you will be happier than I am....... HB~> HB~>
David Roland
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Offline FLOYD CARTER

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #15 on: February 07, 2010, 04:24:50 PM »
Call it "Duke's Revenge"

(not applicable if you use an OS engine)

Floyd
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Offline Brett Buck

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #16 on: February 07, 2010, 07:15:28 PM »
If you are a weekend, schoolyard type guy.....and don't fly every weekend......want something fairly easy to build that is a great sport flier, build the Sterling S-1 Ringmaster.  I know a lot of people here will disagree, however, I started C/L in 1953 and built my first S-1 Ringmaster in 1955. 

   Obviously I don't agree, but with some care I suppose it could be made to work on some level. Bypass stuffer mod is mandatory, but cheap and easy. There's plenty of good information about Fox break-in, follow it to the letter.

     If anyone does want to do it, dig up the Ringmaster control setup recommendations from the SSW archives. Nothing, repeat, nothing, it more important to making the Ringmaster fly well is to use a much slower control system. It needs to be configured to provide about +-20 degrees elevator movement for a full hand motion. You can do it with a very narrow handle spacing, but much better, with a very slow control setup in the airplane. That means pretty short pushrod arm on the bellcrank, and a long elevator horn. Any more than about 20 degrees is pointless and will just cause a stall the instant you try to do almost anything.

    The second and almost as important is to keep the nose on the airplane. Particularly with a Fox. Throw away the stock luan plywood doublers, make new ones from 3/32 hard ply, and make them go back to at least halfway back on the wing. While you are tossing things, throw away the stock motor mounts and replace them with mounts that go back almost to the wing LE. Then throw away the stock plywood wing joiner and make a "T" joiner from hard 1/8 ply. Throw away the bellcrank platform, and replace it with hard ply and reinforce it making sure to tie it into the spar and the ribs inboard of the mount. Throw away the elevator horn, too, make it longer out of 3/32 hard ply with several bushed holes to give the desired reduced control movement with some adjustment ability. Use at least a 3" bellcrank, and a 3.5 or 4" won't hurt anything. Lighten the airplane up with replacement ribs and (mostly cosmetic) spar. Hollow out the leading edge starting on the second open rib bay - don't do it on the first open bay or there's a good chance that it will fold right next to the rib where the sheeting ends. Probably not with the Fox but you don't want to build in a known weakness. Put the leadouts closer together, about 1" apart, centered on a point ~2.5" from the LE. You could make them adjustable but the ideal position doesn't vary too much. Start with about .015x56 lines, a 10-6 wood prop, CG at about 1" from the LE. Don't be afraid to cut the lines down a foot at a time if it seems a little floaty at times.

     I think the frustration factor will get to you at some point, which is why I recommend something different for a Fox.  Just doing a stock kit airplane with a 15FP, Veco 19bb, 25LA, etc will fly far better than anything you can do using a Fox, but it doesn't meet the criteria.

    Brett

Offline RandySmith

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #17 on: February 07, 2010, 11:26:16 PM »
FOR NEXT PLANE. WANTING CLASSIC DESIGN PLANE. BEST SUITED FOR THE "CLASSIC FOX 35 STUNT"!YES IT DOES SAY FOX 35.(LOL)THIS WILL BE A WEEKENDER, SCHOOLYARD FLYER, NO COMPETION. SO LET'S HEAR 'UM GUY'S. THANKS RUSS

Wewage's  Vulcan  or Ares are both great planes for the FOX 35

You may also look at the Dolphin

I have seen many examples of the above FLy great  with the stock FOX 35

Regards
Randy

Offline Dennis Moritz

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #18 on: February 08, 2010, 11:19:06 AM »
Bellow are two Fox 35 (unmodified) powered Ringmaster's flown by the Philly Flyers. We call Jack Weston's the winningest Ringmaster ever. The list of winnings and placings are written in with magic marker over the yellow panel. Crashed and repaired and patched many times by various club members. It started out pretty light. Now a porky 38 ounces. It has placed as high as 2nd in Old Time at Brodak more than once. Finished in third a few times as well. It has won many local meets. Dan Banjok's Ringer has placed as high as 2nd (or was it third?) in Expert Classic at the B Bash (I think so...) I believe Dan has flown that Ringer to wins in Expert Profile and Classic at local meets. Both planes are Sterling originals S1s. Another member of our club flew Danny's Ringmaster to 2nd a few times in Intermediate Profile and Classic at Brodak. Got booted up to Advanced. As I stated earlier, there are many more profiles powered by stock Fox 35s in our club. We get them to work.

Offline catdaddy

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #19 on: February 08, 2010, 11:30:31 AM »
I believe Joe Gilbert has kicked alot of A** with a Fox 35 powered Ringmaster.
Fox 35s aren't for everyone but there are some people that know how to make them work even without the bypass mod.
regards,
Rick"catdaddy"Blankenship

Offline Ward Van Duzer

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #20 on: February 08, 2010, 12:01:39 PM »
I'm on Eddies team...The Fancy Pants! Full fuselage and upright engine will eliminate burps and most vibration. It is a little smaller than most "Fox .35 size" planes which will leave you with a little power to spare. For a while they flew bunches of these at Huntersville and all of them worked!

I still want one, but I've got to finish my Guided Star, Gieseke Nobler and Double Cross first!   :P

W.
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Offline Jim Kraft

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #21 on: February 08, 2010, 12:14:40 PM »
One thing I have found is that the Ring has such a deep front end, and fairly short, that Fox 35's run pretty well on them. I also campagined a Fox 35 powered Magician for a few years that flew pretty well. I did do the bypass trick on that one though. There are other engines that will do as good or better job than a Fox or McCoy, but they just arn't as much fun. That is unless you have a good McCoy 40 on a Magician. That is a real treat.
Jim Kraft

Offline john e. holliday

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #22 on: February 08, 2010, 04:53:51 PM »
There are two real good choices made already for an up right engine set up.  They were the Fancy Pants and the Smoothie.  Makes engine starting and setting mucho easier and both planes are great flyers.  If you don't mind turning the plane over for starting the Oriental is a great choice.  Super simple construction and will fly the pants off any other plane around.  Of course in reality they all fly great in the right hands.  It you that makes the choice on what you like.  I love Fox Stunt .35's.  Have never figured what the burp thing is as my planes, profile and built up fly the same.  They have a lousy pilot.   LL~ LL~
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Offline Bryan Higgins

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #23 on: February 15, 2010, 09:59:30 PM »
Hello Russ

A great looking Classic the P-40 Blackhawk Berkley kit plan.
It is easy to build with the straight wing and is very light.  Perfect for
the Fox.35 (Classic Legal)  But also just a great plane to fly around on
the weekends.

Bryan H. H^^
Bryan R higgins Jr.
Arvada,Colorado
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Offline Garf

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #24 on: February 16, 2010, 10:00:32 AM »
I have a Fox 35 I built up using an early shallow bypass case and a McCoy 35 crank. It seems to have more power than a stock fox and no sign of a burp.

Offline Alan Buck

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #25 on: February 17, 2010, 07:36:30 AM »
HI, Russ with all the suggestion's what will be your next pick for your weekend warrior. Thanks
ALAN E BUCK

Offline Russ Danneman

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #26 on: February 17, 2010, 10:04:29 AM »
well.... i have got a grunged up fox35 that runs like a charm that i am going to try on a smoothie profile that i bought awhile back not necessarily for the fox but i am going to give it a try to see what the fox does on a profile. and i have a nib fox35 that i am going to work on breaking in properly and was thinking about the fancy pants .it seems to get hi marks from alot of people but i guess even at my age i am still a little superficial and still think looks matter(lol). i just cant get by the boxy front fuse on the pants! but  i still want to try something with built up fuse.thinking maybe an oriental? not sure yet. thanks to everyone for input and help you guys are great! rd
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Offline Mark Scarborough

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #27 on: February 17, 2010, 11:24:45 AM »
I agree with the full fuselage type, mainly the Oriental.  H^^
This is IMHO the best suggestion here!
simple build, simple to trim, and a great flying airplane. Fox 35 works great asssuming reasonable weight. There are kits, and plans available, not to mention and ARC, ( oh wait, I said I wanst going to mention the ARC)

Oriental is a solid airplane
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Offline Randy Cuberly

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #28 on: February 17, 2010, 12:44:13 PM »
Russ,
For Heavens sake (and yours), listen to Brett.  He didn't make any of the stuff about the Fox sidewinder burp up.  It's very common and will likely plague you on any sidewinder setup.
I don't want to hear about all the wonderful success that various people have with stock Foxes...I simply don't believe it!  Too much Vibration and porting problems for a wimpy profile.  Believe me I've seen all the problems with Foxes on profile (as I'm sure Brett has).
His advice is the best....'nuff said.
Incidentally, Randy smith can provide you with a Fox that runs smooth and perfect....but then it's really cheating to call a $250.00 engine a Fox.
However if you must put one on a profile that's the best choice.
Sorta begs the question why in the world would you want to.

Randy C.
Randy Cuberly
Tucson, AZ

Dwayne

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Re: SUGGESTION'S WANTED......
« Reply #29 on: February 17, 2010, 01:00:22 PM »
Both the Fokker D VII and the SPAD-7 from Black Hawk Models were designer for the Fox .35 engine.

I had no idea Blackhawk was kitting these, very cool.  y1 y1 #^


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