Stupidist Trainer ?

[M Spencer]

http://www.outerzone.co.uk/plan_files_02/2631/Gee-Bee_CL.pdf



Could see this as an ' experts ' racing event at Nats .
Anybody taking it seriously could be thrown in the river .

Milss .75s or baby bees on 8x4 props & 30 odd ft. ( a std. for something length ) lines .
dont want to make it too easy , & the ten year olds'd have to be in with a chance to show the rest up .



anyone who hasnt fallen over lauging , if over 20 , by the end of the race , is for it .

[wwwarbird]

 Huh? It's really no different than any basic sheet wing trainer, just looks cooler than most.

[Terry Caron]

No, no Matt - you misunderstood!
Remember - the Gee Bee R-1 was a killer.
This is a TRAINER for Gee Bee pilots!   

Yeah, silly but cool.

Terry

[Dave_Trible]

I don't know anything about the Mills but the plane looks to have all the right basics- and yes looks neat.  I prefer trainers that are more like stunt trainers with thicker wings and lighter wing loading.  They'll fly slower and groove more easily.  The risk is of course more damage on impact.  I saw the Minor brothers teaching kids to fly on a slowed down combat wing- had it going on well.  But this Gee Bee will work.  

Dave

[john e. holliday]

I have lost count of how many people I have taught with the old Ringmaster with the old Fox .35 set just lean enough to get air borne.   But then I soloed my Brother-in-law on a 1/2A Hacker combat plane.  A couple of months later he flew my Bi-Slob and had a grin from ear to ear.

[Jim Carter]

  Well, I never!!!   Matt .... you have now officially hurt my feelings!!    It is interesting that you would chose this one model out of the hundreds of trainers to write about!!    I built one of these specifically for the Cox Reed Speed Contest and I've been waiting for the right day and some helpers so I can video it in-flight as per the rules or the contest  .  I can say, for the purposes of practice flights, it flies just fine and although I have a stock Tee Dee .049 on it, it's not unrealistic to think that my 8 and 10 year old granddaughters should be able to handle 15 laps once they learn the basics  !!

(Matt, I'm not really upset .... just funnin' but it was a fun project to build.  Based upon it's characteristics, I've even given thought to scaling it up a bit for say a 25-35 size, but it may be one of those "someday fun projects!)

Jim Carter

[M Spencer]

BRAVO. 

Should be positively meanacing with a tee Dee . 

Must admit to some ' tounge in cheek ' as to the Title . Though maybe theres tales of attack ( the pilot ) aeroplanes and practising Crashes .

Had a ' bad day ' once or twice training . On Return, to how did it go , the answer was " We practised all the crashes .
Another occasion Id told the trainee to ' Put Them There ' , ( my Jandles ) " Now Stand Beteen Them " ( to avoid the stunt lines ) .
Second Lap it met Crankshaft to Steel Goal Post pole , manadged to break the inner wing and Fuse. too , a mini goodyear- OS 10 .
Was tight at BDC after that and wouldnt run again untill we' striped & reassembled it .

RIGHT , where were we .

We possitively DEMAND to see the Video of the Flight , HERE - PLEASE . ( or a link ) .

Might Stir something up .Open Class Maelstrom Gee Bee ! 

Must Pull the drawaing out & get cracking ! The Olde Mills p75 will be init .
Early 70s a squeeze bottle on the outer wing of a Modelair GNAT got it airbourne for more than twenty minutes , I think half full
after the first flight of an half hour or more . The initial  ( Full weight ) flight was Nose Up untill ten minutes of fuel had burnt off .
So limited flight envelope there . Lightened up a bit it gained some performance. Almost .
Three or four Torbayites mastered basic control in a few flights . So thinking fitting a streame would likewise tame most planes
and makes observation and docility appropriate to the task .

Have you got a stop watch , and what lines are you trying . ?

[John Park]

Ray Malmstrom was an absolute LEGEND!  His idea of model flying was that it should be, first and foremost, fun - and to this end he produced some truly delightful designs, all small and therefore virtually crashproof.  Just go to Outerzone and search on 'Malmstrom', and you'll see what I mean.  'Saucy Satellite' puts the Gee Bee in the shade for sheer wackiness, even if it may have been a bit of a handful to fly: but if you ever feel like dabbling in little rubber-powered free-flight models made of 1/32" sheet, try 'Long John' - if I can't get 75 seconds out of mine on a calm day, I'm not trying!

Regards
John

[Dane Martin]

Well, I never!!!   Matt .... you have now officially hurt my feelings!!    It is interesting that you would chose this one model out of the hundreds of trainers to write about!!    I built one of these specifically for the Cox Reed Speed Contest and I've been waiting for the right day and some helpers so I can video it in-flight as per the rules or the contest  .  I can say, for the purposes of practice flights, it flies just fine and although I have a stock Tee Dee .049 on it, it's not unrealistic to think that my 8 and 10 year old granddaughters should be able to handle 15 laps once they learn the basics  !!

(Matt, I'm not really upset .... just funnin' but it was a fun project to build.  Based upon it's characteristics, I've even given thought to scaling it up a bit for say a 25-35 size, but it may be one of those "someday fun projects!)

Jim Carter

Carter, that's amazing! How could i have guessed that you would be the one guy who still has one of these flying? Lol

[john e. holliday]

Remember the early years when someone promoted Goodyear Racing.  I competed with Gee Bee because it was different and almost as fast as the Folkerts.   

[Jim Carter]

Carter, that's amazing! How could i have guessed that you would be the one guy who still has one of these flying? Lol

L.O.L.!!  Bro. Dane wouldn't you know it!!  It's almost like he was looking at my stash of planes in my workshop!!  r.o.t.f.l.!!  What a hoot!!   

[MikeyPratt]

Hi Jim,
Awesome!! That is really cute and I bet it's a handful, I'm thinking about a .15 size would be really fun.

Later,
Mikey

[George]

Looking over the plans and text, it really was a basic trainer. The Mills .75 (replicas) are not powerful engines but they are fun engines. The text refers to a 6x4, 6x6, or 7x4 prop which are for diesels of that size (.75cc = .045ci), and 20'-22' "thread" (I'm guessing Dacron) lines. Note also the elevator limiter used for the first few flights.

It looks like a fun plane with that power. With a TD .049-.051 it can be anywhere between LYAO and serious.

NICE FIND!   

George

PS. I downloaded the plans from Outerzone. 

[M Spencer]

Heading was a stab in the dark , as the Library Computer was about to jump ship . Nevertheless . . . 

The Folkerts is similar in being an opposite extreme , perhaps. Figure this one'd go o.k. with a 21/29 RV abc .



Supposed to have an old Torpedo 15, I think . Plan is on Hipocket Via. google pics .

WHY scale it Up for a 29 or 35 Jim , It'd fit in as it is ! .

[John Park]

I don't know about the replicas, but the original Mills .75 was the ultimate beginner's engine - incredibly easy to start (for a diesel, that is), adequately powerful for the kind of kit trainer you could buy in England in the mid-1950s (KeilKraft Champ, Jasco Trojan etc.) and so well-made that it was impossible to wear out.  I have one from about 1955 that has goodness knows how many hours on it, and it has as much compression as it ever had.  Just for fun, I'm building a KeilKraft Champ for it - 7x4 prop., 30ft. Terylene (i.e. Dacron) lines - to get one of my childhood friends back into C/L.  He hasn't held a handle for 55 years, and will appreciate something un-threatening and crashproof!

Regards
John

[john e. holliday]

Heading was a stab in the dark , as the Library Computer was about to jump ship . Nevertheless . . . 

The Folkerts is similar in being an opposite extreme , perhaps. Figure this one'd go o.k. with a 21/29 RV abc .



Supposed to have an old Torpedo 15, I think . Plan is on Hipocket Via. google pics .

WHY scale it Up for a 29 or 35 Jim , It'd fit in as it is ! .

 

Back then this was the plane to have, especially with the new Tee Dee .15 that had just hit the market.   

[Jim Carter]

Hi Jim,
Awesome!! That is really cute and I bet it's a handful, I'm thinking about a .15 size would be really fun.

Later,
Mikey

Hi Mike!  Thanks for the kind words.  Actually it's pretty easy to handle.  I agree, with the idea of scaling up a notch or two but that's on my "one o' these days" list!   

Jim

[Clancy Arnold]

Request for comments.
would a cox .049 dual bypass reed valve fly this plane?  Recommended prop to use?

I am thinking it would be fun to build one this winter.
Clancy

[M Spencer]

No wocking furries , Clancy .
We used to try baby bees on no nitro & they needed a 6 x 4 , but on 10 % they should swing a 8 x 4,
which is what they use on the ' Texaco ' , Im Told . The DUAL BYPASS . So a single bypass .049'd fly it.

The Baby Bee is the American Version of the Mills p.75 !

As a ' trainer ' motor the Mills is fine for flying on Vacant Lots ( or bombsites ) .Noise Complaints would indicate a phyciatric condition .
They make a muted muttering / chuntering inaudable over a turned down television ( the opiate of the masses ) set .

Hurtling round on 20 ft. lines , it'd keep them tight . Im just wondering how it'll go on 32'6 or whatever which length Mouse or 1/2A T/R were .
We shall see, no doubt.

Some of the replicer mills have a ' indeferant ' reputation or manufacturing standards .
The Doonsides good but a notch heavier . The IRVINE is the go as far as Racing is concerned .

Seeing a Irvine 1.3 tow a Taipan Trainer at about 80 mph was a laugh / wake up .
Around 1950 a Mills 1.3 on a 8 x 8 in a ' Nippy ' ? set a 88 mph record ( a speed plane ) .
Sonds like some of the Indian Mills fall to bits or fell together , but theyre cheap .
The Irvine 1.3 is single ball race, dunno on the .75 but think maybe.