Stunt Judging

[Jerry Leuty]

             I did some stunt judging way back in the mid 70s with the Fort Worth Flying Aces. It was mainly a combat club in those days but also had some scale, rat racers, and stunt. We were all young and it was alot of fun to tie some streamers on and do some combat. Now we are mostly slowed way down and fly 55 on the circle. I will probably never be any more than an Intermediate pilot at best. But I do enjoy this stuff. I really do enjoy judging stunt. I have read Stuka Stunts tips on flying the pattern and I know what to look for. But what I want to do is to attend a stunt judging clinic and pick up on some tips that I know I am missing. Judging Beginner and Intermediate is easy enough but when it comes to judging the more Advanced and Expert classes it gets a whole lot more serious. I am not affected by the halo effect but if an Expert questions me on a particular score I want to be able to give a sound answer other than 'I didn't think that it looked round enough' or what ever. So I have said all of that to ask this; is there a stunt judging clinic held anywhere in the USA that I can attend and get certified?

Jerry R. Leuty 
AMA 61539

[Howard Rush]

In the past, I think anybody could attend the Nats judge training.  Ask Paul Walker or Mark Overmier about this year's. 

I am a rookie judge.  I attended Don McClave's judging clinic in Portland in April and thought it was really valuable. 

There ain't no certification.  If you volunteer to judge somewhere, you will be welcomed and get some good on-the-job (not in the British sense) training.

[Steve Helmick]

I talked to a contest's CD, brought my own clipboard and pen, and dipped into the contest's supply of score sheets. Then I went and stood behind the official judges...first time was Paul Walker and Bob Parker, if memory serves. I did that for about a year, and toted the official score sheets to the tabulation table. There was also a Judging Clinic in Portland that year, but I don't recall what year it was. I was thinking that judging would help my flying. It can't possibly hurt, but nobody sees any evidence that it's helped! My experience has been that a lot of folks do much the same mistakes, and I followed their lead. Maybe the same physical infirmity...old age! 

Beginner and Intermediate are way more work to Judge than Advanced and Expert! Lots of weird stuff happening there, so you really have to know all the fine points of the rules. Thankfully, the elimination of Pattern Points really has simplified this, based on three contests (in 5 events I think) I've Judged at since the rule change.

I believe that a very useful "Judging Clinic" could be done online, with folks just posting the mistakes they often see on the sequence of maneuvers. Not one of these tricks is easy to do perfectly, but the common errors are easy enough to list. Verbal descriptions of the errors may be a bit of a challenge, so you might want to type them up in WordPad or Word and copy and paste the text into a post.  Instead of posting all the tricks together, it would be best to discuss each maneuver individually...and come to think of it, that's been done, a few years ago. Maybe a search would find it in the archives. I'm not even sure what forum it was on...let's do it again!    Steve

[john e. holliday]

Judging is another way to learn the pattern.  But, the perspective from the center is different than from where the judges stand.  Alan Brickhaus really brought that out at the windy session in Springfield Mo. 

If you are still in the Fort Worth area you have some great people there that can help.  I hope they speak up on the thread.  Especially the DMAA group.  I know it a long way from Fort Worth to Hobby Park, but, say once a month would probably be worth the trip. 

You could do like James Mills did and have somebody come to your area and do a clinic.  We had Big Art in Topeka Ks. one year for two days.  Have fun,  DOC Holliday

[Jim Thomerson]

If you are going to judge, you need to reread the rule book.  You will be surprised at how much you have forgotten/didn't know, etc. about the rules. 

[dale gleason]

At this weekend's Dallas contest we had a few questions that had to be addressed, pretty well handled by knowledgeable judges and even the flyers themselves.
 Randi Gifford is a breath of fresh air, she's open to questions about her judging, seeks the answers, and applies them. Just getting interested people like Jerry together to talk out the questions/rules is probably a big step. If you are at a club meeting and there are other diciplines represented there, others not interested in stunt judging might get bored. A get-together just to hash out stunt judging would be great, out on Don's patio with an ice chest of cold ones....
John Ashford is known to spend some time in the regs, and he has given seminars where he's learned a lot..... seminars, now there's a thought.....
There are two facets to judging toy airplanes on strings, the scoring of the manoeuvers themselves, and the decision making when something weird occurs.
I respect judges who, when confronted with a question, can say they honestly don't know, but then say let's go to the book and find out. If you're standing in the hot sun in 100 degree heat, and the next flyer is ready to go, a little knowledge of where stuff is located in the books can expedite the decision making process,
Example:
A flyer's plane touches the ground on the bottom of an hourglass and then continues the pattern, quick, who ya' gonna' call?
Joe Bowman, that's who, he's the Tom Watson of Stunt.

  I'm sure this clears up Jerry's query...he is a very good stunt judge already, if ya' ask me.....dg

[Bob Reeves]

Might be a bit far to travel but we will be holding judging clinics here in Tulsa sometime before our September contest. Exact dates have not been set yet would guess first to middle of September as our contest is the last weekend. If interested I'll be happy to keep you updated as we get things finalized.

[Jerry Leuty]

            Bob, I like Tulsa and it is a nice trip from FTW. In deed let me know when you are holding the clinic and we will be glad to attend. I keep wondering why it is with the human factor given in stunt judging and as critical judging can be for some competitors why our SIG does not offer a weekend clinic that certifies judges. I realize that our SIG is a rather small group in comparison with the rest of the modeling industry but all any real license or certification really means is someone has satisified the requirements of another group of individuals. Your doctor was trained by humans, tested by humans, so they can diagnose our human ailments. And then again this is just an enjoyable hobby/sport and is not to be taken too litterally. BTW, I would be interested in obtaining a new rule book on PA for CLPA.

JRL

[Bradley Walker]

Bob,  might this be a good venue to discuss (perhaps even test) alternate judging strategies?

[Jim Thomerson]

The rule book can be downloaded from the AMA website.