Source for control horns

[Warren Wagner]

Hey gang,

Sourcing materials for this hobby is becoming difficult.  Where have you guy been buying your good quality control horns?  Okie and RSM have dried up, and Brodak's don't have the style that I prefer.

What I'm looking for, is the flap horn with the small dog-leg in it, and the elevator horn that is slotted for adjustments and also has the dog-leg to avoid removing too much material from the stab.   I will be using ball links, but it doesn't matter if the holes are threaded or not, and I'm looking for 3/32" diameter wire.

Any help will be appreciated.

TIA

Cheers.

Warren Wagner

[Brent Williams]

I am gearing up to sell control horns.  Here's a sneak peek.
They will be laser cut from .063" 4130 chrome-moly.

[Ken Culbertson]

Hey gang,

Sourcing materials for this hobby is becoming difficult.  Where have you guy been buying your good quality control horns?  Okie and RSM have dried up, and Brodak's don't have the style that I prefer.

What I'm looking for, is the flap horn with the small dog-leg in it, and the elevator horn that is slotted for adjustments and also has the dog-leg to avoid removing too much material from the stab.   I will be using ball links, but it doesn't matter if the holes are threaded or not, and I'm looking for 3/32" diameter wire.

Any help will be appreciated.

TIA

Cheers.

Warren Wagner

I just got off the phone with Russel at Okie.  He is fully stocked with horns, bellcranks lines, balsa, etc.

Ken

 

[George Grossardt]

I just got off the phone with Russel at Okie.  He is fully stocked with horns, bellcranks lines, balsa, etc.

Ken

 

Is it April 1?  I’m beginning to think Okie Air is just a code word for Area 51. 

[Ken Culbertson]

Is it April 1?  I’m beginning to think Okie Air is just a code word for Area 51. 

I had 4 orders last year, two last month.  All arrived on time.  Perhaps he just responds better to people who don't run him down in public.

ken

[George Grossardt]

I had 4 orders last year, two last month.  All arrived on time.  Perhaps he just responds better to people who don't run him down in public.

ken

Ken,

I called and left messages as well as sent emails for six months or more.  No response from him at all.  The public call out happened after giving him a more than fair chance to respond. 

I am happy Okie has worked for you. I’d love to give him another chance.

George

[Dan McEntee]

I had 4 orders last year, two last month.  All arrived on time.  Perhaps he just responds better to people who don't run him down in public.

ken

   He might be, but he shouldn't be.  These people were customers. They gave him their hard earned money, cash, E Pluribus Unum, and were not getting what they ordered and could not get any communications from him. We are talking months in some cases. That is NOT the way to do business, especially after taking over from Tom Morris with the impeccable way he ran his operation before turning it over to Okie. Those are pretty big shoes to fill, but Okie has a responsibility to Tom and his legacy in my opinion, and if he can't do that, it's like the old saying goes, if you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen. Open and honest communication would have gone a long way instead of hiding. People can be very understanding if you are just honest with them, and he was being less than honest.
   Type at you later,
    Dan McEntee

[Dave Rigotti]

"DITTO"  BTW.... His last visit to SH was May 25, 2022 as of this typing..Just sayin'

   He might be, but he shouldn't be.  These people were customers. They gave him their hard earned money, cash, E Pluribus Unum, and were not getting what they ordered and could not get any communications from him. We are talking months in some cases. That is NOT the way to do business, especially after taking over from Tom Morris with the impeccable way he ran his operation before turning it over to Okie. Those are pretty big shoes to fill, but Okie has a responsibility to Tom and his legacy in my opinion, and if he can't do that, it's like the old saying goes, if you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen. Open and honest communication would have gone a long way instead of hiding. People can be very understanding if you are just honest with them, and he was being less than honest.
   Type at you later,
    Dan McEntee

[john e. holliday]

Yes that is a poor way to run a business..

[Mike Morrow]

It took a while but he just shipped an order for me.

Mike

Sent from my SM-A146U using Tapatalk

[Motorman]

I am gearing up to sell control horns.  Here's a sneak peek.
They will be laser cut from .063" 4130 chrome-moly.

Brent I think that's great. Cottage industries really keep this sport going. If I could humbly suggest putting a little more metal around the adjustment slot on the elevator horn as I've seen these bend out on Tom Morris units even with the Tee nut. Another thing About the Morris horns, they were tapped 4-40 for ball links but the threads were always rusty. You can tap it out and try to clean it and put it together with oil but there's always a little rust left in there working on that little 4-40 bolt. Makes me worry with how many years these planes are in service. Maybe you could treat the holes with something like cosmoline? Keep up the good work, can't wait to see you roll out your new products.

MM

[Guy Markham]

Brent I think that's great. Cottage industries really keep this sport going. If I could humbly suggest putting a little more metal around the adjustment slot on the elevator horn as I've seen these bend out on Tom Morris units even with the Tee nut. Another thing About the Morris horns, they were tapped 4-40 for ball links but the threads were always rusty. You can tap it out and try to clean it and put it together with oil but there's always a little rust left in there working on that little 4-40 bolt. Makes me worry with how many years these planes are in service. Maybe you could treat the holes with something like cosmoline? Keep up the good work, can't wait to see you roll out your new products.

MM

Yes good thought and strong 3/32 wire 

[Istvan Travnik]

Dear Warren,
I suggest you my good old system (I use it for right half a century).
https://www.flickr.com/photos/171504164@N04/48094413603/

Do not care the expo crank and others, just observe that the control horn made of two pieces of 3/32"  (2,6mm) dia wire, soldered together in a flat brass tube. More than simple, and absolute safe.
Originally I found Cadmium coated moped/mokick spokes, but copper coated welding iron wire is very well solderable, and other pure mid-hard steel rods, too.
You can turn proper thread on it for adjustability, etc.
Istvan

[Guy Markham]

I am gearing up to sell control horns.  Here's a sneak peek.
They will be laser cut from .063" 4130 chrome-moly.

Will the flap horn have holes threaded  and will one of the holes located for 27 degrees flap movement?  from the bellcrank

[Brent Williams]

Will the flap horn have holes threaded  and will one of the holes located for 27 degrees flap movement?  from the bellcrank

The holes in flap horn are offset 7° each direction off of the centerline mark. 

I haven't decided what level of "finished" I will offer these as yet.  The holes will be laser cut at .060" with .125" spacing to allow for further processing, ie sizing for a bushing, threading, ect.

[Walter Hicks]

Brent, Thank you for doing this, you will for sure have plenty of customers . I know of 4 just that I know. We all use your handles which are excellent.
Let us know when you are ready to sell these .

[Steve Helmick]

My thoughts, as an extra-tired retired machinist: If you laser cut the holes at .060", they'd need to be drilled out larger for a 4-40 (or 3mm?) tap, and then tapped. With the wire soldered/brazed/welded to the lever, both drilling and tapping would be much more difficult and high potential for either broken drill or broken tap, due to wire being an obstruction.

What I would suggest is laser cut the holes at .060", then drill to .100" and tap with a form tap, aka roll tap. I've used roll taps a lot, and am a big fan of them. Much stronger taps, no chips, no flutes to clog, and threads are work hardened, so they're also stronger. Assuming you'd use a good threading lubricant, even a 4-40 roll tap will last a long time and be good for lots of parts. Do the brazing afterwards!    Steve

[Steve Helmick]

Other than that, I've always hoped that somebody would figure out a way to mold CF control horns in one piece. It will take a fresh point of view. Maybe somebody that has never seen our conventional flap & elevator horns would come up with a good design?  Steve

[redout]

My thoughts, as an extra-tired retired machinist: If you laser cut the holes at .060", they'd need to be drilled out larger for a 4-40 (or 3mm?) tap, and then tapped. With the wire soldered/brazed/welded to the lever, both drilling and tapping would be much more difficult and high potential for either broken drill or broken tap, due to wire being an obstruction.

What I would suggest is laser cut the holes at .060", then drill to .100" and tap with a form tap, aka roll tap. I've used roll taps a lot, and am a big fan of them. Much stronger taps, no chips, no flutes to clog, and threads are work hardened, so they're also stronger. Assuming you'd use a good threading lubricant, even a 4-40 roll tap will last a long time and be good for lots of parts. Do the brazing afterwards!    Steve

I've been interested in and around machining operations for years ( as a non-professional ) and I had never heard of or seen these ( including in the toolstore of a large metal fab. technical college ). I'm going to see about acquiring one or two and see how they perform. I think I read they are particularly good for aluminium/aluminum but require metal with sufficient ductility. I'm intrigued !