Shrinking clubs.

[Ty Marcucci]

I'm willing to bet many clubs are going through this shrinking problem.  We have trouble getting over 15 members with maybe 8 truly active. Two have died, three have moved out of state, two are just too old and have physical/mental problems, the 5 kids are off doing other stuff, one has a job that requires constant out of state travel, and our meeting place at the county library keeps changing their hours. We scheduled a meeting at our flying site, but it rained cats and dogs and high winds, so back to the library,  which used to close at 9 now closes at 8.. This makes it hard for some to get there after work as they have to travel 1/2 hour one way IF the traffic is moving. 

We shall keep moving on. Just had to rant due to the frustration of getting things going. 

[Dwayne Donnelly]

It's heart breaking but our hobby is dying, this pic is our club house, we've had 2 members pass in the past 6 months, the widows ask us to help with all the gear their husbands have but we can only do so much, we try to sell or give away what we can but many of these planes ended up in the trash, 

[Dennis Saydak]

I can certainly sympathize with this topic. Our club is pretty much in shrink mode and despite the best efforts of a few key members no newcomers are filling the ranks. It's sad to see this happen. Enjoy the hobby while you are still able.

[john e. holliday]

The biggest problem I see is the lack of local hobby as well as members reaching the end of life.   Also how many times do you see someone flying.  Used to be we could fly on school grounds, baseball diamonds when not in use and parks that had room enough.  But a few individuals did not like the noise even though like in my case it caused the kids to stop doing what they were doing to watch.  I've lost count how many times when I would just put up a couple of lights on the neighborhood ball grounds some one would stopp and say I didn't know any body still flew those things or had not soon one fly.  The Flying Eagles of KCK back in the 50's and 60 would put on a demonstration for the local school kids and the park department.  But my job put a stop to helping with that and the club also folded.   I tried to resurrect the club and it went great for a couple of months with me being at the circle every weekend but I missed a couple of weekends and everybody quit even after I told them them I was back.  That is when I joined the Sky Devils of KCMo.

[944_Jim]

I'm watching this collapse and wondering what else will too. My primary adult hobbies were antique cars and motorcycles. With a well equipped garage on the house,  things like suspension work, engine work, clutches, interior work are getting harder to do. Worse, my boys have no interest in this hobby. Neither did they want to jump into model airplanes (sigh). The airplane stuff may be the "tell" or indicator on the car stuff.

For my big toys, my concern is they will be outlawed as gasoline may be in 10-15 years. Of course, I may consider electrifying the Triumph TR6. I can't see doing that to the CB1100F or S-90.

[De Hill]

From what  I hear, the shrinking club problem is affecting the majority of clubs in the USA.

How to fix it?

I have no idea.

Whatever the vast majority of us are doing is not increasing the membership in our clubs.

[Avaiojet]

From what  I hear, the shrinking club problem is affecting the majority of clubs in the USA.

How to fix it?

I have no idea.

Whatever the vast majority of us are doing is not increasing the membership in our clubs.

"How to fix it?"

Kindness.   

[FLOYD CARTER]

The "Shrinking Membership" problem has been discussed for many years, without a good, workable answer.  We see more attrition in control line than in radio control.  Many R/C clubs are booming, such that they can't accept any new members.  Already filled up!

A variety of reasons have been put forward.  I think the biggest reason is the lack of young people getting interested.  R/C is still too expensive for youngsters.  Most of the local hobby shops have closed due to mail order houses, who offer no advice or technical help to kids.  The available model magazines no longer stress the model building side of the hobby.  Few established modelers are willing or able to guide a young person in modeling.

Modern life is fast-paced such that a hobby requiring many hours of careful work doesn't appeal to many.

[Peter in Fairfax, VA]

This shrinking isn't the situation for all clubs.  Just now back from a well attended regional contest.  Multiple clubs in my state, Virginia, are doing great.

[Neil Rogers]

When I was a kid, flight fascinated me.  It still does.  I still look up in the air whenever I hear a plane.  How many younger people do that these days?  If they aren't interested in things that fly, they won't be interested in model airplanes.  It's a different mindset today.  You can do all the encouraging that you want, but you can't make someone be interested in our hobby.

I know others may think that I'm full of it and don't know what I'm talking about and that's ok.  I'm just sharing my experience with the situation.

[Dave_Trible]

Up though the 70's we had perhaps 60-70 regular CL fliers in the greater KC metro and had as many as four clubs separated mostly by geography and proximity to local flying fields.  Our decline actually began back then in fits and starts.  Sorry to say Tower Hobbies and such helped put the five or six good hobby shops in the area out of business and therefore there was no place for new people to happen upon the sport , get supplies and any sort of other help or personal contact with other modelers in the same way. End result here is only one hobby shop that caters mostly to RC and NO club in the KC area.  We have one flying field and these days I am the only one using it.   In the case of clubs, (or National organizations) it always takes one or two 'spark plugs' or worker bees to do the work and keep things glued together.  When those age out or move on the thing collapses.  We have very few willing to give very much of themselves to benefit the whole.  Finally-time marches on.  In large part the computer age brought endless and mostly effortless ways to spend time for everyone and most especially youngsters.  Try taking the iPads away from any of my four grandkids........they are not really enchanted with aviation as we once were and attention span is so short.  I think we will have a diminished presence for quite a while going forward, not really dying out but scaled way down unless we find a new crop of youngsters-perhaps among those youngsters who haven't been given and spoiled by everything!  We old farts will have fun and make the best of it as long as we can.

Dave

[Will Hinton]

Flying has become so common place in comparison to the "early years" that the romance and attraction is gone.  When I was working as an electronics tech and then a mech at the various airports most of us would have worked there if they only fed us and gave us a place to sleep just to be able to touch those magic contraptions, we were that engrossed with them. 

[944_Jim]

Amen Dave Triple (two posts earlier). I tried to get my boys involved in model airplanes, model rockets, old AFX slot cars, my old N scale railroad, antique autos...

The cars came later with my wife's influence ( her side of the family provided the autos). All the other stuff I've dragged through life hoping to enjoy with the boys (or girls if it happened that way). The tablets and smartphones have taken hold too hard. Had I known that, I would have let go of some of this stuff long ago.

I'm glad to have it all as I (too slowly) wind down expecting to fully retire within seven years. For now I'll appreciate what little childhood number two can muster. They'll have to toss it all later. Sigh...

[Steve Dwyer]

In our time kids built everything, forts in the woods, boats, soap box karts, go karts, motor bikes, anything we could mount a horizontal shaft 2.5 hp motor on. Kids fell asleep with Popular Mechanics and woke up anxious to try anything.  We’d spend hours pouring over the “Monkey Wards” catalogue. Later we tinkered with our first cars, Bondo patching rust and tuning up the old flat head. We could do anything and most kids learned from others. When the model airplane bug came around almost everyone became involved to some degree, for some they stayed with it, forever dreaming of flying. It was a hands-on time when physically creating something had importance, accomplishment and value, we were talented and wanted more.

It’s a very different place today. Consider how people well before us left the farm to learn a trade, kids today have little desire to spend time in the basement shop, if there is a shop, it’s not for them. They are challenged to absorb and keep up in an ever changing world of technology beyond their imaginations. It’s their future to evolve into. I see it clearly with my grandkids, even the ones I built their own planes with their name in graphics on it. Well I tried, it’s not any fault of theirs. Their spectrum of curiosity is completely opposed to ours of 50 years ago. We can’t blame them, because they have no interest in what they view as “the farm” we cherished so much. Good for them, we must wish them well, they will need it.

Reluctant as it is for some here, the sooner we stop wondering what it will take to develop young people’s interest in our life's passion, the easier we will come to realize it's a done deal. Give it up. Yes it’s sad to go out flying by ourselves and see clubs diminish. As a dying breed facing the inevitable end to something we have always enjoyed, it's now our time to go out with gusto so let it rip!!  Nothing is forever, enjoy it as long as your body allows. Accept it once we are gone our faded, dust covered treasures weakened from hand me down moves through the youngsters' attics and basements will surely find their final landing places….the trash receptacle, and that's not far off for many of us. But most importantly, you will always be part of a select group that experienced the addictive fragrance of burned castor oil, something the younger generation will never do.

[John Carrodus]

Steve Dyer
Just read your obituary to our fading hobby. You brought tears to me eyes!
My hope is that with the world events that have recently unfolded and the stuff that's looming over the event horizon, there will be a renaissance in hobbies such as model aircraft. Kids are the key. Devices are their opiate. The so called 'experts' are telling us to wrench the kids from the screen- and the adults from their darn mobiles. If we could do this we'd probably solve a lot of problems and have a surge of interest in model aircraft again.
Alas social media has poured millions into research on adhesives. They now have a powerful, almost unbreakable bond between them and the masses. lack Hens Teeth suppliers doesn't help too.

[Gerald Arana]

When I was a kid, flight fascinated me.  It still does.  I still look up in the air whenever I hear a plane.  How many younger people do that these days?  If they aren't interested in things that fly, they won't be interested in model airplanes.  It's a different mindset today.  You can do all the encouraging that you want, but you can't make someone be interested in our hobby.

I know others may think that I'm full of it and don't know what I'm talking about and that's ok.  I'm just sharing my experience with the situation.

Neil,

You're right. There's an old saying which is: "You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink".

None of my three boys are interested in airplanes. But, one of my grandsons was. I say was because he actually flew a CL motel for a full flight before he got interested in full scale. But that didn't last because of the cost.....

Oh well....

Jerry

[Avaiojet]

Steve Dyer
Just read your obituary to our fading hobby. You brought tears to me eyes!
My hope is that with the world events that have recently unfolded and the stuff that's looming over the event horizon, there will be a renaissance in hobbies such as model aircraft. Kids are the key. Devices are their opiate. The so called 'experts' are telling us to wrench the kids from the screen- and the adults from their darn mobiles. If we could do this we'd probably solve a lot of problems and have a surge of interest in model aircraft again.
Alas social media has poured millions into research on adhesives. They now have a powerful, almost unbreakable bond between them and the masses. lack Hens Teeth suppliers doesn't help too.

I've seen many Pattern flyers, R/C that is, over many years, not only lose flying fields, but deliberately keep other modelers from knowing about "their" field. They didn't want any sport flyers around, none. This would cut into their precious "flying and practicing" time.

To boot, these same people shunned others away, who were candidates to pick up the hobby, yes, dads with their sons. And I've watched this go on for years. I can't believe I'm the only one who witnessed this type of behavior?

The 50's and 60's were great for CL at least in my area. To come back into CL eleven years ago only to experience this.    And it is comical how the hobby and most of all, the people, have changed.

Repeated bad behavior has caused many to leave this Forum.

[Peter in Fairfax, VA]

Saturday's session.  It was a contest, but still, participation.

[rich gorrill]

Same problem in the Philly area, we are down to 17 dues paying members in the Philly Fliers, and some of them don't ever come to the field. We haven't had a new member for quite a few years. People stop by with their kids, Dan Banjock gets them flying with a trainer, then you never see them again when you tell Dad what it takes to get started in modeling. If the Dad's not a handy guy he will never build or help his kid build a model airplane, seems they want instant gratification, a drone or an RC car.

[Dwayne Donnelly]

Same problem in the Philly area, we are down to 17 dues paying members in the Philly Fliers, and some of them don't ever come to the field. We haven't had a new member for quite a few years. People stop by with their kids, Dan Banjock gets them flying with a trainer, then you never see them again when you tell Dad what it takes to get started in modeling. If the Dad's not a handy guy he will never build or help his kid build a model airplane, seems they want instant gratification, a drone or an RC car.

The thing about drones is for most part owners don't want to be organized or pay dues, our RC club through our LHS offered to build a an area to fly and racing, we had a quite few come out to check it  out and some were very interested but didn't want to join our club they wanted it for free.

[John Gluth]

The thing about drones is for most part owners don't want to be organized or pay dues, our RC club through our LHS offered to build a an area to fly and racing, we had a quite few come out to check it  out and some were very interested but didn't want to join our club they wanted it for free.

Right, they are toy owners not hobbyists!  Have no aptitude nor skill to repair, just replace their hovering toys. Likewise, no interest in speaking model airplane.
  Self-promotion is irresistible to the point of pastime and distraction, has made Zuckerberg and his ilk wealthy...
Yes, instant-gratification part of same predominate, existing paradigm. 

[Dan McEntee]

Same problem in the Philly area, we are down to 17 dues paying members in the Philly Fliers, and some of them don't ever come to the field. We haven't had a new member for quite a few years. People stop by with their kids, Dan Banjock gets them flying with a trainer, then you never see them again when you tell Dad what it takes to get started in modeling. If the Dad's not a handy guy he will never build or help his kid build a model airplane, seems they want instant gratification, a drone or an RC car.

    This is why I have been saying for years, forget the kids!! Concentrate on the 20 and 30 something Dads. They have been around long enough to experience a few things and have some understanding of modeling. They have the minvan/SUV and the bank account. If you get some of them, the kids will come with them. We just have to keep putting it pout there for the adults to see, and if you get them, the kids come with them!! This is why at the KidVenture venue we always have flown adults also. Numbers are numbers!
   Type at you later,
   Dan McEntee
   

[Dwayne Donnelly]

Right, they are toy owners not hobbyists!  Have no aptitude nor skill to repair, just replace their hovering toys. Likewise, no interest in speaking model airplane.
  Self-promotion is irresistible to the point of pastime and distraction, has made Zuckerberg and his ilk wealthy...
Yes, instant-gratification part of same predominate, existing paradigm.

But that's the thing, have you ever watched or followed drone racing? The good ones are all built by the owner fliers, they are crashed and repaired constantly and like all racers they are constantly tinkering on them to get them flying the best/fast as they can but for some reason they didn't want to fork out a hundred bucks a year plus MAAC to race or fly at our field.

[peabody]

Besides the fact that interest in ANY form of aviation is shrinking, I believe that "clubs" are shrinking because of availability of information on the Internet.

Why spend money on a PAMPA membership to get Stunt News when there are a couple forums that provide more and quicker information?

The comradery of being a "club" member has gone away....

Ah well.... 

[EddyR]

 If you want to watch CL flying don’t come to the Charlotte NC area. Huntersville field is locked all the time. Join ama join club pay for key just to watch.  I no logger fly per health problems.  No more trips there for me ,almost 3 hr round trip.

Note from the club newsletter   "WACAMA NEWS:

The gate to Waymer field is to remain locked at all times . After you enter , please lock the gate behind you .  Please make sure the last person that leaves the field secures the lock on charging station and lower the awning ."
 

[Mark wood]

It's a sad state of affairs to be sure. It's across all sport aviation not just models. So, what to do about it? That's an impossible question to answer. Perhaps just keep going until we can't any longer. The field where I fly in Wichita is a beautiful thing. Two fully paved circles and three grass ones. We don't have the manpower to put on an event but I'd sure bet if we had some help one could do something.

[Steve Helmick]

It's a sad state of affairs to be sure. It's across all sport aviation not just models. So, what to do about it? That's an impossible question to answer. Perhaps just keep going until we can't any longer. The field where I fly in Wichita is a beautiful thing. Two fully paved circles and three grass ones. We don't have the manpower to put on an event but I'd sure bet if we had some help one could do something.

Our problem is just the opposite. A bunch of geezers with no place to fly. Currently, only Seattle area CL flying is done in a park in south Auburn, off of A street. We had club trainer days and tried Boy Scouts and various neices and nephews sort of stuff, but never had any of the kids come back or join the club. With Seattle's history in aviation, you'd think the park departments and city officials would be more sympathetic, but not so. At one time, we had about 10 model clubs in the Puget Sound area, most of which were multi-interest clubs and flew anything and everything.    Steve

[Dane Martin]

But that's the thing, have you ever watched or followed drone racing? The good ones are all built by the owner fliers, they are crashed and repaired constantly and like all racers they are constantly tinkering on them to get them flying the best/fast as they can but for some reason they didn't want to fork out a hundred bucks a year plus MAAC to race or fly at our field.

I am HEAVILY active in drone racing and long range drones. I can say with no uncertainties, there is absolutely no "buying" anything. Can you buy an ARF drone? Sure! Can you buy an ARF RC or CL model?  Sure. Are either at the highest levels of competition? Nope.

Now, what takes longer to build, a drone or a competitive cl plane? Obviously the plane. But, there's just as many hours of programming and setting up  PID's as there is trimming an airplane.

What I see is us constantly bashing new tech and new facets of the flying hobby, and the younger generation saying, "well screw them if they already hate us ". Literally. That's a quote, verbatim.

[Tom Luciano]

Lack of commitment to any one thing. I'm trying to enjoy this and the people in it for as long as I can. Golf, Softball, Bowling, etc. leagues are all hurting. Even my Motorcycling friends are 20 years older than me!!! The two income family has alot to do with it as well. Heck, even youth sports are on the decline besides lacrosse around here. I ran a youth football program and commitment was an issue. "we can't practice this or that night because little Johnny has fencing, chess, american Indian culture classes, etc. If its not catered they move on. I coached Travel baseball as well, a 40-45 day(june20-aug.1) commitment was too much for some families as that impeded on their weekends at the Jersey shore or their other travel sports team!!

Enjoy it as much as you can while you(we) are here. I enjoy my modeling days from the field to the diner after our flying sessions. There is no place I would rather be!!!

All the best
Tom

[Don Jenkins]

The Metrolina Controline Society (aka, The Carolina Gang) spearheaded by Will Davis, still has a few active members building and flying, including many "out of area" members who come by once in a while for a gathering to tell lies and fly planes.  COVID has certainly put a damper on our efforts to plan any official events, but we have snuck in a few unofficial get togethers in the past year.  Some of us will head to Triple Tree this week in Woodruff, SC for some flying at "Nall in the Fall"!

Don

[Mark wood]

I don't know what the answer is for sure. I do know that we can hold more gatherings and that can at least bring those of us remaining together. Our local club hasn't done much in the last 7 or 8 years and being new to the group of Wichihawks, I'm thinking about taking the reigns to bring some of the events back. We have a wonderful place to fly and our field has held some very impressive events. Having said that, I'll need help putting events on as our membership is small. Any volunteers?

[kevin king]

Interesting topic.
Maybe if all of us would take a little time out of our busy lives to promote the hobby we would have more members.
Does you club have a website? You can get one for free from Google Websites.
Is your flying field on Google Maps? Its a simple  process to do.
Does your city still have a community newspaper? Have them come out to the field to do a story. The local 5 o'clock news is another tool we can use.
Lets all do our part and keep this flame alive!

https://workspace.google.com/intl/en_ca/products/sites/



Kilcona Control Line Model Airplane Park
(204) 667-1318
https://maps.app.goo.gl/52e8bk1zBSdWyhJR9

Perfect Circle Flying Club
(204) 667-1318
https://maps.app.goo.gl/fJsmE9jBZty4W7Z87

No excuses.
Kevin.

[Steve Scott]

The "Shrinking Membership" problem has been discussed for many years, without a good, workable answer.  We see more attrition in control line than in radio control.  Many R/C clubs are booming, such that they can't accept any new members.  Already filled up!

A variety of reasons have been put forward.  I think the biggest reason is the lack of young people getting interested.  R/C is still too expensive for youngsters.  Most of the local hobby shops have closed due to mail order houses, who offer no advice or technical help to kids.  The available model magazines no longer stress the model building side of the hobby.  Few established modelers are willing or able to guide a young person in modeling.

Modern life is fast-paced such that a hobby requiring many hours of careful work doesn't appeal to many.

No, RC club membership is not booming and many clubs are experiencing significant declines in membership.  Same is true of activities such as scouting.  Our parks and rec dept has seen organized softball participation shrink as well.

I have young lads living next door in 3rd, 5th and 7th grade.  They get excited when I pull into my driveway asking if I was flying my planes but everytime I've invited them to the field they always have soccer to go to.

[kevin king]

My dog liked playing with a ball too. How thrilling.

[Mark wood]

My dog liked playing with a ball too. How thrilling.

My dog loves to go to the flying field and sit at my feet when I'm flying. And she likes bugging the other guys there.

[Steve Scott]

But that's the thing, have you ever watched or followed drone racing? The good ones are all built by the owner fliers, they are crashed and repaired constantly and like all racers they are constantly tinkering on them to get them flying the best/fast as they can but for some reason they didn't want to fork out a hundred bucks a year plus MAAC to race or fly at our field.

Quite a bit of truth to that.  I have a couple of Tiny Whoop-style racing drones which I fly about the house and they are quite addictive.  The pro pilots spend a LOT of time fiddling with flight controller software, PID tuning, experimenting with the correct motor KV/battery C rating and lag time.  They are hardly 'toys' for instant gratification.  The major networks televise DRL leagues just as they do golf or tennis matches.

I had one of my former officemates attend a CL demonstration at a general aviation fly-in years ago since he had kids.  He seemed rather underwhelmed and asked, "Is that all you can do with those airplanes?"  He thought they were boring.

[Don Jenkins]

If you want to watch CL flying don’t come to the Charlotte NC area. Huntersville field is locked all the time. Join ama join club pay for key just to watch.  I no logger fly per health problems.  No more trips there for me ,almost 3 hr round trip.

Gee Ed, thanks for promoting our CL hobby at Huntersville.  Four of us were flying there yesterday, and the gate was open!!

Don

[Steve Dwyer]

Hey Don Jenkins going back to your 10-6 post with photos of the "Carolina Gang" and referring to the top picture, what can you tell us about the grey biplane with the roundels in the center being held by the gent in a blue shirt? It appears to be a profile in the 40" span size, can you identify the model and did you see it fly?

Steve

[Don Jenkins]

Hey Don Jenkins going back to your 10-6 post with photos of the "Carolina Gang" and referring to the top picture, what can you tell us about the grey biplane with the roundels in the center being held by the gent in a blue shirt? It appears to be a profile in the 40" span size, can you identify the model and did you see it fly?

Steve

That's Phil Bailey and he's holding his SE-5.  I know nothing about the model, and I did not see it fly, but it was sure pretty!

Don

[Steve Dwyer]

Phil's not a listed SH member, contact information?

Steve

[Craig Beswick]

Phil is listed as Phillip Bailey!

He is on Stunthanger Video nearly every week.

If he is on the YouTube show today you can send him a message.

Craig

[Dan Berry]

That's Phil Bailey and he's holding his SE-5.  I know nothing about the model, and I did not see it fly, but  but it was sure pretty!

Don

I wonder if it's an iteration of a SE5 from Jonny Casburn.

[Steve Dwyer]

I sent a PM to Phillip.

Steve

[kevin king]

Fed up with these people.

[Avaiojet]

Most of the people who take up Frisbee are Liberals.

Find another field while you're young.

Charles

[kevin king]

Most of the people who take up Frisbee are Liberals.

Find another field while you're young.

Charles

Cant do that Charles.

[Mark wood]

Fed up with these people.

Man that sucks. People coming along and trying to take what you worked for.

[kevin king]

Man that sucks. People coming along and trying to take what you worked for.

Indeed. Its like the guy that asked people to help him plant a crop. They said no. The guy planted it by himself and when harvest came everyone came everyone wanted the food

[Steve Dwyer]

Kevin,

You may have to learn to accept your new neighbors. Try better communication in order for both of you to respect each other's presence. Who knows, they may go away as quickly as they arrived anyway.

Steve

[Steve Dwyer]

It may not be all bad getting to know your neighbors anyway!!

[Ken Culbertson]

It may not be all bad getting to know your neighbors anyway!!

If you expand the picture you will see that what looks like a pleasant smile is actually a focused smirk as she lines up to hit your plane in the air.

Ken

[Steve Dwyer]

Ken,

I'm gonna let her give it a try!!

Steve

[kevin king]

It may not be all bad getting to know your neighbors anyway!!

Actually they look like this...