Shocking!

[John Castle]

I was flying today in typical Oregon showery and windy Spring weather. Every time I got more than about 10' off the ground I would get a shock. I did a loop zapp, did a wing over zapp again. It spooked me a little so I flew out the tank practicing flying level in the wind, landed and called it a day.

Less than a week until the NW Regionals...

[Russell Shaffer]

I'm in Klamath Falls so I'll be interested in any replys to this.  See you in Eugene.

[pat king]

I had a similar experience in central Illinois. There were dark storm clouds off in the distance. The storm was probably 30 miles away. I was flying a Voodoo on 60' lines on an Ezjust Hot Rock handle. I noticed that I was getting shocked by the wire through the handle. 120 feet of wire whipping through the air at 50 to 80 MPH makes a great static electricity collector. I was afraid of drawing a lightening strike. I put the airplane about 3 feet off the ground until it ran out of fuel. Since then, I will not fly if it even looks like a storm is coming. I would not fly if it is misting or raining. 
Pat

[Brett Buck]

I was flying today in typical Oregon showery and windy Spring weather. Every time I got more than about 10' off the ground I would get a shock. I did a loop zapp, did a wing over zapp again. It spooked me a little so I flew out the tank practicing flying level in the wind, landed and called it a day.

Less than a week until the NW Regionals...

    Hmmm, I have flown up there a lot and never had that problem. Although it's common in the midwest. My suggested solution - take some bare copper wire, attach it somehow to the lines or line carriers on the handle, and then wrap it around the grip so you are in constant contact with it. That will bleed off the charge continually instead of letting it build up, then discharge with a "zap" periodically.

   Of course, if there is any visible lightning flashes, or audible thunder, STOP IMMEDIATELY and take shelter. Waving 70 foot long conductors in the air during a thunderstorm, even if it's 50 miles away, is *not* a good idea.
 
     Brett

[Clint Ormosen]

  Of course, if there is any visible lightning flashes, or audible thunder, STOP IMMEDIATELY and take shelter. Waving 70 foot long conductors in the air during a thunderstorm, even if it's 50 miles away, is *not* a good idea.
 
     Brett

.....but it sure would make a good YouTube video.

[Brett Buck]

.....but it sure would make a good YouTube video.

   Only if you precede it my shouting "Hey, y'all, check 'is out!".

    Brett

[Andrew Tinsley]

Hello,

  Marvin Denny published a neat handle design on the forum a few weeks ago. He included an earthing terminal on the handle. Just wondering if Marvin has any ideas to stop the connection to a grounded stake getting twisted to blazes after a flight. Any tricks up your sleeve Marvin?

Regards,

Andrew.

[Jim Kraft]

I have been zapped at the handle. It is not fun. Happened to me at the Topeka Ks. contest a few years ago fly Old Time. There was a storm just off to the north with lightning out of a black cloud just after I got my plane in the air. When I did the climb I got hit really hard, and waved off my flight, and just flew out the tank as low as I dared fly. I have been spooked, and won't fly if it looks like a thunder cloud anywhere on the horizon. Some guy,s will tell you it is just static, but my arm hurt for a while after, and if it was just static, it still hurt. You have to remember that there can be a huge difference in voltage potential in 60'.

[Steve Fitton]

We had thunderstorm issues Sunday as well.  One of our guys got zapped pretty hard three times on his flight.  Since he has a steel plate in his head ( ), the charge built up in his head and exited through his teeth and zorched his lip!

It was hard to evaulate the closeness of the storms, there was no visible lightning, just a low rumble a good ways off to the west.  Clouds and light rain obscured the distant storm, and the electrical activity zapping people seemed only to be present for a very brief time.  

I saw Kent Tysor get zapped hard during practice at Marietta one time.  The storm must have been 30-50 miles away, but it was a big one, and Kent got walloped so hard that the charge passing through his leg tensed his hamstring so much that he doubled over after landing and was obviously sore the rest of the weekend.  The sight of that induced me to chicken out of flying whenever there was any question about getting zapped during the flight.

[Dalton Hammett]

I have been stunk by static on nice days, now have my handle equipped with the copper wire as Bret described.  It solved the problem and I've had no stings for a couple of years but I still won't fly if the weather looks bad.  Thats just asking for a problem.

Dalton H.

[FLOYD CARTER]

I solved the static buildup problem on my ham radio equipment by grounding all equipment with a braided copper strap, about 1" wide, to an 8' copper-plated stake driven in the ground.

So that's what you do.  Bring lots of copper braided strap and a ground rod with you when you go flying.  It's guaranteed to work!

Floyd

[Andrew Tinsley]

That is all very well Floyd! But how do you go about untwiting all that braid after a flight?

Andrew.

[Jerry Leuty]

 Here in north Texas we get a lot of lightening strikes. In the winter time if there is low humidity then static shocks are nuisance. I would pet my Basset Hound and then touch his nose and a spark would occur. He would always run away after that affection. Seriously though  steel lines in electric charged air can be very serious. I have not been hit in a long time now. But back in the 70s when we were all flying combat and thought we were invincible we would take a wire with alligator clips on each end and clip one end to the flying lines and the other to a watch band thus eliminating the static discharge. Simple rule is check the weather forecast for your area and avoid the temptation to go put up a quick flight and live to see another day.

Jerry

[Jim Thomerson]

At a contest at Rockford, IL, many years ago, it was a clear cloudless day.  I got consistently zapped on my first flight. I  rolled up the lines and went home.  On the other hand I have flown in rain on various occasions, when there was no thunder, and had no problem. 

[Terrence Durrill]

I have been zapped several times over my 57 years of control line flying.  My worst experience was in 1966 in Denver, CO.  I was at a city park with my brother-in-law, honking along with a Top Flite Combat Cat and a Fox .36x engine on Missile Mist, 9/7 nylon prop.  I had not noticed any storm clouds close to the site at the time.  I got 2 or 3 really strong jolts through the lines and Hot Rock handle.  It was pretty scarey because I continued to feel the jolts after putting the plane below a three foot altitude and praying to run out of fuel.  There was no escape no matter how low I flew.  I finally eased the plane into the ground and that ended the torture.  That experience truly made a believer out of me.  From that time on, I have been very careful about flying if there is any hint of a storm in the area.   

[Dennis Toth]

Any difference between using solid lines versus braided cable? Seems when I flew on solids it was much more of a problem then with the cable.

Best,      DennisT

[Howard Rush]

I was at a city park with my brother-in-law, honking along with a Top Flite Combat Cat and a Fox .36x engine on Missile Mist, 9/7 nylon prop. 

I think you can lay that on the Missile Mist.  Stick with Powermaster and you'll be OK.

[Howard Rush]

Marvin Denny published a neat handle design on the forum a few weeks ago. He included an earthing terminal on the handle.

When I first read that, I thought you wrote "earring terminal".  I wouldn't think Marvin would employ an earring terminal to dissipate lightning, although he might try to talk me into doing it.

[Randy Cuberly]

Any difference between using solid lines versus braided cable? Seems when I flew on solids it was much more of a problem then with the cable.

Best,      DennisT

Yes, the solid lines give you solid shocks, and the braid lines give you braided shocks! 

Randy Cuberly

[Allen Brickhaus]

Jack Sheeks talks about that in his "CARE" article.

Allen

[Bob Hudak]

Al,
 Where might we be able to view a copy of Jack's Care article ?
           Bob

[RknRusty]

  I'm new at flying with steel lines since I only recently graduated from 45 years of flying 1/2A. After reading this I'm thinking of switching the steel out for Spectra line. I believe it's AMA approved now. That should eliminate the shocks.

[Shultzie]

Living n flying CL in Iowa wwwwwaaaaaaaayyyyyy back in 1954 Bob Palmer told me to just KICK OFF MY TENNIS SHOES at a contest in Ames Ia.  Every one was getting zapped------until we followed his advice n' ckicked off our shoes, Static Electricity simply must have never had a chance to build up. However===========not sure flying bare footed on  hot tarmac sounds like a very good idea? 

[Keith Renecle]

I'm new at flying with steel lines since I only recently graduated from 45 years of flying 1/2A. After reading this I'm thinking of switching the steel out for Spectra line. I believe it's AMA approved now. That should eliminate the shocks.

Spectra lines do the same thing. I've flown kites for years on Spectra and Dacron lines and when there are big black clouds overhead, the static builds up. I was flying one day on a concrete helipad where I worked, and I heard this loud hissing sound. My feet were also tingling so I lifted one of my feet off the concrete and some sparks sort of "showered" off my shoes. Needless to say, I put the big delta kite down immediately..........Benjamin Franklin has done this stuff a while ago! 

Keith R

[Douglas Ames]

Now you know what Ben Franklin felt like.

[RknRusty]

Well, I'm glad to hear about this, so maybe if I get blasted I won't be too surprised and let go of the handle. I live in the land of perpetual high humidity, here in SC, which might be why it's never happened. I've flown a whole lot of miles of circles. It'll probably happen today.

[John Park]

You're not completely safe with non-metallic lines, either!  When I was a kid in the mid-1950s, I started C/L flying with a small diesel-powered model (a KeilKraft 'Champ') on the 25ft. Terylene (i.e. Dacron) thread lines supplied with the kit.  One humid afternoon, with thunder in the offing, I got a noticeable shock that nearly made me drop the handle (no thongs in those days).  I suppose the lines must have been damp enough to have a degree of conductivity.  It stopped me flying in thundery conditions ever again.

Regards
John

[Brett Buck]

I'm new at flying with steel lines since I only recently graduated from 45 years of flying 1/2A. After reading this I'm thinking of switching the steel out for Spectra line. I believe it's AMA approved now. That should eliminate the shocks.

   I don't recommend that. It's certainly not going to stop the shocks (as noted above), and the use of spectra on the larger models is far from a proven system.

    Do the wire around the handle thing, if that is insufficient, there's too much gradient to fly safely.

    Brett

[john e. holliday]

Do not have to have storm clouds to have static electricity.   Ask the guys down in Los Cruces and myself about Pawnee Rock Kansas.  When flying at the baseball stadium down in Missouri I would get slight static charges even with the power turned off on the lights around the stadium.

[CircuitFlyer]

Has anyone ever tried static wicks on their airplane?

[david beazley]

Does the type of covering make any difference?  Do "natural" materials (silk) have a greater tendency to build up static than man made coverings?

[Steve Helmick]

That is all very well Floyd! But how do you go about untwiting all that braid after a flight?

Andrew.

"Untwiting" is perhaps just a fortuitous misspelling, but I like it!  Steve

[Allen Brickhaus]

Al,
 Where might we be able to view a copy of Jack's Care article ?
           Bob
[/quote

Flying Models

[Steve Helmick]

For what it's worth, seriously, I've only gotten zapped once, here in the Pacific NW. It was drizzly (fathom that!) and we were trying to have a combat contest. I think that was the Inter-Club team contest where I flew against Henry Nelson (he was flying a VooDoo with a GH Torp and didn't get started). I was flying a Series 61/64 K&B on a modified Big Iron, and it not only started, but didn't blow up. About 4 years ago, I flew in a torrential downpour and significant breeze at NW CL Regionals in Eugene, and didn't get zapped or crash. I'm not worried about it this year, either.  Steve   

[Keith Renecle]

Well, I'm glad to hear about this, so maybe if I get blasted I won't be too surprised and let go of the handle. I live in the land of perpetual high humidity, here in SC, which might be why it's never happened. I've flown a whole lot of miles of circles. It'll probably happen today.

You don't have to worry about letting go of the handle, as the shock will not let you open your hand. If you have a blocked nose due to the sniffles or sinus problems, it also opens your nose........but I would suggest that there other simpler and safer remedies out there.

I think that one of the best static incidents I've seen was with Bob Hunt at the Spanish world champs in 2006. He took off, and I forget the maneuver he did when he got zapped, but he shouted to the judges "electricity.....electricity!!" Everyone thought........o.k.....big deal, so you're flying an electric model. No need to shout about it. Meanwhile, Bob was trying to point out that he was getting static shocks. In 2004 in Muncie (also the world champs) Billy Werwage had to quit flying during one of his official flights, and many people had hair looking like Einstein's!

We get a lot of static up here in Johannesburg at 5000 to 6000 ft. in the summer. Using a metal handle or adding a wire from the lines does help, but I've found that it depends on the soles of your shoes as well. Modern plastic type soles will still give you shocks, so if you want the whole deal, just fly with bare feet. However, if there is a big fat black cloud above the circle, pack up and stop flying, because you are just asking to ionize a nice path down to you for lightning to strike.

There was a good thread on this a few years ago on the Stuka Stunt forum. Someone mentioned that if you have these black clouds overhead and lots of static, then just fire a model rocket into this lot and the thick smoke (full of carbon??) will make for a nice path for lightning to zap the circle. He did stress the point that you have to retreat some distance away for the circle, but said that it was pretty spectacular! I don't think that I need to be there......I'll just check it out on You Tube!

Keith R

[Hoss Cain]

WOW! So everyone gets it, not just me!    I flew Cl models in a number of places and got ZAPs  in all places. It was most when  TRWs were in the area. However when I was at Mather AFB, Sacremento, CA for 6 months going through the USAF ANSRLRB school, I lived in a small apartment just off the base. Plenty room in the back for flying CL. I got zapped in clear-sky days. Don't remember any other days! I flew CL models in TX, IL, GA, SC, FL, CA, WI,  Spain and Morocco. Probably others that I don't recall. ZAPs were common and without recourse to weather, albeit warm-humid was the worse. Overhead maneuvers really attracted the stuff. I actually received a small burn on the hand one time. Kind of gets one's attention. 
Most of my flying was the EZ-Just handle, my favorite.  I learned to cover that metal adjuster with a small piece of rubber material and that definitely helped. As far as other handles, I do not remember any problems where there was no metal contact with the hand. Of course the larger and heavier the handle the more the problems.
Here all the time I just thought I was being punished for being a bad boy! 

[RknRusty]

It's certainly got my attention now. I'm going to add some sort of conductor sort of like what Bret Buck described, to my Sullivan EZ-Just. Give the current a steady path through me to ground so it doesn't have to build up first and arc. On that handle it could be done with some wire woven through the wrist thong.

[Mike Lauerman]

I got 2 big surprise jolts flying my McCoy Ringmaster in Sacramento (next to some hi-power lines, maybe 600 feet away...)

My flying partner said he always got a little 'tingle' flying there. That was the last time I flew there!

[Brett Buck]

It's certainly got my attention now. I'm going to add some sort of conductor sort of like what Bret Buck described, to my Sullivan EZ-Just. Give the current a steady path through me to ground so it doesn't have to build up first and arc. On that handle it could be done with some wire woven through the wrist thong.

   Really just need to put it around the grip, and connected to the line carrier or some other conductive path to the lines.

    Brett

[John Stiles]

Same as Pat King...I was flying a slow combat ship on 65' steel lines with the EZ-Just red handle....I kept feeling a jerking sensation and snuck a peek down into the palm of my hand....that's when I saw the blue arc....I immediately went low and stuck it into the grass.  I wont fly steel lines with big black clouds rolling in....something about inducing electrical charges that spooks me. I got struck by lightning once while lying under a car bolting up connecting rods.

[John Stiles]

It's certainly got my attention now. I'm going to add some sort of conductor sort of like what Bret Buck described, to my Sullivan EZ-Just. Give the current a steady path through me to ground so it doesn't have to build up first and arc. On that handle it could be done with some wire woven through the wrist thong.

There are sources for electric rope fencing...stuff too keep horses and goats corralled. I failed to mention I was also near a power line.

[Dennis Toth]

So no one has noticed a difference between solids and cable in getting the shocks?

Best,          DennisT

[KenP51]

Living n flying CL in Iowa wwwwwaaaaaaaayyyyyy back in 1954 Bob Palmer told me to just KICK OFF MY TENNIS SHOES at a contest in Ames Ia.  Every one was getting zapped------until we followed his advice n' ckicked off our shoes, Static Electricity simply must have never had a chance to build up. However===========not sure flying bare footed on  hot tarmac sounds like a very good idea? 

I remember getting some nasty static shocks when Flying as a teen. I looped a bare copper wire over my shoes and ran  some light flexible wire to the handle. Every step discharged the build up and no more zaps

Ken

[John Rist]

I am retired and no longer have access to anti-static equipment but at work we had an apparatus that went on your shoes. It is basically a conductive strap that went under the heal of the shoe.  This strap had a conductive ribbon that got stuffed in to the sock.  With these in place static electricity was allowed to bleed off to a conductive floor in the building.  But anyway the problem is most prevalent in handles such as the old Easy-Just where the lines pass through the handle and can set up a gap between the lines and the palm of the hand.  In the old days on dry days we found that all you had to do was grip the handle tightly so that the palm of the hand was in contact with the cable at the back of the handle.  Modern wood handles are less likely to zap you because the gap is large enough so that most charges can't jump the gap.  However if conditions get right where it does jump the gap it will be doosey of a jolt.

So if you live in a area where static electricity is a problem I would try two things - First of all wrap the handle with copper wire and attach the copper to the lines.  If this doesn't cure the problem I would get some copper brad  and stuff one end into your sock and attach the other end to the bottom of you shoe.   Rubber bands may do the trick.  Doing both will give the static a bleed off path so that it can't build up.

  

[Brett Buck]

But anyway the problem is most prevalent in handles such as the old Easy-Just where the lines pass through the handle and can set up a gap between the lines and the palm of the hand.  In the old days on dry days we found that all you had to do was grip the handle tightly so that the palm of the hand was in contact with the cable at the back of the handle.  

   Why, I have no idea what you mean!  Below is a picture of a scar I got when over-the-horizon lightning (at least 20 miles away) struck while I was flying my Shark 15 on April 4, 1975 (one year to the day after the "Super Outbreak). The arc went from the wire in the back of the EZ-Just to my palm. About half that scar came from a wart removal a few years earlier, and the rest was the arc burning a hole. The wart was removed with an electro-cautery gadget and the lightning burn felt EXACTLY the same. That is to say, it hurt like hell.

   I have seen several cases where lightning has caused significant injury. Mine was bad, and maybe not as obviously avoidable. The worst avoidable incident was at the 93 NATs where Lucky Pyatt was flying as an obvious supercell was building up and lightning struck nearby. Blew all the skin off the knuckles of his flying hand. My brother an I warned them about that beforehand. Paul Walker later got severely zapped on an official flight but no tissue damage.

   This single most dangerous case I have ever seen, fortunately with no incident, was at the 2004 WC on late Friday afternoon, even MY hair was standing on end for 45 minutes before flying was suspended (in the middle of Billy's official). I was trying to talk Frank and Warren out of calling it off but it took a while to convince them.

    Brett