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Author Topic: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.  (Read 2880 times)

Online Robert Zambelli

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Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« on: March 25, 2017, 09:31:59 AM »
Found this in a field near my house.
Sad that someone can do this to a plane.   :'(  :'(
I've been told that its been there for over twenty years.   ~^
Unbelievable mess.

I may try and rescue it.

  Bob Z.


Offline Mike Bufkin

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #1 on: March 25, 2017, 09:57:42 AM »
Isn't that a 140 ?
Good old plane.
I've actually been checked out in those.

Offline john e. holliday

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #2 on: March 25, 2017, 10:03:46 AM »
Drive around the country side and you will see a lot of this.
I was always taught to respect my elders, but it keeps getting harder to find one.
Today I broke my personal record for most consecutive days lived.
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Online Motorman

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #3 on: March 25, 2017, 10:12:10 AM »
At some point it's not cost effective to restore.


MM
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Offline Serge_Krauss

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #4 on: March 25, 2017, 10:33:26 AM »
Well, Bob, I hope you do. It will be rewarding to bring this little guy up into the air again. General aviation has been the unwanted child of the many who are too busy speeding about and pushing others aside to notice or appreciate these orphans of a more exciting and involving time. Staying in aviation is a big challenge to many. Go for it!

Offline Mike Scholtes

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #5 on: March 25, 2017, 10:41:05 AM »
I'd be most concerned about the engine; if not run for even a couple of years it may not be salvageable. It may be exchangeable for a rebuilt engine or just a serviceable used engine with some hours left on it. I presume that where you live the plane would have been deep in snow part of each year. Corrosion, rust, etc and the effect of time on the instruments would be problems. Not trying to be negative, just speaking as someone who did a complete restoration of an airport orphan myself. Still glad I did it, but that was a plane kept in a relatively dry and snow-free environment and the engine was fine without any repairs. Good hunting.

Say, what happened with the Swift?

Offline Elwyn Aud

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #6 on: March 25, 2017, 11:18:06 AM »
The FAA database says it's a 1961 model and is deregistered.
Elwyn Aud AMA 19413OK
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Online Robert Zambelli

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #7 on: March 25, 2017, 11:25:17 AM »
I'd be most concerned about the engine; if not run for even a couple of years it may not be salvageable. It may be exchangeable for a rebuilt engine or just a serviceable used engine with some hours left on it. I presume that where you live the plane would have been deep in snow part of each year. Corrosion, rust, etc and the effect of time on the instruments would be problems. Not trying to be negative, just speaking as someone who did a complete restoration of an airport orphan myself. Still glad I did it, but that was a plane kept in a relatively dry and snow-free environment and the engine was fine without any repairs. Good hunting.

Say, what happened with the Swift?


I agree with Motorman - it may have passed the point of diminishing returns.
Mike - all good points.
Regarding the engine, it turns freely but as you pointed out, there could be all sorts of internal issues.
The inside of the cockpit as well as the engine compartment is covered with vermin remnants. A lot of creatures have lived there - and maybe still do!
The plane is about four miles from my house in South Carolina. It's kind if covered under the tin shed but still subject to weather.

Regarding the Swift - it's in my hanger now with the wings removed.
I'm smoothing out some hanger rash and general touch-up.
Hopefully, it will be flying in a few months.

Right now, the Ferrari is on the lift getting a complete suspension/shock absorber/exhaust system rebuild. I'm also installing a new stereo system and cruise control.

The Cessna is getting new engine compartment seals and wheel pants.

I'm building a new workshop.

Doing some landscaping.

Trying to get ready for Brodak's.

Other than that, I have nothing to do.   LL~  LL~

Bob Z.

Online Robert Zambelli

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #8 on: March 25, 2017, 11:26:31 AM »
The FAA database says it's a 1961 model and is deregistered.

Correct as far as I know.
Registered to Mike Palladino.
Turns out, he's in my American Legion post.

Offline Dan McEntee

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #9 on: March 25, 2017, 11:34:50 AM »
     Looks like a good -project for a local high school or college A&P class to take on. Heck, the tires look like they are holding air!. If a guy were to take on the project, I guess the main question is, where do you start? Our local Craig's List has a similar plane that is supposedly airworthy ( and looks OK in the pictures) for about 7 grand. If the gentleman is still around and in your Legion post, I would get the full story behind it just to find out.
  Type at you later,
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Offline Mike Scholtes

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #10 on: March 25, 2017, 01:10:24 PM »
Bob, you must have been very good in some past life to enjoy the one you have now. You left out the stupendous job you are doing with the Brodak museum. Even though it is unlikely I will make it to PA to see it, I still appreciate the mere fact it will/does exist.

Great news about the Swift, will be ready for Oshkosh this summer. What a great project.

I had bee hives in both wings of my T-Craft, had to smoke them out before disassembling the plane for transport. My dad's garage became a repair hanger for the next seven years (thanks, Dad).

But cruise control in a Ferrari? Non e' necessario!

Offline pat king

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #11 on: March 25, 2017, 01:55:41 PM »
Poor baby needs some TLC. I hope you can take her home and bring her back to airworthy condition.

Pat
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Offline Phil Spillman

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #12 on: March 25, 2017, 02:42:35 PM »
Hi Bob, Neat report and I'll bet a future project of yours! You apparently personify the addage that is if you want a job done give it to a busy man! By golly Bob what ever do you do in your spare time?????

Phil Spillman
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Offline Fred Cronenwett

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #13 on: March 25, 2017, 03:16:57 PM »
www.landings.com shows N5048W not currently registered

Fred

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Online Will Hinton

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #14 on: March 25, 2017, 08:09:12 PM »
"But cruise control in a Ferrari? Non e' necessario!"

Isn't that done with a brick on the accelerator? LL~ LL~ LL~ LL~
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Offline FLOYD CARTER

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #15 on: March 25, 2017, 08:14:54 PM »
Some planes are definitely worth restoring. This was my most complicated project, a 1938 Focke-Wulf 44J.

This shows me working on a complete rebuild of the wings (4 of them..100% wood)

First day ready to fly picture.  I'm the one in the heavy parka!

Floyd in Oregon
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Offline Mike Scholtes

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #16 on: March 25, 2017, 08:32:47 PM »
Having lived in Italy I can tell you that Italian cars come delivered with a brick on the accelerator and a hand on the horn button. But man do they know how to drive!

That FW 44 is a worthwhile project all right! Wow! Floyd, did you do all or most of the work yourself? Is it still in active registry? I hope "yes!"

Offline FLOYD CARTER

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #17 on: March 25, 2017, 08:55:52 PM »
This FW44J is now in a museum in Germany (Klassiker bei Vintage Wings & Wheels..Worms, Germany).

This was a 7 year project!

The fellow in the middle, Wayne, made the first test flight.  I took it up for the 2nd flight.  I logged about 150 hrs. in this plane.

The fellow on the left is noted modeler Monty Groves.  He did not fly because his license was not current.

Floyd
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Offline FLOYD CARTER

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #18 on: March 25, 2017, 09:17:57 PM »
For those interested, you can see a picture of the FW44J in flight;

go to www.qrz.com

enter my ham radio callsign K6BSU in the space provided.

That takes you to my personal page, with biography.

Floyd
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Offline Mike Scholtes

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #19 on: March 25, 2017, 11:27:04 PM »
(Apologies to Bob Z for taking over his post - but we are at least still on the same general subject)

Thanks Floyd, nice pic of the FW in the air. I came within inches of buying a crated Bucker Jungmann in about 1980, wish to heck I had done it. Shipping from east coast to CA was the problem.

I see you lived in Los Altos. I was raised in Palo Alto. Do you know a fellow ham Herb Vanderbeek? Herb is in his mid-90s and still sharp as a tack. Herb worked with an electronics firm in Palo Alto in the 1950s and 1960s. I have been flying buddies with his son Bill for nearly 60 years.

Offline Chuck_Smith

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #20 on: March 26, 2017, 05:50:19 AM »
I'm impressed. Still has air in the tires.

YMMV, but Ive found that most of these orphans are better than they look. First and foremost - find the logbooks and paperwork. Without that you're in for a rough ride. Then the usual stuff...pull panels and do an inspection. Figure on all new cables and probably pulleys. 

Then the big one - stick the tanks and activate the sumps and collect the water. If you only get a cup or two maybe OK, but if there's any significant amount of water in before the stale fuel flows you most likely have all kinds of corrosion in the fuel system and that can get ugly/ expensive. Mufflers can suffer from condensation too.

Panel...meh, not exactly a known-icing cross country IFR machine. Radio, xponder, electric T&B airspeed and altitude would pretty much get you off the ground. If the VSI works, cool. An omni would be nice but as long as I could needle, ball and airspeed it in an emergency I'd fly it VFR.

Problem with this one is when you get done fixing it you still have a Cherokee. Unless it was part of Pussy Galore's Flying Circus not exactly the most exciting aircraft ever built.


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Online Avaiojet

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #21 on: March 26, 2017, 08:36:29 AM »
Quote
Problem with this one is when you get done fixing it you still have a Cherokee.

Chuck,

I don't understand this?


The Piper Cherokees are great aircraft. I know because I owned a 180.

I can't remember anything going wrong with that one and costing me money? I put plenty of hours in the 180 and it was fast for what it was. Safe aircraft and enjoyable to fly also.

Simply built and not a great deal of complex parts. Be interesting to know how popular they are today?

Thread brings back memories.

CB

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Online dave siegler

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #22 on: March 26, 2017, 09:26:21 AM »

Problem with this one is when you get done fixing it you still have a Cherokee. Unless it was part of Pussy Galore's Flying Circus not exactly the most exciting aircraft ever built.



That is the point.  For the same time investment you might be able to get an RV-5 project.   It would have to be real cheap. 

That airplane would not be sitting there if it was a Cessna 180, 170, swift, Yankee, or aircoup.

But when I was a kid, everyone wanted J3's and C 170's.  the airports were littered vagabond, cub crusers, side by side areoncas and tri-pacers/  Now they are in high demand. should have bought one.

Also I saw some real bad corrosion, so bad you could flick off the rivet heads with a fingernail.  This was on a flying airplane that came in for a paint job. 
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Online Avaiojet

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #23 on: March 26, 2017, 09:36:05 AM »

That is the point.  For the same time investment you might be able to get an RV-5 project.   It would have to be real cheap. 

That airplane would not be sitting there if it was a Cessna 180, 170, swift, Yankee, or aircoup.

But when I was a kid, everyone wanted J3's and C 170's.  the airports were littered vagabond, cub crusers, side by side areoncas and tri-pacers/  Now they are in high demand. should have bought one.

Also I saw some real bad corrosion, so bad you could flick off the rivet heads with a fingernail.  This was on a flying airplane that came in for a paint job. 


Dave,

I owned a 172 also and I can tell you from my experience, just an opinion mind you, the 180 was a far better aircraft.

Gotta remember, I never "played" with any aircraft I owned, I had them just for transportation.

I played with sports cars.

CB
"No one has ever made a difference by being like everyone else."

Marcus Cordeiro, The "Mark of Excellence," you will not be forgotten.

"Nothing is easier or more pathetic than being a Critic."  Donald Trumph, 5-13-17.

I look at the Forum as a place to contribute and make friends, some view it as a Realm where they could be King."

Owner of CFC Graphics. "Model Airplane Graphics from a Model Airplane Builder."

"I'd like to build a reputation, not be given one."
X-Files quote

"Ya gotta love it when a plane comes together."

Proverb 11.9  "With his mouth the Godless destroys his neighbor..."

"So popular, they named a television series after me."

"Perhaps the greatest challenge in modeling is to build a competitive control line stunter that looks like a real airplane."
David McCellan, 1980.

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Rush Limbaugh, 2015.

Offline Chuck_Smith

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #24 on: March 26, 2017, 12:23:24 PM »
Dave,

I owned a 172 also and I can tell you from my experience, just an opinion mind you, the 180 was a far better aircraft.

Gotta remember, I never "played" with any aircraft I owned, I had them just for transportation.

I played with sports cars.

CB

I guess if you only fly in moderate to severe clear.  Neither is reliable transportation.


It won't fly through ice , won't go over the weather and is to slow to go around it.
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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #25 on: March 26, 2017, 01:40:15 PM »
I guess if you only fly in moderate to severe clear.  Neither is reliable transportation.


It won't fly through ice , won't go over the weather and is to slow to go around it.

Chuck,

The 180 I shared with four other owners. One owner was a retired Captain. The 180 had a great IFR panel.

Doesn't mean you have to go IFR.

You can always land the plane and tie it down anytime you want.

I can remember one trip to FL with my Lake, The rain was constant and cloud cover was just over my head. Cars on the highway were going faster than I was.

We put the plane down. Tomorrow was another day.

CB
"No one has ever made a difference by being like everyone else."

Marcus Cordeiro, The "Mark of Excellence," you will not be forgotten.

"Nothing is easier or more pathetic than being a Critic."  Donald Trumph, 5-13-17.

I look at the Forum as a place to contribute and make friends, some view it as a Realm where they could be King."

Owner of CFC Graphics. "Model Airplane Graphics from a Model Airplane Builder."

"I'd like to build a reputation, not be given one."
X-Files quote

"Ya gotta love it when a plane comes together."

Proverb 11.9  "With his mouth the Godless destroys his neighbor..."

"So popular, they named a television series after me."

"Perhaps the greatest challenge in modeling is to build a competitive control line stunter that looks like a real airplane."
David McCellan, 1980.

"If you can't rise above, you destroy."
Rush Limbaugh, 2015.

Online Robert Zambelli

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #26 on: March 31, 2017, 12:03:54 PM »
Hi, All – thanks for all the great responses.
No, Mike – you didn’t take over my post. You just added some really interesting information.
Mike – I lived in Italy also. Milano for three years in the early 60s.
Went to high school and learned to drive there – in a 1961 Ford Galaxy. Talk about intimidating all those little FIAT 500s and 600s!
But, in my short stay in Milano, I really developed an appreciation for Italian cars. While I was there, I got to drive FIAT, ALFA, Abarth, Maserati, OSCA and Innocenti. Never a Ferrari or Lamborghini (I wouldn’t be the least bit interested in driving the latter)

Will – regarding your comment on cruise control for my Ferrari. Remember, it’s my everyday car and on long trips, my right foot gets tired. I’m also in the process of rebuilding the suspension, installing a new stereo and remote door locks.

Chuck –addressing your somewhat negative comments on the PA-151 and the Cessna 172 (I just acquired one, by the way), I flew my Piper from February, 1990 until I sold it in December, 2016. Many hours in IMC and some into icing (Not intentionally!). I never had a problem for two simple reasons: I never exceeded my piloting skills nor did I ever exceed the limits of the aircraft. If there was a hint of inclement weather on my route of flight, I stayed on the ground. But, I have gone over weather as well as around it.

Back to the original post, the abandoned Piper. The plane has not moved in more than 20 years. The engine has not run in more than 15 years. From what we could ascertain, the plane would need a major engine overhaul, all new instruments and avionics, paint, various sheet metal work and other parts. It definitely needs a new/rebuilt carburetor, starter, magnetos and alternator. There is no possibility that the plane can in any reasonable way be restored, unless someone is willing to put 30 to 35 thousand dollars into a plane that will be worth maybe 20 when finished.
I found out that it will have to be moved soon. I will probably move it to a local aviation scrapyard and part it out.
By the way, it still has air in the tires because they were inflated a week or so before I took the picture.


Online dave siegler

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #27 on: April 01, 2017, 04:00:41 AM »


Back to the original post, the abandoned Piper. The plane has not moved in more than 20 years. The engine has not run in more than 15 years. From what we could ascertain, the plane would need a major engine overhaul, all new instruments and avionics, paint, various sheet metal work and other parts. It definitely needs a new/rebuilt carburetor, starter, magnetos and alternator. There is no possibility that the plane can in any reasonable way be restored, unless someone is willing to put 30 to 35 thousand dollars into a plane that will be worth maybe 20 when finished.
I found out that it will have to be moved soon. I will probably move it to a local aviation scrapyard and part it out.
By the way, it still has air in the tires because they were inflated a week or so before I took the picture.



For 32K ish you can get one in annual with a mid time engine. 

Wow I just looked up what a overhaul cost for the engine, it's about $20k alone.  This probably does not include accessories, exhaust and all that

So if it was real cheap (nearly free), you could do a lot of your own work and were good a scrounging you could make it go.  But there are more worthy projects.

Dave Siegler
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Offline Chuck_Smith

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #28 on: April 01, 2017, 05:20:50 AM »
Reading  previous posts I can see how they were taken negatively and I publicly apologize.


Taken for what they are designed to be the PA28-140 and C172 (or even the C172XP) are  exceptional airplanes. They're exceedingly easy and pleasing to fly, easy to maintain and as dollars go in the aviation world - cheap to own. You can tie them up outside and not worry about them. Personally, I think the C172 is the better of the two. It's easier to board, more comfortable and the view is better from the captain's seat. Less bending over on the preflight too. YMMV.


The point I was trying to make and doing a poor job was that I took exception to the use of a non-pressurized, non-known-icing single as being reliable transportation. Especially, as you know, where I live where it seems like we taxi out at 39F OAT and a ceiling of 2K half of the year. And the elephant in the room... if you fly enough hours you'll lose an engine. No aircraft engine is 100% reliable, and that's he cold, hard fact. I lost one on a Beech 18. I also lost a cylinder on a single once. Neither was a harrowing experience, but had the engine died at night or IFR in a single things might have been different. One of my friends lost an engine in a C150 last year and crashed but thankfully he and his student where unhurt. Not many experienced pilots don't at least know somebody who had one stop turning.

Since I'm not financially equipped to own and operate my own personal King Air, any aircraft I've owned myself has been purely for fun, so I picked them for fun value.  Besides, if I need to go somewhere and time is not of the essence I vastly prefer winding through the mountains at night at 0 AGL with both turbos whooshing with all four Continentals clawing at the blacktop, with Radar Love cranking in surround sound. No pilot ever had a beautiful blond in a convertible smile at him either.

As far as my comment about it "still being a Cherokee", yep that was poorly communicated. I will say that for what I would use that aircraft for, for the time and treasure it would take to restore it you could own a nice tube and rag piece that would be a lot more fun, tons easier to work on and would have the third wheel where it's supposed to be. :)

Chuck


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Online Robert Zambelli

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #29 on: April 01, 2017, 10:35:47 AM »
For 32K ish you can get one in annual with a mid time engine. 

Wow I just looked up what a overhaul cost for the engine, it's about $20k alone.  This probably does not include accessories, exhaust and all that

So if it was real cheap (nearly free), you could do a lot of your own work and were good a scrounging you could make it go.  But there are more worthy projects.



Hi, Dave - 32K? Don't I wish!

I sold this Piper in December for 30K!
It was in PERFECT condition.
3100 TTAF
130 hours SMOH!
IFR
GPS
Two glideslopes
Two Bendix Navcoms
New interior
ADF (useless)

Bob Z.


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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #30 on: April 01, 2017, 01:00:50 PM »
Bob, back to your Ferrarri; since it IS your car, do all the customizing you want - I encourage the personalizing of each vehicle.  When I installed a walnut dash, consol, handmade walnut steering wheel, window cranks and doorhandles in a '66 MGB I caught all sorts of flak because it "Isn't concourse." 
Maybe not, but it was mine, and I liked what I did to it!  Had it 11 years and never enjoyed another car as much!
So...go for the customizing, and close your eyes when you let me drive it! #^ #^ ~^ ~^ ~^
John 5:24   www.fcmodelers.com

Online dave siegler

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #31 on: April 01, 2017, 02:34:33 PM »
Hi, Dave - 32K? Don't I wish!

I sold this Piper in December for 30K!
It was in PERFECT condition.
3100 TTAF
130 hours SMOH!
IFR
GPS
Two glideslopes
Two Bendix Navcoms
New interior
ADF (useless)

Bob Z.



She looks like a real honey.  
The engine compartment is real clean, you must have spent a lot of time an skinned knuckles getting to that. 

I was looking at Trade a Plane for prices, and and that is well trade a plane.
Dave Siegler
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Offline FLOYD CARTER

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #32 on: April 01, 2017, 04:32:04 PM »
Just an observation regarding aircraft engines.  They are terribly expensive to have them overhauled by a certified shop.  That would be required if the plane were used for something other than personal "fun flying".

Aircraft engines are basically quite simple.  If you are careful, it is easy to do a complete o'haul in your backyard shop!

I have done two aircraft engine overhauls, and I do not have any certificates allowing me to do this!  Nevertheless, I can't see anything "magic", as long as no shortcuts are taken.  The end result is as good as any certificated mechanic would do.
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Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #33 on: April 01, 2017, 05:57:25 PM »
Just an observation regarding aircraft engines.  They are terribly expensive to have them overhauled by a certified shop.  That would be required if the plane were used for something other than personal "fun flying".

Aircraft engines are basically quite simple.  If you are careful, it is easy to do a complete o'haul in your backyard shop!

I have done two aircraft engine overhauls, and I do not have any certificates allowing me to do this!  Nevertheless, I can't see anything "magic", as long as no shortcuts are taken.  The end result is as good as any certificated mechanic would do.

Who signed it off?
Crist
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Offline FLOYD CARTER

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #34 on: April 01, 2017, 10:56:06 PM »
If you won't tell, then I won't.
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Offline Chuck_Smith

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #35 on: April 02, 2017, 04:50:24 AM »

Aircraft engines are basically quite simple.  If you are careful, it is easy to do a complete o'haul in your backyard shop!



I'd suggest we preface that with "some". Aircraft engines can be some of the most complex, technical systems ever designed.
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Offline FLOYD CARTER

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #36 on: April 02, 2017, 09:29:31 AM »
True.  I would not attempt an R-2800.
AMA #796  SAM #188  LSF #020

Online Robert Zambelli

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #37 on: April 02, 2017, 10:22:02 AM »
Bob, back to your Ferrarri; since it IS your car, do all the customizing you want - I encourage the personalizing of each vehicle.  When I installed a walnut dash, consol, handmade walnut steering wheel, window cranks and doorhandles in a '66 MGB I caught all sorts of flak because it "Isn't concourse." 
Maybe not, but it was mine, and I liked what I did to it!  Had it 11 years and never enjoyed another car as much!
So...go for the customizing, and close your eyes when you let me drive it! #^ #^ ~^ ~^ ~^

Couldn't agree more!
When I painted my GTC yellow, I got all sorts of criticism for using a non-Ferrari color.
I installed Bosch coils, a GM alternator and Hayden cooling fans.
Also, an oil pressure idiot light.
I've had my GTC almost 42 years and never regretted the changes I made.
Bob Z.

Offline Chris McMillin

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #38 on: April 05, 2017, 12:28:23 PM »
I think a good O-360 can be had for $12K with fresh OH if one looks around enough. 320's too. I've found a 360 for my Knight Twister for that much. No accessories. Props I like really fresh though, I'm going to pay dearly for a Whirl Wind CS, new.
My MkI MGB is not bone stock but it's only period correct additions though I can't begrudge a guy a few mods. I alway thought a 71 with a small block Ford, a T5 tranny, a Prestige "coffee and cream" interior with a cloth Rover style top with kind of a Sebring style exterior motif would be cool.
Bob, the same time you bought the GTC I was trying to get my dad and anyone else to loan me 4000 bucks to buy a beautiful 30,000 mile 61 250 GTE. It was silver with oxblood interior and Borrannis. Oh, for what could've been. Heck, I couldn't afford a $1,400 E-Type!
Chris...
 

Online Avaiojet

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #39 on: April 05, 2017, 01:13:48 PM »
Quote
Heck, I couldn't afford a $1,400 E-Type!

I can't remember that far back when you could pick up a basket case E-type for only $1,400. Early 70's maybe?

CB

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Online Robert Zambelli

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #40 on: April 05, 2017, 03:40:42 PM »
I think a good O-360 can be had for $12K with fresh OH if one looks around enough. 320's too. I've found a 360 for my Knight Twister for that much. No accessories. Props I like really fresh though, I'm going to pay dearly for a Whirl Wind CS, new.
My MkI MGB is not bone stock but it's only period correct additions though I can't begrudge a guy a few mods. I alway thought a 71 with a small block Ford, a T5 tranny, a Prestige "coffee and cream" interior with a cloth Rover style top with kind of a Sebring style exterior motif would be cool.
Bob, the same time you bought the GTC I was trying to get my dad and anyone else to loan me 4000 bucks to buy a beautiful 30,000 mile 61 250 GTE. It was silver with oxblood interior and Borrannis. Oh, for what could've been. Heck, I couldn't afford a $1,400 E-Type!
Chris...
 

Hi, Chris - this might make you want to cry!! A quote from Ferrarichat:

"Ferrari market letter has the GTE asking price as $388,037 down from $414,190 in sept 2016.
I'm not familiar with the methodology but I guess that's for an average car, or an average of reported sales.

Not sure how relevant low mileage is to a 1960's car but a reportadly "super nice" example 4139 GT went at RM Paris for just over $500,000.
Offer prices in Europe vary greatly as does condition of the cars but the better ones like 4043 at Hexagon is offered at $555,000 and 3945 at Gipi for $500,000. These are of course offer side prices and i can't see bids and both cars have been on sale for a while. If you want to keep up, a subscription to the 250 GTE register and news letter is money well spent, IMHO.

Offline Steve Helmick

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #41 on: April 05, 2017, 03:50:59 PM »
Prius owners don't feel the need to modify their cars.   ;) ;) ;)  LL~ Steve
In 1944 18-20 year old's stormed beaches, and parachuted behind enemy lines to almost certain death.

In 2015 18-20 year old's need safe zones so people don't hurt their feelings.

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Offline Chris McMillin

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #42 on: April 05, 2017, 08:57:47 PM »
I can't remember that far back when you could pick up a basket case E-type for only $1,400. Early 70's maybe?

CB



Late 75, it was a 64 , triple white with mileage in the mid 40's.
Chriz...

Offline Chris McMillin

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #43 on: April 06, 2017, 04:03:41 PM »
Hi, Chris - this might make you want to cry!! A quote from Ferrarichat:

"Ferrari market letter has the GTE asking price as $388,037 down from $414,190 in sept 2016.
I'm not familiar with the methodology but I guess that's for an average car, or an average of reported sales.

Not sure how relevant low mileage is to a 1960's car but a reportadly "super nice" example 4139 GT went at RM Paris for just over $500,000.
Offer prices in Europe vary greatly as does condition of the cars but the better ones like 4043 at Hexagon is offered at $555,000 and 3945 at Gipi for $500,000. These are of course offer side prices and i can't see bids and both cars have been on sale for a while. If you want to keep up, a subscription to the 250 GTE register and news letter is money well spent, IMHO.

Yeah Bob,
When I lost my butt when American bought TWA I thought that someday I might have one still as in 2000 they traded in the 50K range, not surprising theyre 1/2 mil now and even though the 300 and 365 four seater are less I have a car price limit way below what they're selling for too!
Chris...

Online Will Hinton

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #44 on: April 06, 2017, 07:46:21 PM »
6 months after I lost my medical in 1978 and a ton of money with it I had the chance at two, that's TWO xke's for 4 grand!!!  The one was a coupe missing a bonnet, the other would run and had the bonnet from the coupe.  I almost cry when I think of missing that deal because of losing my business!  Oh, what might have been, as you said.
John 5:24   www.fcmodelers.com

Offline YakNine

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Re: Sad Piper - NOT model aviation.
« Reply #45 on: April 21, 2017, 09:26:32 AM »
There is a whole row of planes like that where I used to fly, they have timed out engines or expensive AD's not complyed with most of them are now scrap thanks to mouse @#$% corroding them away from the inside out. TJ
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