Question for Spiderwire experts

[Robert Zambelli]

I was given some Spiderwire and I'm a bit confused.
The label states 15 LB and also 4 Lb test dia.

How do the two numbers relate?

Bob Z.

[James Holford]

Its the same Diameter as 4lb monofilament

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[Wayne Collier]

Diameter of 4 pound mono like James said, but the strength of 15 pound.

[dave siegler]

its 15lbs. 

the other number backs into the diameter
It is has a diameter of .008 inches more or less (diameter of 4lb mono filament line)

so that is good 1/2A  line for me. 

5.3.5.1 Spectra Lines
Lines made of Spectra fiber, made of gel spun ultra-high
molecular weight polyethylene are permitted for sport
flying and demonstration purposes. Spectra lines are not
permitted in competition unless the specific rules for the
event flown expressly permit such use. The use of high
visibility yellow lines is recommended, but not required.
For sport and demonstration flying with two lines, Spectra
lines shall have the following strengths:
Aircraft Engine Watts Rated
Weight Displacement Spectra St.
24 oz. .09 300 20 lbs. .010”
40 oz. .25 450 40 lbs. .013”
64 oz. .40 600 60 lbs. .016”
75 oz. .75 750 100 lbs. .018

[mike londke]

its 15lbs. 

the other number backs into the diameter
It is has a diameter of .008 inches more or less (diameter of 4lb mono filament line)

so that is good 1/2A  line for me. 

5.3.5.1 Spectra Lines
Lines made of Spectra fiber, made of gel spun ultra-high
molecular weight polyethylene are permitted for sport
flying and demonstration purposes. Spectra lines are not
permitted in competition unless the specific rules for the
event flown expressly permit such use. The use of high
visibility yellow lines is recommended, but not required.
For sport and demonstration flying with two lines, Spectra
lines shall have the following strengths:
Aircraft Engine Watts Rated
Weight Displacement Spectra St.
24 oz. .09 300 20 lbs. .010”
40 oz. .25 450 40 lbs. .013”
64 oz. .40 600 60 lbs. .016”
75 oz. .75 750 100 lbs. .018

The issue I see is that Bob does not have Spectra he has Spiderwire which is Dyneema they are different. No mention of Dyneema anywhere in the AMA rules although the word Spectra is mentioned 3 times. Maybe I'm splitting hairs. Possibly this was one of the issues Brett was trying to solve with his current proposal on line material requirements, along with others? Dyneema will work fine for small models but we found the larger diameter to be more "stretchy" than Spectra when we used it on heavier models and combat planes.  I no longer use it. I for one am anxiously awaiting the contest board to approve Brett's proposal. It's high time to embrace something new. They are safe and thousands of combat matches over the years have proved it.

[Robert Zambelli]

Mike is correct - mine is Spiderwire.
My friend ordered one spool but they sent two so he gave me one.
Also, being moss green, it is INVISIBLE in grass. 
So, where is a good source for yellow spectra?
I could not find it in my local hardware store.

THANKS for all the clarification and help.   

Bob Z.

[James Holford]

Ebay.

I find it silly that butthead AMA limits it to only Spectra. 

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[Gerald Arana]

Mike is correct - mine is Spiderwire.
My friend ordered one spool but they sent two so he gave me one.
Also, being moss green, it is INVISIBLE in grass. 
So, where is a good source for yellow spectra?
I could not find it in my local hardware store.

THANKS for all the clarification and help.   

Bob Z.


Bob, try your local fishing store.....

Jerry

[dave siegler]

The issue I see is that Bob does not have Spectra he has Spiderwire which is Dyneema they are different. No mention of Dyneema anywhere in the AMA rules although the word Spectra is mentioned 3 times. Maybe I'm splitting hairs. Possibly this was one of the issues Brett was trying to solve with his current proposal on line material requirements, along with others? Dyneema will work fine for small models but we found the larger diameter to be more "stretchy" than Spectra when we used it on heavier models and combat planes.  I no longer use it. I for one am anxiously awaiting the contest board to approve Brett's proposal. It's high time to embrace something new. They are safe and thousands of combat matches over the years have proved it.

IMHO splitting hares.  The technology of these products is changing way faster than the rule book. 

Maybe the rule book should not talk about materials and talk about testing and inspection. 

Most 1/2 A airplanes were flown on Dacron thread and never listed in the rule book as far as  know. 
Spider wire is better compared to Dacron thread. 

yes the stuff hides in the grass.  But it is in every way superior to both fragile .008 metal and dacron line.     


I pull test it, fly it and have fun,  Inspect it often.

Will look to get spectra on next batch.   

[goozgog]

Hey Bob !

   I love the Spectra lines for 1/2A's but I
was having a hard time with tangles until
I made some special spools that separate the
lines.  Now I'm using the same set for months.

Hope the picture shows enough detail.

  My only problem with Spectra has been breakage
at the knots while pull testing. Using fishing
split rings and snaps seems to have solved this
but I pull the lines often.

Cheers! - K.

[Paul Smith]

IMHO splitting hares.  The technology of these products is changing way faster than the rule book. 

Maybe the rule book should not talk about materials and talk about testing and inspection. 

Most 1/2 A airplanes were flown on Dacron thread and never listed in the rule book as far as  know. 
Spider wire is better compared to Dacron thread. 

yes the stuff hides in the grass.  But it is in every way superior to both fragile .008 metal and dacron line.     


I pull test it, fly it and have fun,  Inspect it often.

Will look to get spectra on next batch.   

Old time SPORT 1/2A's used Dacron lines, but they were always illegal in competition.  AMA always required either stranded of solid lines in certain sizes.

As I see it, nobody can really say, for a fact, what kind of fish line it is after it's off the reel.  Sure, guys will say they know, but will their opinion hold up in a protest?  I doubt that will ever happen.  So as Keith says, just pull it.

[Larry Renger]

To minimize breakage at the knots, wet the line when pulling the knot tight. It will pull fully tight and thus not abraid later with slippage. 

[dave siegler]

Old time SPORT 1/2A's used Dacron lines, but they were always illegal in competition.  AMA always required either stranded of solid lines in certain sizes.

As I see it, nobody can really say, for a fact, what kind of fish line it is after it's off the reel.  Sure, guys will say they know, but will their opinion hold up in a protest?  I doubt that will ever happen.  So as Keith says, just pull it.

OK I sport fly 99% of the time, we have one or two contests at a reasonable driving distance and only ours has 1/2 combat.
I flew on Dacron for years, and never saw them in control line general. 

Just pull it and that is the deciding factor.  I'll make sure I use legal lines if I ever fly in contest. 

[Wayne Collier]

Ebay.

I find it silly that butthead AMA limits it to only Spectra. 

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Agreed. Spectra is a brand name. There are good products of other brands. Bad knots or glued knots are probably more of a concern than brand name. I’ve used spyderwire for a decade (but probably less flights than some of you get in a few seasons). I never use it for lead outs.

[James Holford]

Heck I fish with 30lb and 50lb Power Pro braid.  Hauled fish with tons of grass and muck that weighs more than what our toy planes would ever pull to be a concern.   Its all in the knot!!! Cause the wrong knot will cause the line to slip. But then again... our planes are not pulling nearly that much.

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[John Carrodus]

The stuff MUST be tied with special fishing knots developed for braid by fishermen that will not slip. Spit on the braid as you pull the knot up tight to stop line damage inside the knot. Go to your fishing store or team up with a mate who already uses the stuff for fishing or flying. A chain is only as strong as it's weakest link. The non slip knot is vital. I also double loop the ends of the lines to combat usual wear and tear at those points. Tight lines!

[Robert Zambelli]

I pull tested the line from my original post - it broke at around 8 pounds.
Yes, I did multiple tests.
And, it DID NOT break at the knot.

Gooz - what is your line rating and how much do you pull test?

Bob Z.

[goozgog]

Hey Bob,

  With 12 lb Sufix 832 made into
43 foot lines, I get about 2 inches
of stretch when I pull hard on the
handle. I'm guessing , maybe, eight
pounds of pull.
  Whatever I'm pulling,
it's far more than my 9 oz plane ( Cox.TD.049 )
will ever stress these lines.
I have never felt any stretch when flying.

Cheers! - K.

[John Park]

Old time SPORT 1/2A's used Dacron lines, but they were always illegal in competition.

Just an aside: a basic trainer I made for a friend (KeilKraft Champ with a Mills .75) flew as well on 35 ft. 15 lb. Spectra lines as on 25 ft. Terylene (i.e. Dacron), and with a much more positive feel.  I was an instant convert.

[Carl Cisneros]

Here is something I found on line..................

What is the difference between Spectra and Dyneema?
Dyneema has a slightly different molecular structure than Spectra and higher breaking strength in the larger diameters. It displays slightly better wear characteristics in heavy use areas, but has more elasticity than Honeywell's Spectra 1000. This fiber is popular in Europe and is gaining popularity in the US.

Carl

[dave siegler]

Agreed. Spectra is a brand name. There are good products of other brands. Bad knots or glued knots are probably more of a concern than brand name. I’ve used spyderwire for a decade (but probably less flights than some of you get in a few seasons). I never use it for lead outs.

Spectra isn't a brand name it is a material type.  Honeywell makes it as a raw fiber like Kevlar or Lycra.   Others package it into fishing line ropes and such. 

[Brent Williams]

Just buy legitimately sourced spectra material from PowerPro. 

PowerPro is well known, fully tested, and totally trusted to be superior to .018 stainless lines in tortuous fast combat flying. 

Standard PowerPro:  https://www.powerpro.com/content/powerpro/northamerica/us/en/homepage/PDP.P-POWERPRO.html

MaxCuatro PowerPro:  https://www.powerpro.com/content/powerpro/northamerica/us/en/homepage/PDP.P-MAXCUATRO.html

[Wayne Collier]

Spectra isn't a brand name it is a material type.  Honeywell makes it as a raw fiber like Kevlar or Lycra.   Others package it into fishing line ropes and such.

True in the sense that Honeywell makes it. Honeywell decided to market it as spectra to distinguish it from similar products. It is to my knowledge an excellent product.

My point is that there are other trustworthy products available. My personal opinion is that rule makers should allow for that up front.

I use dyneema kite strings, which like spectra is polyethylene with some other fibers mixed in.