Putting engine bearers BACK INTO a model?

[Curare]

Hi All, I've got a Vector 40 model that had been converted to electric - not the best install i might add - and I've been considering converting it back into a glow model as I have a OS 25VF sitting around that might be good to use in it.

There are remnants of the old engine bearers in the 'battery' bay, so I assume they'd need to come out.

Has anyone re-converted a model? What would be the best procedure to getting new bearers in?

[Motorman]

Not sure an OS25 will pull a Vector 40.

[M Spencer]

RASP , if you want to remove the beares from the ply . It'll go to the glue . IF you keep it FLAT . Patiance . like an acksaw . Quitely does it .
Then your best stick or bit of metal , with 40 & 60 then 80 & 100 / 120 wet n dry . SQUARE . A SHARP Chisel or three , quietly . With your
THUMBS behind the chisel . Unless the planes red . Youd be lucky nota haveta take the top block off , back past the spar . Butit can bedone .

Displacement Vs Weight . If its light the piped VF would have a go at it . The Olde FSr will pull 50 Oz Od , on a 9 x 6 or 9 x 4 whenits blowing .
As long as you can run quick if your taking your fustrations out slaming the controls around . A Dozen leaps in one flight . Calm Down & Fly the Corners .
60 ft Cr to Cr od or 58 . on 7 strand .018 .

Cans of degresser , paper towles , Acetone , paper towles  , Carbon Tet etc perhaps . BUT the ' Paper Towels ' should rub then have NO RESIDUE , before its ready to glue . White Cloth is Good Too .
Then Epoxie / Fibreglass resin or other two pot , and a heat gun to flow it out , If the Temps under 25 or 30 . Thinnede Acetone delays set maybe , I P A for thinner , sets hard in 24 hours . Two Coats .
IF theres a tank fixed , for petes sake BLOCK the Tube Ends till finished .

[katana]

Would it be too obvious to suggest using a nylon or alloy engine mount secured to the firewall and leave the bearer remnants behind for strength?

[Ken Culbertson]

Hi All, I've got a Vector 40 model that had been converted to electric - not the best install i might add - and I've been considering converting it back into a glow model as I have a OS 25VF sitting around that might be good to use in it.

There are remnants of the old engine bearers in the 'battery' bay, so I assume they'd need to come out.

Has anyone re-converted a model? What would be the best procedure to getting new bearers in?

I am curious what is wrong with the electric conversion that makes you want to convert back?

Ken

[Rusty]

Would it be too obvious to suggest using a nylon or alloy engine mount secured to the firewall and leave the bearer remnants behind for strength?

BINGO!!  That will work.  I have built several old kits that had the engine mount beams and I didn't want the engine upward, so I cut the beams off with the firewall, laminated that with 1/8th plywood and used a nylon engine mount.  A year ago I built a Top Flite "red box" P39 and did exactly this to move the engine sideways.     

[Dennis Toth]

Greg,
I think the OS 25VF on pipe would work with the Vector 40. As for the current electric as Ken asked what is the issue? You might want to let the group know how it is falling short of your expectations and see if anyone has an answer. You might just need to swap out the original motor with something stronger or a different battery pack or add an active timer.

Best,    DennisT

[Curare]

Hi guys, just to confirm, yes, it's a piped VF that I want to put into this model.

As regards the electric conversion, there's nothing wrong with it per-se, it works as intended, but for sport flying I find glow a bit more 'fun' than electric. There's no question that it's a good means of propulsion for competition ships, but for a general sport model, it lacks charisma.

Flying electric models is reminiscent of using an appliance. Effective, consistent and clean, but lacking in soul.

I should point out that I've been flying electric models in competition in F2B and F3A since 2009, so I have some experience.

[Dennis Toth]

Greg,
I agree there are some disadvantages to electric. For me I like the easy when flying alone but you have to plan the flying time, get things charged then discharge some if you don't get to go that day. With glow you can kinda grab and go anytime the conditions move you.

Best,   DennisT

[Ken Culbertson]

Greg,
I agree there are some disadvantages to electric. For me I like the easy when flying alone but you have to plan the flying time, get things charged then discharge some if you don't get to go that day. With glow you can kinda grab and go anytime the conditions move you.

Best,   DennisT

Have you tried Li-Ion batteries?  They are not anywhere near as big a problem when they are left charged.  I have been keeping a set charged all the time for spur of the moment.  After a year they are all still doing fine.  I don't know what the limits are but a week has been the normal.  If I know I will be out for a couple of weeks I will run most of them down to storage.

Ken

[M Spencer]

Whadevayado , Pre Glue BOTH surfaces of any joins , wipe off the excess after a while clamped .

A bit of hardwood / ply / alloy / steel ? ? sheet each side , with cardboard under ( between ) so as the paint dost go bunged . Check theres no burrs beforehand . Like glass pin heads . So have it all clean .
IF theres bearers behind the firewall , a scarf joint ( or lap ) to them , about 25 degree to horizontal . and use HEART hardwood ( Rock Maple ? ) Masking each side of whatevers in there , before getting the rasp out ,
you can re mask if you fang it , so you dont scourmark the wood . But a corase file will cut bare timber & likely slide over varnished , final clean to doublers with doublesharp chisel , used like a spoke shave , more or less .

Sounds like a comercial nylon mount onto the bulkhead'd be way easier , maybe a brace Fwd of to bulkhead , so ass it wont loosen . The Folkert in P A M P A has a backplate mount , to copy . Be easyer still , if O S hasem .
file:///C:/Users/PublicInternet/Downloads/SN_Magazine_SEP_OCT_2010.pdf


Precision Aerobatics Model Pilots Association
https://pampacl.org › stuntnewsdownload › SN_M...
PDF
1 Oct 2010 — PAMPA Web site. It ... PAMPA Products and/or the PAMPA website. Any ... Here's an actual photograph of the original Folkerts Speed King SK3 that.

bit like this ,

As in a backplate with the flange about a inch bigger circumferance , Lee Machine Shop'd  do one , if you wanna spend a pound to save a penny . Better Vibe dispersal ? ?

[jerry v]

Greg,
You can make firewall from G10 or FR4 material .093 inches thick. Engine can be mounted to this firewall by the regular nylon engine mount. Engine also can be mounted directly by the engine backplate bolts trough the firewall from the fuel tank side into the engine. Or have a custom made backplate with flange to be bolted to firewall. Firewall mount will give you more options to locate the engine down or 45 degrees sideways. Also same firewall can be used to mount electric motor when you decide to go back to electric power. If you have existing remnants of the original engine bearers - cut the slots in the firewall and slide the firewall onto the bearers. It will be stronger joint. If you will locate firewall far enough from the nose you can use different engines and electric motors simply mount them with different spacers.

Jerry

[Robert Zambelli]

Greg and Jerry:
I've been using the plastic mounts or single bolt mounts for years and I will never go back to wooden beam mounts.

I make the firewall out of 3/16 Z-Ply and secure it to the plywood doublers with epoxy, 3/32 dowels and gussets.

This leaves the entire tank compartment open, facilitating vertical tank location.
I can post photos if you're interested in my method.

Bob Z.

[Curare]

I'm curious, some pics would be great!

Greg and Jerry:
I've been using the plastic mounts or single bolt mounts for years and I will never go back to wooden beam mounts.

I make the firewall out of 3/16 Z-Ply and secure it to the plywood doublers with epoxy, 3/32 dowels and gussets.

This leaves the entire tank compartment open, facilitating vertical tank location.
I can post photos if you're interested in my method.

Bob Z.

[Peter in Fairfax, VA]

The bearers broke just aft of the engine in my Pathfinder.  The method I used to remove the partial bearers was a red hot spatula inserted between the bearers and the fuselage. All glues I've seen will yield to a hot knife.

You will need to assess the level of disassembly you will tolerate,  For example, some bottom and/or top sheeting may need to be removed to get at the bearers, and formers may require the same.

Best of luck.  Project does seem possible.  The repaired Pathfinder served me well in 2023 competition.

Peter 

[Robert Zambelli]

I'm curious, some pics would be great!

Hi, Greg.
Yes, I will gladly post some photos of my mounting system as soon as I return home.
Bob Z.