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Author Topic: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.  (Read 19781 times)

Offline Blaine Buchtel

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Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« on: December 20, 2016, 03:52:16 PM »
I'm interested in drawing and building a C/L biplane which could do a quality pattern. Any thoughts about what design features might make this possible? Any input positive or negative would be appreciated!

Offline Mark Scarborough

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #1 on: December 20, 2016, 04:13:52 PM »
ther is some information on the site, do a search on here and you should turn up some information, John Miller designed and flew one a few years back that was reasonable
For years the rat race had me going around in circles, Now I do it for fun!
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Offline Mike Scholtes

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #2 on: December 20, 2016, 04:14:48 PM »
Tom Niebuhr has done it for you. Search for "Vagabond" on this forum for plans and discussion. There is also the "38 Special," a very capable biplane, kitted by maybe Brodak. Claus Maikis in Germany has a very pretty biplane on his "Ukie" web site with plans available. I assume you are talking about a .40 size and up model, not half-A or something that size.

Offline Blaine Buchtel

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #3 on: December 20, 2016, 04:36:23 PM »
I am indeed wanting a .40 or larger model.

Offline FLOYD CARTER

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #4 on: December 20, 2016, 04:39:07 PM »
Have a look at a Stearman dating from the 40's.  JC Yates had the first one, powered by an Orwick 64.  I think Don Hutchinson has plans.

Floyd
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Online Brett Buck

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #5 on: December 20, 2016, 04:45:45 PM »
I am indeed wanting a .40 or larger model.

  You pretty much have to have a big one. Someone mentioned John Miller's biplane design. He took the same approach I did, specifically, high aspect ratio to reduce the induced drag and to provide more roll damping for the amount of wing area. If you are going to design one, that's whre I would start.

      Brett

Offline Dennis Saydak

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #6 on: December 20, 2016, 05:19:01 PM »
Don Hutchinson's Stearman is a beauty and it was published in FM magazine. Iy is patern proven. Tom Dixon also has a Pitts Special plan available. His Pitts is straightforward to build but it needs a .60 for power.
Just when you think you're getting ahead in the rat race.....you find the rats just get faster! MAAC 13120L

Online Motorman

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #7 on: December 20, 2016, 05:24:36 PM »
40 size so, each wing would be about 300 Squares? I guess a bi-slob has 600 sq. if you could keep it from flip flopping and such.

MM

Offline Air Ministry .

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #8 on: December 20, 2016, 06:15:54 PM »
Was a page in A.M. or M A N on " The 59 er " back in the 60s . So club flying developing fox 59 powered aerobatic / stunt Bipes .

If anyones got / recalls it , would they post it here , please ??????????

Copostellas THING was high placed in the euro Champs . Might be your best bet if your looking to fly F2B with it .







Im inclined to build a 59er if someone finds the thing . a dimensioned sketch was on it . have to be classic , if not old time legal .  >:(

Online David Hoover

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #9 on: December 20, 2016, 07:08:12 PM »
And there's 'Biceps', one I always wanted to build but man, what a lot of wing ribs!

http://www.airplanesandrockets.com/airplanes/biceps-article-plans-apr-1969-AAM.htm

Life is simple. Eat. Sleep. Fly!
Best, Hoovie

Offline Jim Svitko

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #10 on: December 20, 2016, 07:32:10 PM »
I have the Biceps plans.  One day I may get around to building one but that would be quite a project for me.  I have other planes I want to build and no time for everything.  If I decide to do it I would see about getting the wing ribs laser cut.

I also wondered about doing the wings in foam to reduce building time but I am not sure if the increased weight would be too much.  And, would wing strut attachment be more of a problem with a foam wing?

Offline john e. holliday

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #11 on: December 20, 2016, 08:12:06 PM »
I have the 38 Special and it does a very respectable pattern.   Still working the bugs out on Tom's Vagabond.  The Bi-Slob needs to be reconfigured, to do a competitive pattern, but it will do the pattern.
John E. "DOC" Holliday
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Offline Robert Zambelli

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #13 on: December 20, 2016, 09:08:42 PM »
A few years back, I was a consulting engineer for Agusta Helicopter in Coscino di Costa, Italy.
I always timed my trips so that my meetings would end just before the weekend. That way, I could fly with Luciano and his friends.
I saw the Falco fly and it was amazing - Actually, Luciano was amazing, an incredibly smooth flyer.
He was European champion six times, mostly I believe with biplanes.
I never saw the Puma but the Falco was powered with an OS Surpass 48.

Luciano gave me the plans that Matt posted - see that he signed them to me. I still have them.
When I worked in Italy, I was fortunate enough to become friends with Luciano, Clemente Cappi, Alberto Maggi and Massimo Semoli. All really fine people.

But, to the topic at hand, a properly set up biplane works - works very well!

Bob Z.



Offline Trostle

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #14 on: December 21, 2016, 12:01:09 AM »
Hutchinson Stearman

Not only does that Hutchinson Stearman look great, it flies quite well.  In the hands of Bart Klapinski, I believe it won the OTS event at the VSC several years ago.  And it did a presentable modern pattern as well.  It is based on the Palmer/Yates design from Air Trails. 

Keith

Offline Robert Zambelli

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #15 on: December 21, 2016, 08:10:36 AM »
Staggerwing.

  This one flies very well.

  SAITO 56, three station retracts, take-apart.


   Bob Z.


Offline TigreST

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #17 on: December 21, 2016, 09:12:33 AM »
Tony Bagley
Ontario, Canada

Offline john e. holliday

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #18 on: December 21, 2016, 09:47:01 AM »
Elwyn Aud should still have my version of the Sheeks Staggerwing.  Much better plane than this old pilot.
John E. "DOC" Holliday
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AMA 23530  Have fun as I have and I am still breaking a record.

Offline TigreST

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #19 on: December 21, 2016, 10:08:53 AM »
Here's a link to Claus Maikis "Duetto" plans at Hippocket:

http://www.hippocketaeronautics.com/hpa_plans/details.php?image_id=2450

Tony Bagley
Ontario, Canada

Offline TigreST

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #20 on: December 21, 2016, 10:14:18 AM »
Steve Helmick...was the "Dancing Girl" discussed some years ago?  A design out of the U.K.?...or is my mind still gone?

Tony Bagley
Ontario, Canada

Offline Will Hinton

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #21 on: December 21, 2016, 10:32:15 AM »
Was a page in A.M. or M A N on " The 59 er " back in the 60s . So club flying developing fox 59 powered aerobatic / stunt Bipes .

If anyones got / recalls it , would they post it here , please ??????????

Im inclined to build a 59er if someone finds the thing . a dimensioned sketch was on it . have to be classic , if not old time legal .  >:(

The 59'er was my design, and was actually an accidental success.  But it WAS a success as far as a decent pattern.  I do not have any plans for it, but I think I can recall enough to sketch it out.  While Brett went high aspect ratio to conquer the drag thing, in my (very) rookie knowledge of aeronautics, I went thinner airfoil.
My big old Fox 59 drug that thing around in some horrific wind a few times, so I guess it worked.
I built the thing in 1964, flew it for a couple of seasons before going "hi tech" as my buddies called it.
My building techniques were not the greatest, and I eventually had to retire it to the burn pile because of fuel soaking problems.  (That big old Fox about shook it apart that third season.)
One thing Al Rabe mentioned in his article about it was the tail wag in square corners, but I think as I look back that more than half of that was a rookie stunt flyer's overcontrolling.  Al's rudder would likely solve the problem.
My place is a train wreck right now because of our fresh move, and my new shop is still in the organizing stage, but once I get some clear time I'll look up which AAM magazine it was published in.  (Not as a construction article, but In Al's article.  That same article featured Jack sheeks' Stagger wing and a cropduster by another pilot.
I'm thrilled that some of you noticed the bird, and when I get situated here I'll be more than happy to furnish you all I can.  My cell is 419-966-2036 or you can message me here.  email is wlhint@centurylink.net
John 5:24   www.fcmodelers.com

Offline peabody

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #22 on: December 21, 2016, 10:45:58 AM »
Steve Buso designed, and Johnny Duncan built, a bipe several years ago....high aspect ration.....

Have fun!

Offline Elwyn Aud

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #23 on: December 21, 2016, 10:52:48 AM »
Elwyn Aud should still have my version of the Sheeks Staggerwing.  Much better plane than this old pilot.

Almost forgot about that one!

Offline Elwyn Aud

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #24 on: December 21, 2016, 11:06:25 AM »
Bart Kaplinski did pretty well with his Fleet biplane flying in Old Time at VSC.

Offline Trostle

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #25 on: December 21, 2016, 11:44:43 AM »
Bart Kaplinski did pretty well with his Fleet biplane flying in Old Time at VSC.

Elwyn,

Do you have a photo of John Calentine's Travel Air.  Published in MAN, Jan 52, by Jim Hunt (Bob Hunt's dad).  John flew it several times at VSC.  Did a credible OTS pattern.

Keith 


Offline Trostle

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #27 on: December 21, 2016, 11:56:57 AM »

(Clip)

 Al's article.  That same article featured Jack sheeks' Stagger wing and a cropduster by another pilot.

(Clip)


The two page article on bipes that Al did was in the Jun 73 issue of American Aircraft Modeler.  Al compiled notes from several flyers including Jack Sheeks, Jean Pailet, and Will Hinton.  Will's "59er" looks pretty good.

Keith

Offline Trostle

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #28 on: December 21, 2016, 12:18:52 PM »
Steve Helmick...was the "Dancing Girl" discussed some years ago?  A design out of the U.K.?...or is my mind still gone?


The Dancing Girl was published  in MAN, Feb 75, by Peter Dominic Miller, from England.  He discusses the evolution of the design, using negative incidence on the top wing (as in deBolt's Bipe) going from 10% wing section to 18%, and a follow up on his articles on biplane design in Aeromodeller, Jul 74, and his Dutchess in Aeromodeller, Aug 74.  Miller suggests that the Dancing Girl is the result of a long line of biplanes, lots of trial and error and recommends not changing anything.  This would be a good place to start.  .40 power, plans are available from the AMA plans service.

Keith

Offline TigreST

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #29 on: December 21, 2016, 02:55:58 PM »
Just scrolling through my down loaded plans...there's one here called "Biceps" by Donald Yearout.  Fox .59 is mentioned (outlined) in the nose.  Looks like maybe a copy of a magazine plan...April 1969 American Aircraft Modeler page 26 and 27.

FYI
Tony Bagley
Ontario, Canada

Offline TigreST

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #30 on: December 21, 2016, 02:58:43 PM »
The Dancing Girl was published  in MAN, Feb 75, by Peter Dominic Miller, from England.  He discusses the evolution of the design, using negative incidence on the top wing (as in deBolt's Bipe) going from 10% wing section to 18%, and a follow up on his articles on biplane design in Aeromodeller, Jul 74, and his Dutchess in Aeromodeller, Aug 74.  Miller suggests that the Dancing Girl is the result of a long line of biplanes, lots of trial and error and recommends not changing anything.  This would be a good place to start.  .40 power, plans are available from the AMA plans service.

Keith

This "Duchees"



Link to the hippocket plane is here:

http://www.hippocketaeronautics.com/hpa_plans/details.php?image_id=1639
Tony Bagley
Ontario, Canada

Offline Walter Hicks

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #31 on: December 21, 2016, 05:21:51 PM »
I have built and flown the Biceps with ST .60 it has flaps top and bottom wing. 50" span over 700 sq in wing area! I have a Laser cut kit now as the first one was a lot of work cutting ribs and
half ribs. I used a plywood template and simply cut the ribs out that way. Not too difficult to build and flew pretty well. I had the control horns set up way to
fast on the first one. I know for a fact that Don H Stearman flies very, well. So I guess it depends on what you wanted to have a biplane for.
If I were going to compete I would use Dons Stearman with an LA .46 or equivalent. The Biceps is Classic legal however so you could use that also.

This is a picture of a picture so not very clear of my Biceps around 1979



« Last Edit: December 21, 2016, 07:39:01 PM by Walter Hicks »

Offline Brent Williams

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #32 on: December 21, 2016, 05:52:16 PM »
John Miller designed a good looking stunt biplane called the "Two-Bits."

http://stunthanger.com/smf/stunt-design/almost-finished-with-it-my-stunt-biplane/?all


Laser-cut, "Ted Fancher Precision-Pro" Hard Point Handle Kits are available again.  PM for info.
https://stunthanger.com/smf/brent-williams'-fancher-handles-and-cl-parts/ted-fancher's-precision-pro-handle-kit-by-brent-williams-information/


Offline Joe Bowman

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #34 on: December 21, 2016, 06:20:59 PM »
I will echo what some others have said about Don Hutchinson's Stearman as I have flown it and it flew very well. I am going to build his profile Stagger Wing this winter to campaign next year,  It should also fly very well.

Offline Air Ministry .

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #35 on: December 21, 2016, 06:44:09 PM »
Inclined to try this. With thin symetrical airfoil .




Offline Air Ministry .

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #36 on: December 21, 2016, 06:48:32 PM »

Offline Blaine Buchtel

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #37 on: December 22, 2016, 03:03:41 PM »
I want to thank each of you who responded to my post concerning what would make a competive aerobatic biplane. I never thought I would receive so much usefull information! There is much " food for thought" in your posts. I' m so glad I asked for your input. I 've already ordered some of the recommended plans and expect to use and design an excellent plane based on the work of others. Thanks again and Merry Christmas to all.

Offline Bruce Shipp

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #38 on: December 22, 2016, 03:30:06 PM »
Chuck Holtzapple (sp?) was working on one interview in the early 90s. I remember seeing build pics in SN and asked him about it at the 90 nats if memory serves. 

Any memories or pics of Chuck's bipe?

Offline Will Hinton

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #39 on: December 22, 2016, 04:06:09 PM »
Hi Bruce!  I remember Chuck's bipe, that was how he and I met.  It was a sleek looking ship, but when he and I shared information at the '90 nats, he hadn't flown it extensively if memory serves me right.  Buried somewhere deep in my "stuff" are a couple of pictures, and also a picture of Chuck and I holding my last 59er together at that same nats.  That was my first nats and probably my most memorable one; what a time I had!
I'll keep on the lookout for the tote with pictures in it and then go through it.  If I find those, I'll post them here on a new thread.  But...says he as he shakes his head, don't hold your breath, this place is a train wreck right now.
John 5:24   www.fcmodelers.com

Offline JohnCallentine

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #40 on: December 23, 2016, 12:45:21 PM »
Here's a couple pics of the Jim Hunt Travelair.  LA46 power. Does a nice old time pattern but no snappy turns!

Offline Akihiro Danjo

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #41 on: December 23, 2016, 07:02:49 PM »
This is the best bipe stunter I have ever watched. Mr,T's TIGHT, powered by Saito 82(?). He got 10th place at '11 Japan Nats. Not only flew very well but also was very beautiful and won the most beautiful model of the year prize. No plan, sorry.
Aki

Offline Jared Hays

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #42 on: December 23, 2016, 07:52:26 PM »
This is the best bipe stunter I have ever watched. Mr,T's TIGHT, powered by Saito 82(?). He got 10th place at '11 Japan Nats. Not only flew very well but also was very beautiful and won the most beautiful model of the year prize. No plan, sorry.
Aki


Thats awesome

Online Dan McEntee

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #43 on: December 23, 2016, 09:07:30 PM »
   I was going through some plans just a few minutes ago and came across one called The Zephyr. I didn't unfold it all the way but it's a profile bipe in the vain of the .38 Special, I think. Does this one ring a bell with anyone? Not sure how I got the plans. I have seen a couple of .38 Specials fly in our area and they fly QUITE well. Another one on my to do list. The Hutchinson Stearman in the full fuse version or his profile version would be in there also along with his Staggerwing. A Beucker Jungman or Jungmeister would thrill me also especially the Jungmeister done up in Bevo Howard colors!
   I just spent the day clearing off my work bench, and laying out a wing for a box stock Twister. been wanting to do a Mike Gretz memorial model in the box art colors. When that is framed up and off the board, I might have to get a profile bipe out of my system also. We have a new member in our club that has been emailing with me with questions along the lines of this thread so maybe I oughta do this while everything is fresh in  my head!
   MERRY CHRISTMAS and HAPPY NEW YEAR!
   Dan McEntee
AMA 28784
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Offline Blaine Buchtel

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #44 on: December 25, 2016, 05:27:44 PM »
One thing I was really wanting from this post was some idea of what percentage of airfoil " cord vs. camber" for a great flying biplane. I would have thought a thinner airfoil would be needed, but I see many of the suggested designs have a fairly thick wing. What's up with this?  Regards,  Blaine

Offline Air Ministry .

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #45 on: December 25, 2016, 07:00:17 PM »


I Hope thats Pefectly Clear , then .   mw~ n~

Quote
Adding camber doesn't necessarily reduce aerodynamic drag; it depends on the airfoil shape. If too much camber is added, the flow over the airfoil may not stay attached to the wing even at an angle of attack of zero. When this occurs, we say the flow has separation over the airfoil, if the entire top of the wing has separation, the wing is stalled. Wings with camber don't as a result have the ability to produce more lift in general. As an example, the C-5 is a heavy lift aircraft used by the US military; in order to produce the lift needed, one might think it uses a cambered wing, but its wing is symmetrical. Cambered wings will produce lift at zero angle of attack, but as mentioned, too much camber can also be a bad thing.

CRIKEY .

GAP Vs Chord was regarded as ' the issue ' due to ' interfearance ' , as they called it . Generally Acepted Gap ( Between Wings ) should exceed ( Dimension of ) Chord , to avoid
interaction between the airflow of the ' stack ' . Presumed to cause problems . Likely as at its inset irregular , thus oscillatory .

Maybe withem closer it doesnt , even if it is ' interfearance ' ing , or Interacting , more correctly . ( oops a pun ) .


A merely personal perspective is it aint neccesarilly neccesary to get optimum lift . As thered be a fair bit available . If looks ( amoungst other things - Like Center of drag per wing vertical distribution , and its constancy  %^@)
wernt considered .
Thus do we consider it Two Monoplanes Flying in Fixed Formation , or Seperate from a mono plane . :( A Split Monoplane would have  ' outside camber ' / ' Flat Inside ' ( or the reverse ) wings , if the projected area ( with no stagger )
was considered purly as in plan view . S?P
Or perhaps more sensably Two Planes (  :## Bi Plane ! ) of half the thickness of a monoplane ( approx )  viewd same .

Id Think Thick Wings , to avoid interfearance , like Biggles . Would Need a Gap exceeding 10 x the Thickness ( Thereabouts ) of a wing .



Whats BIGGLES Doing in a salmson B2 . %^@ U S Air Service used these in France , in ' the great war ' . Great for the industrialists obviously . But im not to sure who else benifitted from it .  :-\

Were Americans Subjected to the whiles of BIGGLES , or is that more a Empire & King sort of delusion .  :-\



Be Straightforward to base one on , having strong ties to America . Especially when the petrol ran out and you had to jump . :( U.S. Mail Plane .



Youll Note this is a good Kiwi Pilot .Actually gives you some idea of ' visualiseation ' of the airflow over one of these , as it gets a bit out of whack here & there .
Did a Mercury Tiger Moth from kit that WON Junior Scale at the N.Z. Nats . ( It was The Only Entry  LL~ LL~ )( said in Mag " It Flew Well " DONT BELIVE ALL YOU READ . Bloody Apalling .
UNTILL I put a OS 10 in it & a BellCrank & Elevators .
Demo at the Primary School , on a r idge so often a breeze there , Had Me Trying a Loop then A Lap Inverted . No Bother . with the free flight declanage & Flatt Bottomed wings . %^@
Engine Cut upwind , and as the fields were manicured had a half lap run to downwind , stop , and drop the tail . Another Total Fluke. unpublished this time . LL~ S?P

Have a plan & Two OS 10s. Only one should be necessary . ;D

Old Tyme , Theres a  De H 82 with big elevators ( as they did then ) & NO Flaps , But A symetrical Airfoil about almost 3/4 I think ish thick . Maybe for a .15 ?? , will tryn digit outn  getta picture , for here . Of The Plan. and Date .
as they say its a ' Stunt ' plane . Model Aircraft or Aeromodeller . 1954 or 6 maybe .
« Last Edit: December 25, 2016, 08:12:04 PM by Matt Spencer »

Online Brett Buck

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #46 on: December 25, 2016, 07:04:23 PM »
One thing I was really wanting from this post was some idea of what percentage of airfoil " cord vs. camber" for a great flying biplane. I would have thought a thinner airfoil would be needed, but I see many of the suggested designs have a fairly thick wing. What's up with this?  Regards,  Blaine

   I agree with you - I would make the airfoil thinner on a biplane. The only danger is making it too sharp, otherwise, I think efforts to reduce the parasitic drag are to the better.
 
     Brett

Online Dan McEntee

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #47 on: December 25, 2016, 08:39:39 PM »
     As I understand things, wing alignment is pretty critical on a bipe. I don't know what the .38 Special plans and instructions say in that respect, and have not read any of the mentioned construction articles in a LONG time. More or less make bottom wing at 0 degrees and top wing just a hair negative, or something like that? If I build a bipe soon it will be the .38 Special 'cause I got the kit, then do the two SIG biplanes just for nostalgia reasons. I figure anything I can learn out of this will help the SIG models.
    HAPPY HOLIDAYS!
     Dan McEntee
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Offline Air Ministry .

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #48 on: December 25, 2016, 09:12:07 PM »
Tutae Wera .



Dosnt Censor period grammer , when you put it in Maori .  ;D
http://www.venturapublications.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=257
A Battle of Britain Spitfire called that , too .

 A WACO . gee Wilikers , theyre still in Buisness . http://www.wacoaircraft.com/waco-ymf-5 Bespoke Aeroplanes Even , Airplans to some .  S?P

the fin motif appears synomonous with my Avatar ,  :-X .

Been plenty of kits & plans for em , One a 72 in R C , as a base ?? H^^


http://eaaforums.org/showthread.php?4935-1941-Waco-UPF-7


RIGHTIO , if you Get to Work , you could haver it done in a week or two . LL~ ( Left the inadvertant R in , as seems more Apppropriate .)
« Last Edit: December 26, 2016, 05:59:05 AM by Matt Spencer »

Offline Chris Wilson

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Re: Precision Aerobatic capable biplane.
« Reply #49 on: December 26, 2016, 03:19:53 AM »
Do tandem wing models qualify?

There are some interesting designs if they do!
MAAA AUS 73427

You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life.
 Nothing in life is so exhilarating as to be shot at without result.  It's not enough that we do our best; sometimes we have to do what's required


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