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General control line discussion => Open Forum => Topic started by: RC Storick on January 13, 2007, 01:29:34 PM
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It's not everyday I build a pine wood derby car but my boss asked if I would. It seems that his kids race pine wood's and they also have a parents race. So off to the hobby shop I went. This pine wood car costs around a $100 dollars. Unbelievable! It was 28.00 just for the wheels, I got a wheel shaper for 35.00. The car wasn't much about 6.00 but all the other stuff to with it to make a top notch car was out of site! No wounder why kids don't do these type things anymore..
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The Scout race...
And the sad part is the kids that win, I would say that 99% of them did not even build the car. The Dads build them and get them dialed in. The the dads that are the Scout leaders go set the track up the week before the race and get the cars dialed in for there kids. The other kids do get the chance to have there car tested and tuned so to speak. One good thing is the track is hooked up to a computer so it takes all the guess work out of who won.
The shape of the car does not really matter. It is getting the weight and wheels straight and the axles polished.
I always made sure my boys did most of the work with me showing them how. Guess that is why he never got 1st place.
Some of the cars I saw looked something Sparky painted. Very nice, I am sure a 8yr old did not paint it.
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My daughter's cars,,,
The Miss Piggy sports car was a winner the first year out, made from the basic block.
The surfboard was a MonoKoted quick build for a fatherless friend.
The old MonoJet was my first powered model.
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Sorry, I'm lost here.....
What is a Pine Wood Derby Car?
How big are they? No scale on the pics........
Pse explain for a Brit!
Cheers
Harry
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Wow!! 100 bucks for a pinewood derby car!! Ib the late 80's when my kid was in Cub Scouts they cost about 6 bucks with wheels. I gave my Son a shop rag doped with Armor All, I had him wipe the wheels and body after every heat. He got 1st place.
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Sorry, I'm lost here.....
What is a Pine Wood Derby Car?
How big are they? No scale on the pics........
Pse explain for a Brit!
Cheers
Harry
Hi Harry,
Our Boy Scouts (and a few other groups) have a series of races using these cars. They are made from a block of pine and are "gravity" powered. It has been QUITE a while, but I know there are rules that set the weight, etc., of the cars.
I would say they are about 8" long and the wheels are about 1 1/4" in diameter. I'm guessing here but that will give you the idea.
Bill <><
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Wow!! 100 bucks for a pinewood derby car!! Ib the late 80's when my kid was in Cub Scouts they cost about 6 bucks with wheels. I gave my Son a shop rag doped with Armor All, I had him wipe the wheels and body after every heat. He got 1st place.
I am not kidding. The wheels were expensive the alignment rack and the wheel truing machine were out of sight. The car was only $6-9.00 but thats the cheapest thing. Weights. graphite and all the other things to go with it cost $97.40 I am not kidding!
I will post a pic when I get it done.
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http://www.maximum-velocity.com/pro-wheelxt.htm
http://www.abc-pinewood-derby.com/wheel-shaver.htm
Derek
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Ahhh! The Pinewood Derby, where young boys get the 1st taste of racing, and the fact that life is not fair and just. Where a kid can work his butt off to build the car himself, and be justifiably proud of it,only to get beat by a kid who couldn't tell you what the axle that the wheel spins on is made of ( because he never saw it till Dad brought it home from work already to race).
In our pack you were required to run the stock wheels, axles, and use the kit wood block. There were a lot of single mom's who had no woodworking tools, or grasp of what was required. the 1st year I knew we had a problem. The cars ranged from the square block colored with markers - to high-tech Pro-stock looking wonders. No surprise who won. To help even things out we decided we would have a couple of pack meetings that were Pinewood Derby Workshops, starting 2 months before the race.
I would bring my tabletop bandsaw, scroll saw, belt/disc sander, and assorted other tools. We set up stations, had templates for various designs, and helped the boys draw the shape they wanted on the block. They then got to put on safety glasses and stand next to the person who used the power tools to cut the blank, while we explained things like grain direction, feed speed, different saws for different types of cuts. You know the stuff they used to teach you in Shop class- back when they had Shop class.
With a rough cut blank in had each kid got a sheet of 80, 100, and 240 grit sandpaper, and a full sheet of directions that gave step by step detailed instructions for shaping, filling, sanding, priming, sanding,sanding, sanding,painting and final assembly. It even had some secrets like axle polishing and wheel alignment,graphite lube, etc.
The results were great, the cars looked better, the kids were proud of their handiwork, and the races were more competitive. Yes the Dad built cars still tended to dominate, but they didn't blow out thefield anymore. We also had lots of prizes for things like Coolest Looking, Wildest paint, Most original, and one called "I did it all Myself".
My son learned early on that if he wasn't totally sick and tired , arm sore and covered in dust the of sanding on his car, he didn't get to spay the paint on. in fact he learned that after he was sick of sanding- he got to spray primer on- then sand it all off. Do that a few times and the thing starts to feel pretty slick. All primer and color was cheap spray paint from home Depot, but they look pretty good.
It was a good experience, and I think a bunch of kids did learn some basic woodworking- and that makes them pretty rare in todays world.
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I have heard that some places also have "Dad" races so that Pop can get the competitive urge satisfied. I wonder if they have a "BOM" rule VD~
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I have heard that some places also have "Dad" races so that Pop can get the competitive urge satisfied. I wonder if they have a "BOM" rule VD~
Well my Boss will be DQed if there is. Anyone who knows him will know its my work. They have all seen my models and seen them fly. On Saturdays that they riders edge (riders training) the have the parking lot blocked off. I fly during lunch for exhibition.
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Ahhh! The Pinewood Derby, where young boys get the 1st taste of racing, and the fact that life is not fair and just.
It was a good experience, and I think a bunch of kids did learn some basic woodworking- and that makes them pretty rare in todays world.
Those kids got a better "prize" than any thing anyone ever won in a Pine Wood Derby.
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When my son was in cub scouts we also had pinewood derby's. Most of the kids fathers were from aerospace, Pratt & Whitney and Hamilton Standard so you know what happened. I myself am a Tool & die maker for Westinghouse Power Systems so we had a anything goes race for the fathers. The cars had to meet the stock dimensions but the rest was fair play. I will not go into what the modifications were cause some kids might read this.
Bob Hills in CT.
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My Pinewood Derby cars won the "Craft" award both years, and some parents thought my Dad built them. Truth was, it was and is a parent/child event, and my Dad was very involved in teaching me to use the coping saw for shaping, carving blade for detail shape, sand paper, filler, primer, and then the paint. We used dope (suprise) and they looked as good as our stunt models (more suprise). I was also into scale so my Dad's lovely shape of a Midget racer gave way to a BRM F1 car like in Grand Prix (it was 1967). It had weight over the rear axles, a full cockpit and velocity stacks. I made all of the stuff, and shaped the car with a lot of supervision and picky " do it again's" from Dad.
(One kid made his look like Craig Breedlove's "Spirit of America" as I recall.)
Dad did do all of the lead sinker smelting and pouring, so I guess I didn't do it all!
In all it was a wonderful experience and I will always remember the close work with my Dad.
Chris...
PS My Mom took the accusations the worst, Dad and I thought those Dad's were just jealous. All of my friends knew the score.
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We did it in Indian Guides.
We had a four-lane track with a starting elevation of about 6 feet. It dropped to floor level in about 20 feet, followed by a 40-foot level straightaway. There was a photocell scoring system that gave 1st, 2nd, and 3rd place. Of course, it had the usual 4-peg release system.
5 ounces maximum weight, seperate appearance points.
They had to use the basic block kit and stock wheels.
Cost was about $3 plus paint.
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I thought this was suppose to be fun, guess I was wrong..... ???
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My first experience with a Pinewood Derby was the year I had become Cubmaster. ::)
We restarted a defunct Pack and I had never seen a Pinewood Derby. We got the car and I showed my son how to use a coping saw, a chisel, and sandpaper. He told me what he wanted to do and I showed him how to do the first front fender...the rest he did. I helped him remove plastic burrs from the wheels. We had to fix one axle also because it had a burr that touched the wheels. Graphite we got by rubbing a pencil on the axles. He painted it black (with my model paint) and applied some decals. He had no intentions of cheating, nor would I have let him. You form no good memories by cheating to win.
My son went on to become Eagle and is a Technology teacher...he still has that car. He picked up a lot of good skills and values from Scouting, and is Scoutmaster of his local Troop. We have been involved with Scouting for over 25 years now, although I'm not as active as I used to be.
I think his car cost ~$5.00.
George
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I thought this was suppose to be fun, guess I was wrong..... ???
Yes, it is supposed to be fun. But, some fathers think it is a win at all costs. My son did his own car as the troup leader did not let the boys do it at home. He had a shop and showed the boys what to do and let them do it. It was all done with hand tools. My sons troup did not win the championship, but, they had fun. DOC Holliday
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I remember all 3 of my boys and their Pinewood Derby cars. I got pretty involved in the oldest boys car until my wife asked me who was supposed to be making this and who's race was it anyway? Very good point but was still hard to backoff. It turned out to be a good learning lesson for all of us. I was very involved with Scouting for many years. All 3 boys made Eagle, I was a Scoutmaster for a few years and a Eagle myself. Alot to learned from Scouting but I fear that their days are numbered. There are those who would want to see it destroyed for the values Scouting embraces. It will be a sad day when this happens.
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My brother and I both built cars, Dad built one too right along with us, he would demonstrate the step we were doing then watch over us as we accomplished that particular task. My dad was so proud of what we did he still has all three of my cars in his display case at home,they have been on display for over *cough cough* 35 years now. Lots of fond memories there.
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I was the Federation Chief in Indian Guides, and we did pine car.
Surprizingly, our Cub Scout Pack never did pine cars in my childhood.
However, I remember when I was was about 4 or 5 years old, one of my parent's friends (a Ford Engineering Manager), was telling about the full-size test track he had constructed in his home. Also lubrication research and precision alignment. Aimed, of course, at assuring that his son could not lose. All of this circa 1950. Win-at-any-cost is not new.
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My oldest son and I were active in Cub Scouts and did the Pinewood Derby thing. Being a modeler, we certainly had some advantages, but his car and mine always finished behind cars that used all purchased parts. Usually, these folks only painted the bodies. Everything was preshaped, weighted and machined.
I did some checking after Sparky mentioned that $100 could be spent on a Pinewood racer. I found CNC machined wheel and axle sets for almost $50.
Generally, racers do what is necessary to win. Many times it involves considerable $. Look what has happened to C/L racing in the U.S. Very few things are as big a blast as a 3-up C/L race. However, every time a new event is created, it dies; either from cost to win or from total domination of the event by a few 'pros'.
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My three sons all did the Pine Wood Derby thing in the Cub Scouts. The rules in our area (northern Illinois) specified that you had to use the stock nail axles and the stock plastic wheels that came in the box with the pinewood body block. No modifications were allowed. So the total kit cost under $10. The boys had fun carving, shaping, sanding, painting, and decorating the cars. They never won many races, were disappointed when they lost, but overall it was a good learning experience.
One year they had a parents "anything goes" race but you still had to use the stock wheels. The wife wanted to get a shot at the guys so she badgered me into building her a car. I loaded it up with lead until it weighed almost a pound (heavier is faster-that's why the regular rules have a weight limit). She was thrilled to win and mercilessly harassed the losers (guess women can also be poor winners). mw~
DennisV
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Hey maybe someone could come up with an ARF Pinewood Derby Car!!! ~>
For the purists who would want to still compy with the BOM, there could also be a ARP (Almost Ready to Paint) y1
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Hey Alan they already have them. I was a youth leader at our church for many years and helped many kids with their cars but I could never get them to go fast. HB~>