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Author Topic: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France  (Read 2505 times)

Online Mike Griffin

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2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« on: August 22, 2021, 03:13:53 PM »




Offline john e. holliday

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #1 on: August 22, 2021, 09:29:26 PM »
Got to watch him fly it at the NATS.  It was awesome.  Still wonder how he kept from dragging the rudder on out sides. D>K
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Offline Gary Dowler

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #2 on: August 23, 2021, 12:34:43 PM »
There are a few great sayings, but three that stand out are:

1.  Never start a land war in Asia

2.  Never go up against a Cicilian when death is on the line

3.  Only Paul could go to the worlds with a B-17

  LL~ LL~ LL~ LL~ LL~

Gary
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Offline dale gleason

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #3 on: August 23, 2021, 01:39:11 PM »
I'm sure all understand the impact that our Team made in France, but, just to be sure, Paul Walker flew a B-17 and Billy Werwage flew a P-47.

dg

Offline Gary Dowler

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #4 on: August 23, 2021, 04:29:53 PM »
That was 22 years ago.

Must we all live in the past?

I don't constantly mention when I did the Lancaster it was only the 2nd ever 4 engine stunter to compete at a Nats behind this B17..

Why would anyone remember that..the Idiots in Australia got jealous and Banned it after round 3.


But in Europe and America doing a project like this scores..
They banned your airplane?? On what grounds?   I’ve given up trying to understand what goes on in the heads of many Australians.

I’ve not seen a picture of your plane. Can you post one?
Gary
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Offline Steve Helmick

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #5 on: August 24, 2021, 06:58:54 PM »
As I recall, PJ's airplane was a few inches over the FAI wingspan limit, and he used  4 Enya .19's which may have been over the engine displacement limit at the time, which may (or may not) have been 10cc's. I believe so, while AMA rule was .65 cu. in. NOW it's 15cc's of course, or a .91.

Paul's 4 OS .15FP's should have been legal, and I'm sure that's at least part of the reason he used .15FP's and not .21FP's. I'd wonder if the FAI technical crew would have checked Paul's engines for being legit 2.5cc's...just to be dicks.  y1 Steve
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Offline Howard Rush

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #6 on: August 24, 2021, 09:52:34 PM »
I'm sure all understand the impact that our Team made in France, but, just to be sure, Paul Walker flew a B-17 and Billy Werwage flew a P-47.

Yeah, but Billy had to turn back after the square eights.
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Offline Dan Berry

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #7 on: August 24, 2021, 10:02:44 PM »
Yeah, but Billy had to turn back after the square eights.

This wins the Internet for a day.
Brilliant!!!

Offline PJ Rowland

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #8 on: August 29, 2021, 09:37:01 PM »
I see a question :

It ran 4 x Enya 19s = a .76 in displacement, so was more than legal. It was 1 inch overspan by the 2.0m wingspan FAI rule.. I honestly made the mistake and it was a legit rule breech. I didnt know about the rule when I built it and it was only the tip shape that accounted for the overspan.

The problem was: I only found out about the overspan issue 1 week before I was due to leave for the nats, I opted NOT to modify it and chance talking to the E.D.
I notified the E.D prior to the event starting I had a problem and decided to take a backup plane anyway.

The ED took a look, deemed no advantage was to be had at 125oz and also asked at the pilots briefing if anyone objected to me flying it despite it being illegal but explained the rule breech. Noone objected and I flew it Round one and Round two, scoring to be in 4th place.

At the start of Round 3 someone lodged an official protest against the plane legality and it was upheld I was asked to withdraw or be disqualified. I couldn't restart the event with my backup because it was best of Rd1+Rd2 added to the best of Rd 3& Rd4 . I would have placed last by only making one official flight.
My competitors knew this and it was a dog act, I also have spoken to everyone involved in making that choice and explained that they made the wrong choice by allowing it in the first place, I can accept a rule breech but allow ME to fly in the comp with a legal plane dont rule it ok.. then withdraw the choice and retroactively disqualify me.


But all props to Paul.. way better than mine but I respect how hard it must have been.. just getting the engines reliable was a 6 month project..

If you always put limit on everything you do, physical or anything else. It will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them.” - Bruce Lee.

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Online Brett Buck

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #9 on: August 29, 2021, 10:01:59 PM »


But all props to Paul.. way better than mine but I respect how hard it must have been.. just getting the engines reliable was a 6 month project..

     It was no small feat for the B-17, either. The best part of that (and I will emphasize that I had *nearly nothing* to do with this project aside from admiring it) was the panicked phone call from Howard, at my desk at work, trying to head off Paul's phone call

 Howard calls  - "you should hear what Paul wants to do with my engine mounts, he wants to cut them off to isolate the vibrations, isn't that awful!"
BB - "I don't know, that sounds like a pretty good idea to me, I can see that might be a problem"
HR - "No, it's a terrible idea, we made the spar and all 4 engine mounts together in one peice out of carbon fiber"
BB - "Yes, that makes sure that any and all vibration goes to all 4 of them. It was a good notion, but if it doesn't work...:
HR - etc.

5 minutes later, phone rings, it's Paul
PW - "Hey what do you think about cutting off the motor mounts and using fiberglass ones"
BB - "Howard just called me about that, trying to talk me into talking you out of it, but it sounds like a good idea to me"
PW - "I was going to do it anyway, I think the engines are talking to each other through the spar"
BB - "Yes, its 4 engines attached to a tuning fork"
PW - "Howard is really upset with me"
BB - "Yes, I got that..."
...

     Awesome.

    Brett

Offline Howard Rush

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #10 on: August 30, 2021, 12:45:02 AM »
I don't remember that, but I remember envisioning Paul, cutting tool in hand, having apprehension similar to that one would have just before sex change surgery.
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Online Brett Buck

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #11 on: August 30, 2021, 01:02:01 AM »
I don't remember that...


   That's the brain protecting you from a traumatic memory.

    Brett

Offline Gary Dowler

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #12 on: August 30, 2021, 01:21:20 AM »
This thread is getting better all the time!!!  LL~ LL~ LL~

Gary
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Offline PJ Rowland

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #13 on: August 30, 2021, 04:36:26 AM »
Well.. I originally bought 4 brand new enyas out of England, only to need to buy another x 6 Brand new ones just to find x4 ones that were actually the same.

That was after running in all 10 independently, then finding the 4 that were the same tightness, and could be tuned the same..


If it WASNT for Paul showing that it *could* be done I would never have bothered, and would never again. But the advice I received from the B17 project allowed me to "be competitive" ( yes I did have a 1st place )

The central bladder tank with pressure regulators and misting the venturi was like no other system.
I ended up doing Pauls "other option" of 4 independent tanks which did work very well in the end and was very repeatable.

All 4 engines consistently used a different amount of fuel and afterwards 4 tanks were made that did have the variation in fuel levels.


Brett will confirm this im sure from his experiences,

Although I never flew the B17, mine even at 125oz was actually relatively easy to fly ( beyond the pull ) . Well balanced and great constant thrust from the 4 engines.

If you always put limit on everything you do, physical or anything else. It will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them.” - Bruce Lee.

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 I Yearn for a world where chickens can cross the road without having their motives questioned.

Online Brett Buck

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #14 on: August 30, 2021, 11:04:02 AM »

Brett will confirm this im sure from his experiences,

   I emphasize again, I had *nearly nothing* to do with the B-17, that was Paul with Howard's support.

I did have to whip it around for about 10 laps with engine #4 running at about 5% power and the others stopped, which took about all I had.

    Brett

Online Paul Walker

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #15 on: August 30, 2021, 11:35:10 AM »
     It was no small feat for the B-17, either. The best part of that (and I will emphasize that I had *nearly nothing* to do with this project aside from admiring it) was the panicked phone call from Howard, at my desk at work, trying to head off Paul's phone call

 Howard calls  - "you should hear what Paul wants to do with my engine mounts, he wants to cut them off to isolate the vibrations, isn't that awful!"
BB - "I don't know, that sounds like a pretty good idea to me, I can see that might be a problem"
HR - "No, it's a terrible idea, we made the spar and all 4 engine mounts together in one peice out of carbon fiber"
BB - "Yes, that makes sure that any and all vibration goes to all 4 of them. It was a good notion, but if it doesn't work...:
HR - etc.

5 minutes later, phone rings, it's Paul
PW - "Hey what do you think about cutting off the motor mounts and using fiberglass ones"
BB - "Howard just called me about that, trying to talk me into talking you out of it, but it sounds like a good idea to me"
PW - "I was going to do it anyway, I think the engines are talking to each other through the spar"
BB - "Yes, its 4 engines attached to a tuning fork"
PW - "Howard is really upset with me"
BB - "Yes, I got that..."
...

     Awesome.

    Brett

When I started the very first engine I immediately knew there was going to be an issue. There was a slight structural resonance with the engine running. I KNEW what the issue was, but found it hard to act on immediately. Howard had spent so much time building those mounts, and was very proud of them ,and I really appreciated his work, which also included the wing spar joint, the featherweight cowls (which has another funny story with them) and the glow power driver to start the plane. So I was not going to cut them off without a lot of consternation. However, I knew what had to be done. I spent the time to consult with a friend at work, a Dr. Lewin, whose specialty was aircraft structural dynamics. After an hour of discussion and a few calculations, it confirmed my worse fear. The carbon mounts had to go. Yes, I mentioned this to Howard, and you can only guess the response!  They were his babies, and I knew his attachment to them. But they work perfectly on F2D planes was his response. However, they don't run 4 of them on an F2D plane!

Howard called Brett. Out of courtesy to Howard, I called Brett also. Very shortly after that the Dremel tool with the dangerous disc was fired up, and off came the first carbon mount. In its place went a cheapie RC radial mount, held on by four 4-40 bolts. Howard came down to my house, and we fired up the motor, and it was VERY OBVIOUS to me the problem had been solved. No hint of structural resonance at all. Still he pleaded to not cut the remainder of them off. The next on on that wing panel was cut, removed, and replaced with a radial mount. The two ran perfectly together. Shortly after, all four had been removed and replaced. After that, the motors ran perfectly, with respect to structural resonance, from that point on.

There were always issues with the slightest "junk" in the fuel plugging the regulators, and pressure cutoff switches. The pressure cutoff switches was an unexpected necessity. It turns out when the bladder ran out of fuel, the number one engine (inboard) would stop first as the head of fuel was pushing away from that position. The bladder pressure pushing against that head of fuel was enough to trigger the regulator to function, but when the bladder pressure stopped, the head of fuel in the fuel line was a negative gage pressure on the regulator, so it closed. Number 2 engine was "similar", but there was still a small head of fuel in the fuel line to number 1 engine pressing on the regulator. However, that was small enough to not allow the regulator to function. The problem came in engines 3 and 4. The head of fuel became high enough that the regulators would not shut down and it would run until all the fuel in the lines and been used buy these two, and the head pressure was low enough to shut the regulators down. Howard came up with the idea of making a pressure sensitive switch than when it reached the bladder off head pressure it would close, and stop all fuel flow. When it was working perfectly, it shut down almost instantly when the bladder was out of fuel. HOWEVER, this switch was extremely sensitive to any little bits of junk in the fuel, and the filters put in place were not fine enough to filter the problem crud. At the world champs, I flew seven official flights, and six shut down perfectly. There was one flight though that left the number 4 engine on for what seemed like an eternity.  Then there was the Nat's the following year. It malfunctioned more often than not.  However, with all this complexity, it made the starting sequence, a breeze, once the exact procedure was learned. At the world champs, on seven official flights, I flipped the props a total of only thirty times.

This required the fancy power panel Howard made. It had four separate circuits, one for each motor. Each had a meter to show the current draw, denoting a possible flooded motor. Each motor has a fuel cutoff switch mounted for easy access during starting. I also has a fuel mist atomizer for starting. The starting sequence with like this: Make sure all cutoff switches are in the off position. Load up the fuel bladder. Spray fuel mist in number one engine. Turn power on to that engine. Flip prop and fire motor. Repeat when it runs out of prime. Spray mist into venturi and check for a bump. Once bump established, turn off power to that motor. Repeat three more times on the other motors. When all checked out, signal for start, and turn on number one power. Flip prop, and when it fires open the cutoff switch. The exact timing of the switch opening is learned as too soon and it will flood the motor, and too late, is well, too late. Once running, turn power off to one, and power up on two. Flip, open cutoff switch, and on and on until they are all running. Once running the start up power panel is removed and it is ready for flight.  It's just that simple!!! y1

With it running, the line tension was significant. It could go from that to next to no line tension when the number 4 engine would run on with a fault in the number 4 pressure switch. Lot's of backing up required.  I guess that problem came at the World champs because Billy's P-47 had to turn back and I didn't have proper escort, and that problem was a result!

Then there is the story about how long it takes to get a flight once it comes out of the car.  I has to go in the car in many pieces because it is so big. There was assembly time, and engine test run time, and that all added up to at least an hour.  On one of the official flights, I was in the middle of that process when a significant rain storm came by. Some one from the US contingent produced a plastic tarp to cover us while we were working on it . All was going fine until I moved and a whole lot of the collected water from that tarp ran down the back of my pants!!  Had to keep going as my flight time was coming. finally it was ready. It sat on the ready line, covered by the tarp. The supporters insisted that I get under a small tent to stay dry prior to my flight. I accepted, but never told them I was already quite wet on my backside!! But I stayed dry. ::)

There are still plenty more of those B-17 stories, all seem funny now.....But then????

Offline Howard Rush

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #16 on: August 30, 2021, 12:08:33 PM »
All in all, I think I was more of an impediment to the B-17 than a help.  It was a wonderful experience.  Besides being a good stunt flier and trimmer, Paul is a superb engineering project manager. 
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Offline dale gleason

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #17 on: August 30, 2021, 12:53:27 PM »
I passed Paul as he headed toward the parking lot in Muncie. In his arms were many B-17 parts.  I thought he had crashed it. His facial expression looked like he had. Sadly, I told him how badly I felt about what had happened.

 He smiled broadly and said, "it's okay".

Talk about stoic. 

dg





 

Online Dan McEntee

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #18 on: August 30, 2021, 01:10:04 PM »
When I started the very first engine I immediately knew there was going to be an issue. There was a slight structural resonance with the engine running. I KNEW what the issue was, but found it hard to act on immediately. Howard had spent so much time building those mounts, and was very proud of them ,and I really appreciated his work, which also included the wing spar joint, the featherweight cowls (which has another funny story with them) and the glow power driver to start the plane. So I was not going to cut them off without a lot of consternation. However, I knew what had to be done. I spent the time to consult with a friend at work, a Dr. Lewin, whose specialty was aircraft structural dynamics. After an hour of discussion and a few calculations, it confirmed my worse fear. The carbon mounts had to go. Yes, I mentioned this to Howard, and you can only guess the response!  They were his babies, and I knew his attachment to them. But they work perfectly on F2D planes was his response. However, they don't run 4 of them on an F2D plane!

Howard called Brett. Out of courtesy to Howard, I called Brett also. Very shortly after that the Dremel tool with the dangerous disc was fired up, and off came the first carbon mount. In its place went a cheapie RC radial mount, held on by four 4-40 bolts. Howard came down to my house, and we fired up the motor, and it was VERY OBVIOUS to me the problem had been solved. No hint of structural resonance at all. Still he pleaded to not cut the remainder of them off. The next on on that wing panel was cut, removed, and replaced with a radial mount. The two ran perfectly together. Shortly after, all four had been removed and replaced. After that, the motors ran perfectly, with respect to structural resonance, from that point on.

There were always issues with the slightest "junk" in the fuel plugging the regulators, and pressure cutoff switches. The pressure cutoff switches was an unexpected necessity. It turns out when the bladder ran out of fuel, the number one engine (inboard) would stop first as the head of fuel was pushing away from that position. The bladder pressure pushing against that head of fuel was enough to trigger the regulator to function, but when the bladder pressure stopped, the head of fuel in the fuel line was a negative gage pressure on the regulator, so it closed. Number 2 engine was "similar", but there was still a small head of fuel in the fuel line to number 1 engine pressing on the regulator. However, that was small enough to not allow the regulator to function. The problem came in engines 3 and 4. The head of fuel became high enough that the regulators would not shut down and it would run until all the fuel in the lines and been used buy these two, and the head pressure was low enough to shut the regulators down. Howard came up with the idea of making a pressure sensitive switch than when it reached the bladder off head pressure it would close, and stop all fuel flow. When it was working perfectly, it shut down almost instantly when the bladder was out of fuel. HOWEVER, this switch was extremely sensitive to any little bits of junk in the fuel, and the filters put in place were not fine enough to filter the problem crud. At the world champs, I flew seven official flights, and six shut down perfectly. There was one flight though that left the number 4 engine on for what seemed like an eternity.  Then there was the Nat's the following year. It malfunctioned more often than not.  However, with all this complexity, it made the starting sequence, a breeze, once the exact procedure was learned. At the world champs, on seven official flights, I flipped the props a total of only thirty times.

This required the fancy power panel Howard made. It had four separate circuits, one for each motor. Each had a meter to show the current draw, denoting a possible flooded motor. Each motor has a fuel cutoff switch mounted for easy access during starting. I also has a fuel mist atomizer for starting. The starting sequence with like this: Make sure all cutoff switches are in the off position. Load up the fuel bladder. Spray fuel mist in number one engine. Turn power on to that engine. Flip prop and fire motor. Repeat when it runs out of prime. Spray mist into venturi and check for a bump. Once bump established, turn off power to that motor. Repeat three more times on the other motors. When all checked out, signal for start, and turn on number one power. Flip prop, and when it fires open the cutoff switch. The exact timing of the switch opening is learned as too soon and it will flood the motor, and too late, is well, too late. Once running, turn power off to one, and power up on two. Flip, open cutoff switch, and on and on until they are all running. Once running the start up power panel is removed and it is ready for flight.  It's just that simple!!! y1

With it running, the line tension was significant. It could go from that to next to no line tension when the number 4 engine would run on with a fault in the number 4 pressure switch. Lot's of backing up required.  I guess that problem came at the World champs because Billy's P-47 had to turn back and I didn't have proper escort, and that problem was a result!

Then there is the story about how long it takes to get a flight once it comes out of the car.  I has to go in the car in many pieces because it is so big. There was assembly time, and engine test run time, and that all added up to at least an hour.  On one of the official flights, I was in the middle of that process when a significant rain storm came by. Some one from the US contingent produced a plastic tarp to cover us while we were working on it . All was going fine until I moved and a whole lot of the collected water from that tarp ran down the back of my pants!!  Had to keep going as my flight time was coming. finally it was ready. It sat on the ready line, covered by the tarp. The supporters insisted that I get under a small tent to stay dry prior to my flight. I accepted, but never told them I was already quite wet on my backside!! But I stayed dry. ::)

There are still plenty more of those B-17 stories, all seem funny now.....But then????

    This is the kind of stuff I always hope to see here on the forums. There needs to be a lot more of it!! I was fortunate to see the B-17 fly at the NATS where Kirk Mulinex has his Corsair and to say it was impressive is an understatement. I love the "war stories" whether it be the NATS, World Champs, or local contests. I attend vintage off road motorcycle racing events and attending the banquets alone to hear the stories from the greats who were there is worth the entry fees. It's the same with stuff like this. The combat guys had a good thing going with Riley Wooten there for a while and his retelling of combat history and I enjoyed the hell out of it and I don't fly combat!! There needs to be a pinned thread at each discipline section for this story telling and it will help preserve some history. 25 years from now, if any one is still flying stunt, no one may ever believe that there ever was a B-17 stunt model, let alone two!! There needs to be a record of it!
  Type at you later,
   Dan McEntee
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AMA 480405 (American Motorcyclist Association)

Offline Bruce Shipp

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #19 on: August 30, 2021, 03:55:58 PM »
Paul, most of us remember reading less McDonald’s “Stilleto Chronicles”10 years ago or so. I know I thoroughly enjoyed hearing the history of that airplane and Les’s journey to nationals wins and world championships. I was just a kid in school when he flew the stiletto it was very impressionable on me.

I know I speak for most of us when I say a “Fortress Chronicles”  series would be highly valued and a pleasure to read. I also appreciate tha committing these stories to writing is a daunting task. It would be a wonderful story. Thanks for sharing part of it with us today

Offline PJ Rowland

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #20 on: August 30, 2021, 05:31:39 PM »
Well I simply didnt trust my building ability to undertake a takeapart, instead I opted to buy a trailer and transport it to the field in one piece..

For me, the setup time was similar.
Needed to start prime and fire each engine first independent and then be ready to actually fly it shortly after that.

Because I ran 4 independent tanks I had slightly less complexity and the engine shutdown sequence was very repeatable. Fly the end of the pattern ,do 10 laps to draw all the fuel down to a minimum level, climb to 70deg hold it for maybe 1 lap and they ALL quit at once.

Its nice when you have people questioning the use of a automatic shutoff, but it didnt. I had at the Nats before the DQ I managed 6 flights with perfect shutdown..

When it didnt work flying on one motor for 4 laps at 15 second lap time aint fun..


I couldn't handle the amount of fuel it would use.. ALOT
1 liter for 4 flights..

Sorry Brett, I was simply referring to your experiences with the "pull" of flying Pauls B17.
If you always put limit on everything you do, physical or anything else. It will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them.” - Bruce Lee.

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 I Yearn for a world where chickens can cross the road without having their motives questioned.

Offline PJ Rowland

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #21 on: August 30, 2021, 05:49:32 PM »
He smiled broadly and said, "it's okay".
Talk about stoic


Can I second this statement?

There are many things that Paul is excellent at but this one is really underrated.

At the most recent Nats Paul came in 2nd by the smallest margin ive ever seen. I personally would have felt *bad* to have come so close, and I congratulated him and expressed that It must have been difficult to be so close.
He quickly told me the opposite,  a brilliant comp and had an amazing time!

Very. stoic in defeat..

2004 World Champs he crashes his number #1 plane in practice, and still managed to smile and make alot of people feel welcomed.


Alas this is a characteristic is one I seriously lack..
Perhaps Paul could write us all a trim flow chart on how to handle sh!+ hitting the fan !!

If you always put limit on everything you do, physical or anything else. It will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them.” - Bruce Lee.

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 I Yearn for a world where chickens can cross the road without having their motives questioned.

Online Brett Buck

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #22 on: August 30, 2021, 07:20:01 PM »
Sorry Brett, I was simply referring to your experiences with the "pull" of flying Pauls B17.

  That was pretty impressive, but, the standout characteristic was the control loading, which was astronomical. I managed it pretty well until the last corner of the hourglass, then I had a split-second panic when I realized I had topped out, and had to use my elbow.  Aside from that, the airplane flew very well and because it was in proper trim, easy-to-fly  and was perfectly capable of properly-sized maneuvers, which is more than I can say for most other airplanes I fly. The biggest concern was my feet slipping in the wet grass.

   *I* wouldn't have wanted to fly it in any sort of wind, although as long as you had enough muscle and shoes with cleats, it would otherwise be ideal - you sure aren't going to run out of line tension.

   However, whipping a 107 ounce, 6 foot wingspan airplane, with one 15 running at idle, lap after lap was about all I could manage. I was afraid to let it land because as soon at the tension went away, it could easily have ground-looped.

    I would tell you everyone should try it - but after watching them troubleshoot the regulators literally from sunup to sundown on that Saturday suggested otherwise. Now, of course, there is electric - which, as I mentioned at the time regarding the Lancaster, makes it a whole lot more likely to work, but arguably much less cool.

     Brett

Offline PJ Rowland

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Re: 2000 World Championships - Landres, France
« Reply #23 on: August 31, 2021, 06:04:16 PM »
Yes.. a bit too easy with electric..
Especially the 6 x !! Mic drop..

If you always put limit on everything you do, physical or anything else. It will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them.” - Bruce Lee.

...
 I Yearn for a world where chickens can cross the road without having their motives questioned.


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