Off topic. Help getting chemical analysis?

[Mark Mc]

As the topic says, I’m looking for a way to get a chemical analysis done.  When we moved into our new house a few months ago we bought a new Frigidaire refrigerator.  When I tried using the water/ice dispenser I found that my lips and tongue would itch and get a dry throat.  So I started just using a pitcher.  Last week I decided to replace the filter and try again.  I didn’t do this earlier as these stupid filters are $50 a piece.  No aftermarket items available, so I am at the mercy of Frigidaire.  So I ordered it and installed it on Tuesday night.  I flushed out four gallons to clear the lines.  Wednesday afternoon I tried a glass of ice water.  I didn’t notice anything at first, so I filled up a second glass.  But then, after I drank most of the second glass the itching started again.  When I picked up the glass to pour it out, I noticed a lot of white particulates that had settled on the bottom.  Not good.  I took the glass with the particulates back to the store I got the fridge from, and they’re sending someone out on Tuewday to look at it, but I don’t want to depend on them.  So…

It’s been three days and my tongue and lips still itch, so I want to send a sample out to be analyzed so I know what I’ve been ingesting.  I tried Home Depot and Lowe’s, but neither have any kind of sampling kit I can send off.  I’m not sure where to go from here, so I’m asking advice here and on a couple of other forums I frequent.  Anyone have any suggestions?

Mark

[Doug Moisuk]

You probably want a water testing lab. Your city state or province. Not sure where you live.

[Doug Moisuk]

You may want to see your doctor as well.

[Dave Hull]

Hmmm. Sorry to hear you are having troubles like that.

Around here, if you have a water well, there are places that you can send the samples. You would have to ask what kind of things they test for. The "at home" test kits vary, but generally test for pH, nitrates and a few other things.

I am a bit surprised that the new particle filter doesn't filter out visible particles in your latest "test." Unless they are continuing to precipitate out after going thru your filter. If so, it might be calcium or magnesium carbonates. Possibly. How hard is your water there?

Be careful....

Dave

[Carl Cisneros]

Mark

I just typed in drinking water testing (am in Virginia), and came up with
quite alot of results. From home kits to testing labs that annalyze the water sample
you send in.
check it out.

Carl Cisneros

[Kermit Payne]

Mark,

Try reaching out to your county's agricultural extension service.  They should be pretty good about recommending a trusted lab for water testing.

[Tim Wescott]

Make sure the lab knows what they're testing for -- if they're expecting well water they'll test for well water nasties, not necessarily weird industrial nasties.

[Arlan McKee]

Mark,
I sent you a PM with some contact Info for Waypoint Analytical. Then it occurred to me to ask if you are allergic to coconut. Many water filters are made of coconut husks and the symptoms of coconut allergy are pretty much what you are experiencing. Also, with a new house, you have a water feed that runs to your fridge that doesn't get a lot of flow to wash it clean. It takes forever for the funny taste to go away if the water lines in your house are cpvc. I would disconnect the fridge and flush 20 or 30 gallons through with the valve wide open. The ice maker and water dispenser don't allow for enough velocity to flush contaminants.

[Tom McClain]

As the topic says, I’m looking for a way to get a chemical analysis done.  When we moved into our new house a few months ago we bought a new Frigidaire refrigerator.  When I tried using the water/ice dispenser I found that my lips and tongue would itch and get a dry throat.  So I started just using a pitcher.  Last week I decided to replace the filter and try again.  I didn’t do this earlier as these stupid filters are $50 a piece.  No aftermarket items available, so I am at the mercy of Frigidaire.  So I ordered it and installed it on Tuesday night.  I flushed out four gallons to clear the lines.  Wednesday afternoon I tried a glass of ice water.  I didn’t notice anything at first, so I filled up a second glass.  But then, after I drank most of the second glass the itching started again.  When I picked up the glass to pour it out, I noticed a lot of white particulates that had settled on the bottom.  Not good.  I took the glass with the particulates back to the store I got the fridge from, and they’re sending someone out on Tuewday to look at it, but I don’t want to depend on them.  So…

It’s been three days and my tongue and lips still itch, so I want to send a sample out to be analyzed so I know what I’ve been ingesting.  I tried Home Depot and Lowe’s, but neither have any kind of sampling kit I can send off.  I’m not sure where to go from here, so I’m asking advice here and on a couple of other forums I frequent.  Anyone have any suggestions

Mark

I recommend you call the retailer you bought the Frigidaire from and demand they replace it.  Do not let them try to repair it. It is obviously contaminated. 

Or the water supply line to the refrigerator in the home may be contaminated too.

[Dan Berry]

I recommend you call the retailer you bought the Frigidaire from and demand they replace it.  Do not let them try to repair it. It is obviously contaminated. 

Or the water supply line to the refrigerator in the home may be contaminated too.

This

[Dave_Trible]

Mark,
I sent you a PM with some contact Info for Waypoint Analytical. Then it occurred to me to ask if you are allergic to coconut. Many water filters are made of coconut husks and the symptoms of coconut allergy are pretty much what you are experiencing. Also, with a new house, you have a water feed that runs to your fridge that doesn't get a lot of flow to wash it clean. It takes forever for the funny taste to go away if the water lines in your house are cpvc. I would disconnect the fridge and flush 20 or 30 gallons through with the valve wide open. The ice maker and water dispenser don't allow for enough velocity to flush contaminants.

This is very much what I'd say.  This was my business for 35 years-selling appliances-and these things were common remarks.  The plastics used in the fridge itself and the water supply lines running to them can give off tastes and odors for quite a while from being new or not being used much over time.  Another thing-the natural ground water system 'turns over' each year in the spring and fall.  if you go by some ponds or lakes you might see the water clear one day then brown or cloudy green the next day or week.  This dredges junk into the water supply and can change the flavor for a while until things settle.  Typically this is when the filters will plug up and need to be changed.  Lime or calcium deposits in the water lines and filters can also jar loose and cause problems including plugging up the very small inlet hole of the saddle valve where it connects to the water pipe under your sink or floor.   I'd just try flushing it all out best you can and see what happens.  Also try some water directly out of the tap and see if it is really much different.  Often we don't suspect that because we seldom drink water that way any more,  that isn't cooked or run through a coffee maker.

Dave

[Mark Mc]

Thanks for all the replies, Guys.

It is not a generic water supply issue.  The tap water from the other faucets do not have the particulate matter or the bad taste in them.  With all the hot dogs I eat, if it were generic, the particulates would concentrate in the pan when I boiled the water, and the hot dogs would taste terrible.  I'm a Hebrew National addict....

Also, after running partition tests, the particulates only come from the ice maker.  I emptied and cleaned out the ice maker tray prior to replacing the filter, but the particulate matter is still coming out in the ice so it is not just a cleanliness issue in the ice tray.

I do not have any coconut allergies, else I would have the same issues after a Mounds binge.  Since the refrigerator has been installed, at least 20-30 gallons have been run through the refrigerator water line, so it should not be residual in the line (also see that it's only the ice maker with the particulates).

I'll take the advice here and contact a good lab to get the sample looked at.

Mark

[Dave_Trible]

If it's just coming from the ice maker it could be the machine is grinding on itself someplace internally and making the chaff........

Dave

[Dan McEntee]

   Stop here, call the place where you bought it and demand a replacement, immediately if not sooner, or you will make two phone calls. One to your lawyer, and the next one to your Uncle Guido!
   Seriously, I would be making them take it back. Something is wrong with the ice maker, and the ice maker is part of the fridge. I wouldn't let them just "repair" it. Your health, your family's health and your spare time are too precious. Have it replaced  now.  You did your best, nothing worked, the store needs to make it right. Good luck with it
  Type at you later,
  Dan McEntee

[Chuck Matheny]

"New refrigerator dispensing bad tasting water...dispensing particulates in ice...etc"
If a mass produced appliance can malfunction like this once..it will most likely do it 100s of times.
Ask a lawyer if there is a data base where you can look up any pending legal action.
In the appliance world....I think some of the mechanical stuff  [like the ice maker section] can originate from a manufacturer from who knows where and then find it's way into several different brands of appliances.
Here is a look at what replacing just the ice maker entails....

Here's a look at servicing a different model.....

[Mark Mc]

One of the first things I did was a search for Frigidaire fridge recalls, and one popped up for ice maker replacement for a choking hazard.  Seems on some models the ice makers have a tendency to have parts break and choke you to death.  But my fridge is not listed in the recall.

[Arlan McKee]

What is the consistency of the particulate?
Can you rub it to dust or is it hard? Is it a single chunk or a tiny ball of strands?

[Mark Mc]

Well, an update.  The service tech came and looked at the fridge.  First he filled a glass of water and looked at it and there were no particulates.  Then he filled a glass with ice and put it in the microwave to melt it.  He said, "Hmmm.  It is a little cloudy."  I then pointed to the particles in the bottom of the glass.  He said, "Yeah, I see that.  I've never seen this before.  I'll have to talk to my boss tomorrow morning."  I told him when he did, the only recommendation I would go with is that he recommend the dealer replace the fridge.

Arlan, the particles look like undissolved salt granules.

[Dan McEntee]

Well, an update.  The service tech came and looked at the fridge.  First he filled a glass of water and looked at it and there were no particulates.  Then he filled a glass with ice and put it in the microwave to melt it.  He said, "Hmmm.  It is a little cloudy."  I then pointed to the particles in the bottom of the glass.  He said, "Yeah, I see that.  I've never seen this before.  I'll have to talk to my boss tomorrow morning."  I told him when he did, the only recommendation I would go with is that he recommend the dealer replace the fridge.

Arlan, the particles look like undissolved salt granules.

       As I'm re-reading your post from yesterday this morning, a thought just came to me. You mentioned the debris you are finding looks like undissolved salt? If the water supply goes through some sort of water softener or similar treatment before it comes out of the door, that may very well be what it is. I think you are still on the right path by replacing the fridge, but maybe if this debris is salt for water softening, it may be relatively harmless. If so you might get a little peace of mind from that, but it still should not be there, and now you have the knowledge from the service tech tp back you up. Keep us informed of the future results, if you don't mind.
  Type at you later,
   Dan McEntee

[Steve Helmick]

If you are still interested in a water testing lab, I'd call a farm supply store or a well drilling company.

The question also reminded me that at some time between 1970 and 1999, the place I worked (can't recall where) had an older gent come in regularly. He was the water testing guy at Rainier Brewery, and he said that they did the water testing for Seattle City Water. So, you might expand your search and ask at nearby craft breweries and brewing supply stores.  Steve

[Mark Mc]

Steve, I already have two labs lined up and getting sample containers to put the samples in.  Thanks for the advice.

Dan, if it were both the water dispenser and the ice dispenser I'd consider the softener, but since it's only the ice portion, I'm dismissing that.  Maybe I'm foolish for dismissing it early, but there you go.  Also, the itching of my lips and tongue lasted six days, so it's not a normal filter issue, I'd imagine.

Mark

[GallopingGhostler]

We had a premium Kenmore Elite (Whirlpool) refrigerator 22 years ago. It had an automatic ice maker, was dual vertical door (left freezer, right frig.). During warranty, the ice maker went bad, repair man visited the house, replaced unit, so they fixed for free.

Warranty expired, don't remember if one year or what. Ice maker went bad again. Ordered crusher motor unit on-line, then replaced.

Then the condenser fan motor went bad. Fortunately I had a window unit ventilation fan (sits in window opening with lower pane up to fit with panels to close off sides), sat it in back to flow air continuously over the condenser coil section, ordered a new motor on-line. Installed it, fixed problem.

Then upper temperature control damper motor for frig. (routes cold air from freezer to cool frig.) went bad. Moved vane part way open to cause frig. to stay cold. Ordered part, replaced when came in. After, lower damper motor unit went bad. Did the same.

After we had the frig. for about 5 years, then got rid of it. Next 2 refrigerators we got don't have ice maker, nor all the auto goodies. They still worked. Donated the one when we got another, slightly bigger. Since, have not had to fix anything.

If we want ice, we do it the old way, use ice cube trays in the freezer. 

Then don't get me started on the Maytag Neptune I washer we bought 22 years ago. (This was the one that was so faulty, bankrupted Maytag, now a Whirlpool Division brand.) When it went bad for the 3rd time, took it to the city dump. Just as I arrived to push it off my truck tailgate, a children's home worker had 3, same model in his pickup, he was dumping, so I didn't feel so bad.

Went to Home Depot and for $275 back in 2009, bought a standard non-energy non-water efficient washer, which we kept for 11 years. Worked day in and out without problems. Temperature control valve was starting to give problems (we have very hard - high mineral water.) Bought a new valve on-line and was working fine again. Later donated it to a charity whose 20 year washer finally quit, now have a Samsung.

Bottom line. So Mark, my solution was simply to not buy an icemaker refrigerator, since have been a happy camper. 

[Mark Mc]

Bottom line. So Mark, my solution was simply to not buy an icemaker refrigerator, since have been a happy camper. 

Being a happy camper for me is to let the wife have whatever fridge she wants.  If it keeps stuff cold, it's good enough for me.  Beyond that, she has her wants and needs for the fridge, so I let her pick the make and model.  She works and brings money home, so I don't mind if she wants what she wants.  She earned what she wants, just like I earned my airplane wants.  I'm even happy to get her what he wants.  I see plenty of couples that argue all the time.  We haven't had a real argument in 23 years.

*besides, when I drink the water and don't feel well, it's her fault for picking this fridge...   

[GallopingGhostler]

She earned what she wants, just like I earned my airplane wants.  I'm even happy to get her what she wants.  I see plenty of couples that argue all the time.  We haven't had a real argument in 23 years. *besides, when I drink the water and don't feel well, it's her fault for picking this fridge...   

How many men have ever won an argument with their wives? Or, if they won, did they really win?

[Steve Helmick]

My fishing buddy had a matched set of Samsung washer/dryer. The water pump went out on the washer, and no spares were available anywhere, because they'd made a bad design and all the faulty spares were used to replace other faulty pumps. They said it'd be 7-8 months before the new design was in production, so he took both the washer and dryer to the dump and bought another brand...not sure what.

One thing I've found is that the place I go for appliance parts usually has every part I could want for any machine I've needed to repair. But if you get a repair serviceman to come and fix whatever it is, they won't be able to get the parts for at least a week, because they only get parts from someplace else, and will NOT get the parts from the local place that actually has them. How fubar is that?    Steve

[GallopingGhostler]

One thing I've found is that the place I go for appliance parts usually has every part I could want for any machine I've needed to repair. But if you get a repair serviceman to come and fix whatever it is, they won't be able to get the parts for at least a week, because they only get parts from someplace else, and will NOT get the parts from the local place that actually has them. How fubar is that?

If a local mom & pop outfit, they can buy parts anywhere, but if by a particular chain or regional dealership, they probably have their own channel sources they are corporately limited to, especially if for warranty repairs. The local repairman has no say, only does.

We now see less and less mom & pop outfits who valued their customers, unfortunately, seems everything now is done through major corporations.